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Old 01-13-2018, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, WA
8,185 posts, read 16,597,446 times
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In this thread I would like to hear from those with experience or knowledge of school? What are some of the pros and cons? For example, I've heard its more of commuter campus which is actually fine since that is really what we're looking for anyway. How about the quality of the education? As a satellite campus, how does it compare with the main Pullman campus besides the area itself and its smaller size? Is it more well known for certain areas of study? Are there some which would be better to take somewhere else?

We are beginning to explore colleges throughout the state including the Vancouver area. With three kids soon to be in college we are looking to move to areas within commute distances to a decent university. We also do not want to live near Seattle. Vancouver is a strong contender because of all the positive aspects of the location near things we enjoy including family nearby.

Thank you,

Derek
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Seattle Eastside
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Quote:
With three kids soon to be in college we are looking to move to areas within commute distances to a decent university. We also do not want to live near Seattle.
WSU is not going to have nearly the choices at a satellite campus. That said I've never met anyone who didn't appreciate a smaller college and many people who hate the Greek system but love the university's culture would probably appreciate WSUV.

Washington State is a small state, with 7 million residents total. 2 million of those live in the greater Seattle area.

If you want to have a good choice of schools outside of the Seattle area, your best bet is Eastern Washington to be near Spokane, where you have slightly longer drives for a lot of choice (with an "X" for Christian private schools and a "P" for secular private schools)

Whitman (X), Whitworth (X), Gonzaga (X), WSU (in Pullman) and CWU (in Ellensburg, really cute town).

Tacoma has PLU and UPS, both really nice private colleges, plus UW Tacoma.

That said, COL is not huge in Eastern Washington. If you were to live in Vancouver and the kids were to rent a room or a bed in Pullman or Ellensburg, it would still probably be less than going to UW even living at home because of the reduced COL and reduced tuition. Might be fun for them as well.

It's the city living in Seattle that really takes a hit. We calculated that it would be economically up to 20% cheaper for our kids to rent rooms and to rent our rooms to other kids (we live in Bellevue not far from a bus line), than for our kids to go to UW Seattle. How depressing is that!
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, WA
8,185 posts, read 16,597,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neerwhal View Post
WSU is not going to have nearly the choices at a satellite campus. That said I've never met anyone who didn't appreciate a smaller college and many people who hate the Greek system but love the university's culture would probably appreciate WSUV.

Washington State is a small state, with 7 million residents total. 2 million of those live in the greater Seattle area.

If you want to have a good choice of schools outside of the Seattle area, your best bet is Eastern Washington to be near Spokane, where you have slightly longer drives for a lot of choice (with an "X" for Christian private schools and a "P" for secular private schools)

Whitman (X), Whitworth (X), Gonzaga (X), WSU (in Pullman) and CWU (in Ellensburg, really cute town).

Tacoma has PLU and UPS, both really nice private colleges, plus UW Tacoma.

That said, COL is not huge in Eastern Washington. If you were to live in Vancouver and the kids were to rent a room or a bed in Pullman or Ellensburg, it would still probably be less than going to UW even living at home because of the reduced COL and reduced tuition. Might be fun for them as well.

It's the city living in Seattle that really takes a hit. We calculated that it would be economically up to 20% cheaper for our kids to rent rooms and to rent our rooms to other kids (we live in Bellevue not far from a bus line), than for our kids to go to UW Seattle. How depressing is that!
Neerwhal,

That is depressing in terms of costs and one reason we prefer living outside Seattle.

Yes, a smaller campus is a big plus for our kids, that's something we don't get much at all in CA with most of our public schools impacted. I have looked at the majors available at WSU-V and they do seem to have what we're looking for. We definitely do not want the Greek culture scene. So as long as they have the major, lets say computer science, how much better or worse might it be in Vancouver? Or is there not much of a difference in terms of academics, generally speaking? Obviously the larger campus has other perks like more activities, specialties, etc...

We do want to live in Western WA. Though I will look into our kids potentially living on campus in Eastern WA. I know its much cheaper than where we live in CA! This college stuff really adds up for the parents. We want to live near at least one decent U to give our kids that option. Vancouver also has another good private U just across the bridge - University of Portland.

Regarding Tacoma and Olympia, yes, that is another general area in the running. As you mentioned UW Tacoma is there. Any idea how it compares with the main campus in terms of academics? Also, St. Martin’s U in Lacey looks like a good private U.

Thanks,

Derek
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Old 01-14-2018, 10:40 AM
 
Location: WA
5,341 posts, read 7,614,251 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MtnSurfer View Post
In this thread I would like to hear from those with experience or knowledge of school? What are some of the pros and cons? For example, I've heard its more of commuter campus which is actually fine since that is really what we're looking for anyway. How about the quality of the education? As a satellite campus, how does it compare with the main Pullman campus besides the area itself and its smaller size? Is it more well known for certain areas of study? Are there some which would be better to take somewhere else?

We are beginning to explore colleges throughout the state including the Vancouver area. With three kids soon to be in college we are looking to move to areas within commute distances to a decent university. We also do not want to live near Seattle. Vancouver is a strong contender because of all the positive aspects of the location near things we enjoy including family nearby.

Thank you,

Derek

I don't have direct experience with WSU-Vancouver but I visited it with my daughter and looked around. It is a new campus sitting on a hill in a suburban residential area in the very north edge of the Vancouver metro area. There is a huge amount of open space around the core of buildings that has been constructed to date so it appears that they have planned to be able to accommodate decades of future expansion as the region grows. The campus is nice and modern but at this point resembles a small community college more than a university. It is also a commuter campus. I don't think there is any on-campus housing and I don't think there are any apartments within walking distance, at least not close walking distance. Honestly I think WSU-Vancouver is kind of off the radar here in Washington for students who aren't already living in the area. The branch campuses of UW in Tacoma and Bothell have gotten a LOT more attention and money.

Here in WA you basically have 2 flagship universities, UW in Seattle and WSU in Pullman. Those two are going to get the lions share of money and attention. They also have by far the biggest alumni networks and such.

Then you have 3 regional universities that all started as teachers colleges. Western Washington in Bellingham is probably the most popular and largest. It has a very liberal reputation and is popular with Puget Sound area kids who don't get into UW. Central Washington in Ellensburg has become the go-to university for Hispanic kids and is located in the Yakima Valley which is the largest Hispanic area in Washington. They focus a lot of programs and effort on recruting first generation Hispanic college students and make that their mission to some extent. Eastern Washington is more or less suburban Spokane. It's about 20 minutes from downtown Spokane so draws mostly Spokane area students and others from the eastern half of WA state.

Then you have Evergreen State College in Olympia which is a 1960s era alternative university that is much smaller than the others. And then branch campuses of UW and WSU are located in Vancouver, Tacoma, Bothell, Everett, Spokane, and the Tri Cities. I'm probably missing some.

There are no MAJOR private research universities in the Pacific Northwest on the scale of those elsewhere like USC, Stanford, Notre Dame, Baylor, Vanderbilt, Miami, Pitt, etc. What there are is a bunch of small private colleges, some of which might call themselves universities, but really aren't. Pacific Lutheran, Whitworth University, University of Puget Sound, Seattle Pacific University, and so forth. Then there are several smaller Catholic universities: Gonzaga, Seattle University, and University of Portland. They are in the 5,000 to 7,000 student range but none of them are major research universities.

Honestly the Vancouver area is pretty lacking if you are looking for public higher education. There are several good private colleges across the river in Portland as well as Portland State University. But Vancouver itself is pretty underserved with 4-year higher education opportunities. If you don't want to live in Seattle or the greater Puget Sound region from Olympia to Bellingham then your best bet for nearby colleges would probably be Spokane. Spokane has Eastern Washington University nearby as well as Gonzaga and Whitworth and branch campus of EWU and WSU in downtown Spokane. Plus, Washington State is about 70 miles away.

Last edited by texasdiver; 01-14-2018 at 10:54 AM..
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Old 01-14-2018, 11:26 AM
 
Location: Vancouver, WA
8,185 posts, read 16,597,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texasdiver View Post
It is also a commuter campus. I don't think there is any on-campus housing and I don't think there are any apartments within walking distance, at least not close walking distance. Honestly I think WSU-Vancouver is kind of off the radar here in Washington for students who aren't already living in the area. The branch campuses of UW in Tacoma and Bothell have gotten a LOT more attention and money.
The more I read about those satellite campuses the more I've noticed that. For example, computer science, which my son is interested in seems to be exploding at both campuses. Although we're not looking for prestige for the name's sake, UW does seem to have the greatest recognition nationwide. Regardless of 'campus location' the degrees are all conferred from UW. And from what I've read the quality of instruction is still high following similar standards. CA has nothing like this notion of public satellite campuses. Our public flagships like UC Berkeley and UCLA are extremely difficult to get into, large and highly impacted for certain majors. The smaller UC schools are totally different universities like UC Merced.

Quote:
Here in WA you basically have 2 flagship universities, UW in Seattle and WSU in Pullman. Those two are going to get the lions share of money and attention. They also have by far the biggest alumni networks and such.

Honestly the Vancouver area is pretty lacking if you are looking for public higher education. There are several good private colleges across the river in Portland as well as Portland State University. But Vancouver itself is pretty underserved with 4-year higher education opportunities.
It sounds like WSU-Vancouver is trying to change that undersevered aspect. It may still be a work in progress. I'd still like to hear from some who have attended. I guess that may be a relatively small population. Its too bad UW doesn't have a campus further south as well. It sounds like Vancouver families are looking elsewhere within the state or across the bridge.

These are the three Western WA areas we are considering with no plans for Eastern WA:

I. Vancouver - WSU-Vancouver with some Portland options (though no in-state tuition).

II. Olympia/Tacoma area - UW Tacoma and some private schools. We're not interested in Evergreen due to extreme political agenda and associated drama.

III. Everett area - within commute distance to UW Bothell and also WSU Everett. It appears the state is really building up WSU Everett. Here one recent article on it: Ribbon-cutting ceremony set for WSU building in north Everett | HeraldNet.com

Derek

Last edited by MtnSurfer; 01-14-2018 at 11:43 AM..
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:42 PM
 
Location: WA
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I've met young people that have gone to school at several different campuses in both Washington and Oregon. 90% of the differences in their education I can isolate to the individuals, not the campus. I would not hesitate to send my children to WU Vancouver.
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Old 01-15-2018, 02:08 AM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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I had one kid attend WSU-V. He was very outgoing, engaged, but underserved for his major / learnings - largely due to limited offerings and some really crummy Profs (and no recourse / alternative profs cuz of limited size and offerings). I wish he would have done UP as he desired... but he didn't want to fund it (Which he could have probably got aid to match WSU-V tuition (no-aid). He is more wishful than I (Suffering wage / career caps, so is pursuing higher degrees through better U's). He has succeeded very well in spite of the WSU-V handicap (He did just miss a great job offer (in Seattle) that would have been a 'shoe-in' had he been a UW grad. He (and I) feel his $$ and time were very poorly spent at WSU-V.

Schedule / time to graduate is likely apt to prolong your degree program (missing profs or offerings)
(I have friends who are adjuncts at WSU-v, and I have also worked with programs there (as instructor aid to technology) I have been very disappointed with the contributions from a couple recent WSU-V grads that were hired in a group of 10+ engineering students (Most from Eastern USA technical U's)

WSU - V will come of age, and works well for those who MUST stay in the area (by need) and are able to prolong their studies to meet school offerings.

WWU served another child VERY well - excellent profs and full program and GREAT connections. (and learning environment, and post grad support + great friendship / relationships of alumni and classmates.)

UW has worked for many peers, but is very 'typical' HUGE school with minimal personality / flexibility / individualized attention and even less help in placement / connections. The PLUS... is IF you find a loyal Alumni employer (who will hire none BUT UW grads. )

There are many GREAT Portland U offerings. (many schools to choose... PSU, UP, Concordia, Warner Pacific, Multnomah, George Fox Portland, Linfield Portland, Reed, Lewis and Clark, Art Institute, Culinary, OHSU, Portland Seminary, Western... + many privates.

CA has many more GREAT colleges and U's, than WA and OR combined.

Several WA friends sent their kids to BC schools. +/-, but generally quite good.
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Old 01-15-2018, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, WA
8,185 posts, read 16,597,446 times
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StealthRabbit, this definitely gives me pause for thought when considering WSU-V. Thanks for sharing your experiences.

I have a few of follow-up questions if you don't mind. Do you think that his overall experience would have been much better at the main Pullman campus? When you mention suffering the wage /career gap, do you think that has more to do with WSU's perception in general or more specifically the WSU-V campus? From what I understand regarding satellite campuses, they do not indicate satellite or main campus on their degrees. For example, a degree from UW Bothell or UW Tacoma is given the 'same' UW degree designation. I thought it was the same for WSU satellites as well.

What do you think would have been better for him had he attended UP, for example? We are considering that school as well as other privates. Though the sticker shock and overall cost is a deterant. I guess it depends on how generous those schools will be with scholarships.

Do you think this experience has anything to do with his specific major, perhaps? When you say he missed a job he would have been a shoe in for as a UW grad, is that because the company prefers UW over other schools? Or is WSU simply considered lower rung to others in this field, perhaps?

We are also looking at the OR privates and have friends whose daughter is attending George Fox currently. She speaks very highly of her experiences there. They were also very generous with scholarships. UP looks very good as well.

While we do have some great schools, CA unfortunately is very expensive when compared with other states. Our private schools are not as generous with scholarships. In addition, most of our really good publics are huge and heavily impacted like UC Berkeley, UCLA, Cal Poly San Luis Obispo, etc... So it takes students longer to graduate thus delaying their chance to go to work while incurring greater expense.

Derek

Last edited by MtnSurfer; 01-15-2018 at 04:06 PM..
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:22 PM
 
Location: WA
5,341 posts, read 7,614,251 times
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Having advised hundreds of HS kids over the years as a teacher I can tell you that people go to college for basically three reasons:

1. To earn a specific credential that is required for employment: Teaching certificate, nursing license, CPA, etc. In many cases the specific college you attend is fairly irrelevant to the job search if you have the right credentials and experience/internship. This is most certainly the case with teaching and I think nursing. Most principals are only going to glance at the specific undergrad institution a candidate went to and look much much harder at the supervisor evaluations and recommendations from the student teaching. A candidate from Harvard or Stanford isn't necessarily going to gain any advantage over one from say Central Washington and may actually be looked at somewhat sideways...like what are you doing here? I sense it is much the same in many allied health fields like nursing.

2. To earn a pedigree. Many high-status jobs are more about the pedigree than specific learning or degree. Wall Street finance jobs are like this. Many academic jobs as well. And to some extent the very high end tech jobs. You need to have attended one of the Ivies or Stanford. Or, more correctly, one of the big three (Harvard, Yale, Princeton) plus Stanford. If you want to work for Goldman Sachs don't bother to apply unless you attended one of those four. Same for the big hedge funds and venture capital firms. If you want a tenure track teaching job in the liberal arts you had better attend one of a very few elite colleges. Because your competition for sure will be. At a lower level, this is why students join fraternities and sororities, especially in the south. For the connections and pedigree. It will open doors in the future. To some extent that is one reason to attend UW in Seattle. The city of Seattle is filled with UW grads in all kind of high level positions in business and government and they are always happy to hire another Husky. And believe me, going to UW-Bothell or UW-Tacoma is most definitely NOT the same thing.

3. To learn a specific field. If your kid wants to study Oceanography then you send them to UW or Oregon State or UC San Diego or Humboldt State. You don't send them to UW-Vancouver or WSU or the Gonzaga. If your kid wants to study aerospace engineering then you send them to UW and not Central Washington. If your kid wants to study agronomy or agricultural economics then you send them to WSU. That's just the way it is.

If you are trying to evaluate the adequacy of a place like WSU-Vancouver then you REALLY need to consider what path of study your kid is interested in and whether it is adequate for that purpose.
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, WA
8,185 posts, read 16,597,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texasdiver View Post
Having advised hundreds of HS kids over the years as a teacher I can tell you that people go to college for basically three reasons:

1. To earn a specific credential that is required for employment.

2. To earn a pedigree.

3. To learn a specific field.

If you are trying to evaluate the adequacy of a place like WSU-Vancouver then you REALLY need to consider what path of study your kid is interested in and whether it is adequate for that purpose.
Well, the goods news for us is that they have no interest in earning a pedigree or jobs mentioned which rely upon that. So the need for the name for it's name sake isn't a high priority at all.

They will probably go with 1 or 3. Of course, the youngest are still unsure of exact areas. They know more of what they don't want at this stage. Of course even kids who 'think' they know what they want to do can could change majors once they gain more life experience. Or they may double major. Changing majors is a very common thing and can actually be healthy if they find a better fit.

I currently work in the tech industry for a fortune 500 co and perform hiring among other things. For our engineers, we do not weight 'pedigree' highly at all. So in a way, it falls between your 1 and 3. Many are highly educationed in their field of study. Yet we look more at the individual, their drive and most importantly what they've done above and beyond their school work. I know many other top tech companies are changing their hiring practices and previous biases which favored certain schools. Google is a good example of this. Here's Google's head of HR discussing that shift: Google doesn't care where you went to college!

So in these cases when hiring a software engineer, cyber security engineer, network engineer, systems engineer, data scientist, etc... WSU vs UW vs some private school isn't important. What is important is to perform internships or other relevant work while in school. I think there many, many other professions like this where experience is king and the degree is more of a formality or bare minimum check box. The medical field is like this for the vast majority of positions as well (PT, OT, Nursing, Speech, Rad Tech, Chiropractic, etc...). The degree is required to get licensed. Beyond that its up to the individual to make a name for himself/herself.

Derek

Last edited by MtnSurfer; 01-15-2018 at 08:14 PM..
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