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Thanks, DaniellaG. Someone else said it is school of choice in that area so we should be able to choose, but that might only work if it is TO vs Westlake High in terms of location and driving distance from our home. But that is pretty far away at this point as our girls are only in elementary.
One of the things we are concerned about is ending up in another sleepy, boring suburban area with older parents who aren't anything like us. Each time we have stayed in TO for the weekend, that is what we have seen. That is what we have now and are trying to get away from. Not sure if this will translate properly, but we feel like the area where we live is asexual. The people are so dull and boring. No one seems to have any passion or lust for life. They are content in their boring lives.
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T.O./Westlake does have a (somewhat) sleepy suburban feel, but the influence of LA is prevalent. Many people that live here commute down to LA and live here so their children can go to school in T.O. You will find less entertainment industry type folks here as well.
What nightlysparrow suggested was very informative if those cultural elements are a major priority, mostly just mid century Ranch homes around here, with a speckling of more modern McMansions and apartments.
One of the things we are concerned about is ending up in another sleepy, boring suburban area with older parents who aren't anything like us. Each time we have stayed in TO for the weekend, that is what we have seen. That is what we have now and are trying to get away from. Not sure if this will translate properly, but we feel like the area where we live is asexual. The people are so dull and boring. No one seems to have any passion or lust for life. They are content in their boring lives.[/quote]
JayneTarzana, aside from your relationship with each other and enjoying your wonderful daughters. what do you and your DH do that gives you your passion and lust for life, and makes your lives non-boring? The answer to that might help with giving you suggestions as to where to live.
As for "older parents," I think you might have a hard time finding an area/neighborhood where there will be lots of parents your age, other than those that have just had, or are about to have, their first child. I know one mother who became pregnant in high school and became a teenage mother, but by far, most of the mothers I know here in So Cal (including co-workers and neighbors) did not start their families until their mid-to-late thirties, or even their early forties. Don't know if it is because many couples want to save up the down payment for an abode of their own before they start a family; because coastal CA is such an expensive place to live in general; because lots of couples want to make progress in their careers and/or travel the world before they start their families; because there are too many fun things to do in So Cal, or because of what sometimes seems to be the epidemic infertility problem (probably some combination thereof). You may prove me wrong, but my guess is if you want to live amongst other couples your age(s) who are at the same parenting stage as you are, you might need to move to a different part of the country, where, since you are not fond of the weather in the Bay Area, I am sure you would not like the weather (nor the conservative culture) -- places like Kansas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Texas, etc., where housing is (generally) much, much cheaper and where the cultural norm seems to be that people start their families at a much younger age than many of us in So Cal -- just my purely unscientific observation from having spent most of my life here in So Cal, but also having (painfully!) spent several of my childhood years in that part of the country, and still having family there.
I would be surprised if you could find a 3bed/2bath house (or townhome with a yard) for under $750,000 in most of the westside cities/areas that were mentioned above (some you definitely won't find such a place!), and, unless you got extremely lucky, I would think there is a good chance that if you did find one, you would not be comfortable with it from a safety aspect, whether perceived or actual, as well as from a school aspect, given some of your posts here and in other threads...
Thanks so much for your post, AyeScotland. I appreciate that you have taken the time to read my thread and respond thoughtfully.
I realize that I probably make it sound like we are young parents, but we are in our late 30's and our oldest is 9 which is young compared to what we tend to find in affluent areas. Most of the parents here are in their late 40's or 50's and that makes quite a difference. They have had 10+ more years to establish themselves and are in a different financial situation than we are. Only being able to afford a home that costs three quarters of a million dollars makes us the poor people here.
The passion and lust for life that I mention takes a little longer to describe. After over two decades together, DH and I are still very much in love and attracted to one another. It is difficult to imagine the people around here being intimate with one another as the married couples seem more like platonic friends. I am a ballroom dancer and that falls so far out of the realm of anything anyone here can imagine doing so it has been next to impossible to find anyone with like interests. We aren't the people who settle on anything because it is easy or familiar. We are not afraid of change even though it can be painful. We would rather seek the best possible life for ourselves and our children. By contrast, so many people seem to choose what is good enough even though they would most likely find a better fit if they were willing to work at it. There is a general resignation among many adults that this is the life they have and they might as well accept it. We are not part of that consensus.
We are of the opinion that children should be allowed to be children some of the time. With increasing education demands, our preference is to have as much unscheduled time as possible where they do what they want to do rather than dragging them from one sport of activity to another. That is not how people do things around here (and it seems most affluent areas). Life revolves around swim team and belonging to an expensive swim club around here. We have no interest in giving our lives over to that. Our girls enjoy swimming in a pool as much as the next kid, but they also enjoy doing other things like going to the beach (which is why we find ourselves in SoCal so often), hiking, riding bikes/scooters, playing at parks and finding creative ways to pass the time with one another as playmates.
When you say "you would not be comfortable with it from a safety aspect, whether perceived or actual, as well as from a school aspect, given some of your posts here and in other threads...", I suspect you are probably spot on with that assessment. Safety, education and air quality are paramount. I guess I was just hoping that we might find an area that meets that criteria and isn't suburban boring.
T.O./Westlake does have a (somewhat) sleepy suburban feel, but the influence of LA is prevalent. Many people that live here commute down to LA and live here so their children can go to school in T.O. You will find less entertainment industry type folks here as well.
Posters are telling me that the commute from TO to LA is not doable. Are there really a large amount of people who do it? I find the entertainment industry aspect of LA to be one of most exciting things about it.
Without Traffic it takes around 25 minutes to get to Hollywood and around 30~35 to get to Downtown LA. Commuting to work in LA is made difficult by traffic, but commuting to LA for entertainment works well since you're typically driving in non-peak hours.
Los Angeles is large and the city limits are just around 10 miles from Thousand Oaks so how horrendous the commute is depends on the particular location in LA. The commute would range from pleasant to horrendous where most areas would be somewhere in the middle.
Personally I don't like to commute at all so if I was going to work in LA I would live within 5~10 miles of work. But one of the nice things about Thousand Oaks (or the Conejo Valley in general) is that the area itself is safe and quiet but all the entertainment hot spots of LA are only 30~40 minutes away on the weekend/at night. So you get, I think, the best of both worlds.
DH has applied for jobs in TO, Santa Monica, Sherman Oaks, Burbank and Glendale. This is why I kept Agoura Hills and Calabasas on the list, but we didn't love either of those places when we drove around to check them out.
but commuting to LA for entertainment works well since you're typically driving in non-peak hours.
Not sure how user_id defines "non-peak" hours, but, jaynetarzana, as I mentioned on your Ventura vs OC thread, several times in the last year, as I have been making the drive home from Santa Barbara, I have hit a wall of traffic at the Thousand Oaks point (either dead standstill or barely inching along) at around 4, 5. 6. on a Saturday, which, if you were going to LA/West LA for dinner or a show, would probably be about the time you would be getting on the freeway. Not my idea of a good time, but perhaps you and your DH might not mind, or at least be willing to put up with it, for the opportunity to have fun in LA/West LA occasionally.
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The passion and lust for life that I mention takes a little longer to describe. After over two decades together, DH and I are still very much in love and attracted to one another. It is difficult to imagine the people around here being intimate with one another as the married couples seem more like platonic friends. I am a ballroom dancer and that falls so far out of the realm of anything anyone here can imagine doing so it has been next to impossible to find anyone with like interests. We aren't the people who settle on anything because it is easy or familiar. We are not afraid of change even though it can be painful. We would rather seek the best possible life for ourselves and our children. By contrast, so many people seem to choose what is good enough even though they would most likely find a better fit if they were willing to work at it. There is a general resignation among many adults that this is the life they have and they might as well accept it. We are not part of that consensus.
Unfortunately, jaynetarzana, I think that you and your DH are in the minority when it comes to marriage -- you sound like one of the lucky few couples who truly partnered up well (again, based on my strictly unscientific observations!). The only way I can think of that you could avoid being surrounded by what I will call "platonically married" neighbors, would be if you created your own neighborhood of like-married couples (if that makes sense!). With that in mind, have you ever considered trying to start a co-housing community? It would probably be one of, if not the, more unusual common attributes around which to build a co-housing community, but perhaps it could be done (and as an organizer, you could have some control over who gets accepted into the community -- you could check out prospective members of the community at a potluck or some other social event, which would give you a chance to observe each couple's interaction with their partner.) As to how to recruit prospective members, I imagine there is probably a co-housing web site that includes a forum for people to ask questions, recruit members, etc. (Also, I may be misremembering, but it seems like there is/was a couple who live/lived in the Bay Area (I want to say Berkeley or Oakland) whose mission was to help couples retain (or rekindle) the passion in their relationship -- perhaps there are community groups that have been formed to help people put into practice what they learned from this couple -- could be a source to recruit for your co-housing community, as well as something you might want to join for the like-married camaraderie.
Not sure how user_id defines "non-peak" hours, but, jaynetarzana, as I mentioned on your Ventura vs OC thread, several times in the last year, as I have been making the drive home from Santa Barbara, I have hit a wall of traffic at the Thousand Oaks point (either dead standstill or barely inching along) at around 4, 5. 6. on a Saturday, which, if you were going to LA/West LA for dinner or a show, would probably be about the time you would be getting on the freeway.
The sort of traffic you're describing is uncommon in the Thousand Oaks area and is usually the result of an accident but you do get some holiday and vocation related traffic since people use the 101 to get out of Los Angeles. This traffic is mostly an issue if you're traveling north and tends to start a bit after the 23. I frequently drive to Hollywood, Downtown, etc over the weekend and I never experience traffic in the Conejo Valley but on Saturdays there is sometimes traffic in the San Fernando Valley between 11~4 or so between de soto and the 405 intersection. This traffic usually adds 5~10 minutes to your drive.
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The answer to that might help with giving you suggestions as to where to live.
