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Old 12-16-2010, 12:06 AM
 
4 posts, read 8,667 times
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Ok, basically im wanting to know what my options are. I live in a area with a good amount of crime and alot of things lately have involved criminals with guns. I was convicted in 2003 of a Federal Felony (False statement to a federal firearms dealer). i purchased a weapon for someone that was not 21. It resulted in 6 months of house arrest and 6 months of probation.

I have not been in any sort of trouble since then. However, due to the felony I can never own a firearm. I feel that I should be able to at least own one for home defense as I have a 5 year old son and want nothing to happen to him or my girlfriend. If a criminal breaks in then there is nothing I can do to defend my family if he is armed.

Even if my girlfriend could own a weapon and keep it locked up id feel better but I am also aware I can go to jail because they consider it as a weapon I have access to. I cant get my rights restored because congress wont fund the program through the ATF that handles it. Only corporations are eligible for it.

The only other option for me is a presidential pardon which the chances of that happening are slim to none. Im hoping someone can help me here or at least provide some insight as far as what my options are. Can I fight it in court?. Is there anything at all I can do?. Any help will be greatly appreciated.
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Old 12-16-2010, 04:07 AM
 
Location: The Woods
16,936 posts, read 22,211,257 times
Reputation: 9020
Okay...um....people buy firearms for people under 21 all the time as gifts, etc. But this sounds like a straw purchase sort of thing. I assume we're talking a handgun here, right? Did this person under 21 go out and commit some crime with the gun or a crime even without that gun being used? And where in Vermont are you that it's that bad?

Your only options are non-cartridge firearms defined under federal law as "antique": namely, muzzleloading rifles/shotguns/pistols and cap and ball revolvers. Some modern inlines are defined as modern, and don't even possess a cartridge conversion cylinder for a revolver. Pre-1899 cartridge firearms are "antique" but you can't own a single cartridge for them anyways; each cartridge could get you a seperate criminal charge.

However, don't even think of having any such guns in MA, NY and several other well known anti-gun states; they have their own provisions barring you from having any gun, and I'm not ctually sure if FOPA would even protect you while going through those states...
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Old 12-16-2010, 09:35 AM
 
4 posts, read 8,667 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Okay...um....people buy firearms for people under 21 all the time as gifts, etc. But this sounds like a straw purchase sort of thing. I assume we're talking a handgun here, right? Did this person under 21 go out and commit some crime with the gun or a crime even without that gun being used? And where in Vermont are you that it's that bad?

Your only options are non-cartridge firearms defined under federal law as "antique": namely, muzzleloading rifles/shotguns/pistols and cap and ball revolvers. Some modern inlines are defined as modern, and don't even possess a cartridge conversion cylinder for a revolver. Pre-1899 cartridge firearms are "antique" but you can't own a single cartridge for them anyways; each cartridge could get you a seperate criminal charge.

However, don't even think of having any such guns in MA, NY and several other well known anti-gun states; they have their own provisions barring you from having any gun, and I'm not ctually sure if FOPA would even protect you while going through those states...
No crime was commited by the person. The weapon ended up getting stolen and I reported it to the ATF, among other agencies. It was never recovered and I was charged. They didnt care in the least about a stolen weapon floating around the streets.

Ive had police officers tell me the charge was BS and I should have just wrote up a bill of sale and let the guy handle it himself...If I had known this was going to be the outcome I would have.


As far as where I live, im north of Burlington and there has been many things here that you wouldnt normally expect. A guy was stabbed and robbed in St albans while walking on the railroad tracks, another stabbed and robbed on willard st in Burlington.....there was an armed robbery recently in Burlington where shots were fired....There have been many home invasions by armed criminals among other crimes in the past year. If you arent aware of these things and live in some sort of crime-free section of Vermont then please let me know. I want to move my family there.
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Old 12-16-2010, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Duluth, MN
520 posts, read 962,365 times
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What I'm gathering from your posts is that you were involved in a firearm purchase which required ATF paperwork and you falsified that paperwork in order to allow someone to purchase a gun who would have otherwise not been able to. Is that correct? I hate to say it, but while a lot of felonies can be easily forgiven, I don't think this one will be. Felonies involving firearms sales are not the kind that are looked at as "minor" ones, even if they end up being so when you get down to the nuts and bolts of the issue.

If the ultimate concern is safety, the best option would be work on crook-proofing your house. Any municipal law enforcement agency will be able to provide tips on how to make you/your property more of a "hard target" as far as would-be criminals go. After that, check out some non-firearm methods of self defense, like OC spray; it's actually easier to use than a handgun, can be used by just about anyone with little or no training, and can be just as effective in protecting yourself. Firearms are just tools, and when it comes to self-defense, there are a lot of other tools out there which can do the job just as well.

While moving isn't the easiest or cheapest option, it's still probably the most effective one. If all else fails, I'd take that option since it's always easier to avoid trouble than to meet it.
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Old 12-16-2010, 03:14 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,936 posts, read 22,211,257 times
Reputation: 9020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_1980 View Post
No crime was commited by the person. The weapon ended up getting stolen and I reported it to the ATF, among other agencies. It was never recovered and I was charged. They didnt care in the least about a stolen weapon floating around the streets.

Ive had police officers tell me the charge was BS and I should have just wrote up a bill of sale and let the guy handle it himself...If I had known this was going to be the outcome I would have.


As far as where I live, im north of Burlington and there has been many things here that you wouldnt normally expect. A guy was stabbed and robbed in St albans while walking on the railroad tracks, another stabbed and robbed on willard st in Burlington.....there was an armed robbery recently in Burlington where shots were fired....There have been many home invasions by armed criminals among other crimes in the past year. If you arent aware of these things and live in some sort of crime-free section of Vermont then please let me know. I want to move my family there.
You never should have done the straw purchase...but why did you report it when it was no longer in your hands? That doesn't make any sense to me...and why to the ATF instead of the local cops?

I never said anywhere in VT is crime-free, but be realistic: I carry a gun all the time, and all I've used it on has been rabid animals and I've taken some small game with my handguns. Sure, that can change without warning, but this isn't Chicago or DC. You do have the one option I mentioned above.
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Old 12-16-2010, 06:43 PM
 
20 posts, read 91,187 times
Reputation: 27
So let me get this straight: You falsified/lied to get a handgun for someone who wasn't legally allowed to buy one. That gun was subsequently "stolen" and you were charged and convicted of a felony. Now you're whining that some big bad guy with a gun (maybe even the very one you illegally purchased!!) might break in and the law won't let you have a gun to "defend" yourself with.

Gee, I can't imagine where this is headed...
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:12 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,936 posts, read 22,211,257 times
Reputation: 9020
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarCii View Post
So let me get this straight: You falsified/lied to get a handgun for someone who wasn't legally allowed to buy one. That gun was subsequently "stolen" and you were charged and convicted of a felony. Now you're whining that some big bad guy with a gun (maybe even the very one you illegally purchased!!) might break in and the law won't let you have a gun to "defend" yourself with.

Gee, I can't imagine where this is headed...
The "no handgun under 21" law is blatantly unconstitutional and challenges are in the works against the law.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:38 PM
 
20 posts, read 91,187 times
Reputation: 27
Why is it unconstitutional? The law sets minimum ages for anything that could be dangerous or threaten the lives of others, i.e. sale and consumption of alcohol, operation of motor vehicles, even voting. Why should guns be different?
And that's irrelevant anyway...the law as it is now, or as it was when the act was committed, is what's important. He broke the existing law. He was prosecuted and convicted.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:59 PM
 
4 posts, read 8,667 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarCii View Post
So let me get this straight: You falsified/lied to get a handgun for someone who wasn't legally allowed to buy one. That gun was subsequently "stolen" and you were charged and convicted of a felony. Now you're whining that some big bad guy with a gun (maybe even the very one you illegally purchased!!) might break in and the law won't let you have a gun to "defend" yourself with.

Gee, I can't imagine where this is headed...
You can buy a handgun and NEVER have to register it at the age of 18 (Private sale) but you have to wait until your 21 to buy one in a way where the government knows who owns it......sounds a bit stupid dont ya think?. Im not here to debate the legitimacy of my charge but to find out what my options are.

Last edited by vter; 12-17-2010 at 02:49 PM..
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Old 12-16-2010, 08:01 PM
 
4 posts, read 8,667 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarCii View Post
Why is it unconstitutional? The law sets minimum ages for anything that could be dangerous or threaten the lives of others, i.e. sale and consumption of alcohol, operation of motor vehicles, even voting. Why should guns be different?
And that's irrelevant anyway...the law as it is now, or as it was when the act was committed, is what's important. He broke the existing law. He was prosecuted and convicted.
As I said in my previous post, legal at 18 to buy one private sale where the government has no way to know where the weapon is....21 to buy from a dealer where the government has the ability to track the firearm. Makes no sense.
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