[vermont08]

I have to say most of what people have been posting here is not very positive. Anyone else looking to move to Vermont (like we are) please go visit the area and also look at ads and call places in your field to get an idea of what your hourly wage or salary would be. I know for us we found out that my husband will make the same if not a little more then what he makes now. (hotel mgr.) Also you must look at your quality of life. Crime, schools, pollution, lets see anyone fell like they should live in an area with over 200 murders a year? We can't get out of here fast enough and move to Vermont!

Also how can everyone go on and on about the cost of living there when all you have to do is look at any cost of living website to find out even Burlington, VT is only 110% and Rutland is only 95% based on the national average for cost of living. Many places cost more. Where I live now is 130% the national average. Those living in or near the New York City area are 164% the national average. The cost of living in Burlington is much lower then where we live now (just outside of Baltimore MD like I said our city is rated at 130%) I mean you can not even dream of owning a home here for less then $350-$400 thousand. You can not even rent a nice one bedroom apt for less then $1,200 a month here. If you have a family like we do and need to rent a larger place you can trust we are paying way more then that to rent our 2 bedroom townhouse.

[MRVphotog]

Originally Posted by vermont08

I have to say most of what people have been posting here is not very positive. Anyone else looking to move to Vermont (like we are) please go visit the area and also look at ads and call places in your field to get an idea of what your hourly wage or salary would be. I know for us we found out that my husband will make the same if not a little more then what he makes now. (hotel mgr.) Also you must look at your quality of life. Crime, schools, pollution, lets see anyone fell like they should live in an area with over 200 murders a year? We can't get out of here fast enough and move to Vermont!

Also how can everyone go on and on about the cost of living there when all you have to do is look at any cost of living website to find out even Burlington, VT is only 110% and Rutland is only 95% based on the national average for cost of living. Many places cost more. Where I live now is 130% the national average. Those living in or near the New York City area are 164% the national average. The cost of living in Burlington is much lower then where we live now (just outside of Baltimore MD like I said our city is rated at 130%) I mean you can not even dream of owning a home here for less then $350-$400 thousand. You can not even rent a nice one bedroom apt for less then $1,200 a month here. If you have a family like we do and need to rent a larger place you can trust we are paying way more then that to rent our 2 bedroom townhouse.

I couldn't agree more. My experience has been that the cost of living in Vermont is pretty reasonable compared to most urban/surburban areas of the country. Sure, wages are not as high but when you factor in the quality of life, it's a no brainer IMHO

[arel]

Finally, a couple of posts that are not discouraging .

I'm going to do some salary research in my field.

One thing I know is that in Vermont, private practititioners can see Medicaid patients. In New York, you can't, unless they also have Medicare. Medicaid patients must be seen at clinics.

I think the Brattleboro Retreat pays fairly well, but they have frequent job cuts, so jobs there are not secure. HCRS probably pays less, since it is not a hospital, but I don't know how much it pays. Both have pretty good benefits, I think, at least according to their websites. I do know that private therapists can surivive in the area. And I believe that Dartmouth Hitchcock, which has offices in Hanover and also Keene, pays full benefits for part-time work. So I do have options. Obviously a lot fewer than in New York, although getting a suitable job in New York is far from a walk in the park.

[GypsySoul22]

Arel,
I see there are a lot of social service agencies in/around WRJ. Also the transit in and out of WRJunction (Amtrak and Greyhound) goes right to NYC so you might consider 'that area.' We're presently kicking around a town in VT about 10 minutes from White River Junction and have all the same concerns you do..in fact due to all the negativity I have read here (poor pay, high rental costs) plus what I see in the paper, it's depressing.

Then again, I live on Long Island and you cannot touch a blasted apartment for less than $1200 or more (one bedroom) in a decaying area.

We're between a rock and a hard place. I am not going south. (I originated that thread in the NY forum last year). We considered KY seriously but the drug problems (meth) and the heat are 2 negatives. (we have a 9 year old).

If you can get a job, move for a year, get a lease and go for it, especially if you don't have a kid to worry about. We've done it before and we survived. NY might be a great place to get everything 24 hours a day but in the end, who needs the attitudes/hassles/and so on.

[arel]

I am familiar with WRJ. I spend about a month and a half there about 20 years ago. I considered living there. In fact, one day I traveled down to Brattleboro, and I disliked how the mountains became smaller and smaller as I went south in I-91. I was happy to get back north again.

WRJ has Dartmouth Hitchcock nearby and also a VA hospital. The area is quite beautiful. I also remember seeing fireflies in some birch trees. They put on a seemingly coordinated light show such as I have never seen before nor since.

I remember a craft fair in Norwich when I was there. And I remember thinking that I never wanted to leave.

But I felt lonely in WRJ. I wasn't comfortable with a lot of the people I met there. I think Brattleboro is a better fit for me.

Also, from what I have read, there is little to do in WRJ. In contrast, Brattleboro is a cultural hub. Lots of stuff to do. And there is a strong sense of community there. And in Brattleboro, you can travel down to Northampton and other places in the Pioneer Valley, or go east to Keene, NH.

People have been known to commute between Brattleboro and WRJ.

A poster on this board advises only considering Burlington, Brattleboro or Montpelier when you first move to Vermont. Then, after a year, you should "reprioritize". I had planned on Brattleboro before I read that, but if I hadn't I would take that advice to heart, especially coming from a place like the NYC area, which you would be coming from, too.

[GypsySoul22]

We were advised against WRJ due to its poor (but getting better) reputation. Funny they put lots of motels/hotels there, though, a new post office and so on.
It's a good hub for travel, anyhow.

I guess Vermont would be a culture shock for us but honestly now we have very little social life so maybe we'd have to get up and do things and integrate into the community. Dartmouth is not that far if I felt the need for 'happening' things and culture.

I'm more interested now in getting away from the crime and congestion of Long Island. If we get the apartment we are considering, it's only a ten minute ride to Lebanon in good weather.

Vermont08 is very right about 'cost of living'. Although salaries seem low in Vermont, I know people who live on Long Island and make less than $10 an hour and have to pay a lot more in housing/utilities/taxes/gas and food.

Average house here: $400,000. For half of that, we could own a nice house in Vermont. (again if I win the lottery).

[harry chickpea]

"Although salaries seem low in Vermont, I know people who live on Long Island and make less than $10 an hour and have to pay a lot more in housing/utilities/taxes/gas and food."

I think you are missing something. In more populous areas there are numbers of jobs paying "less than $10 an hour". In Vermont, you can be in an area where you know everyone within a ten mile radius, know every store or business within that area, and discover that there are NO job openings, period. No going down to the local fast food place and picking up a job within a week or two to help make ends meet, no part time or off-season work, NOTHING. It doesn't matter if the COL is 130%, 90%, or 1,000% Costs of any amount, with no income = financial disaster. Koz has experienced that, and a lot of ex-Vermonters have experienced it as well. With a population as small as Vermont has, it cannot support a large incoming work force. It needs more businesses and owners creating jobs instead of more people migrating in and looking for a job.

[KoZmiC NinJa]

As always, you are right on the money, Harry !
Statistics are very different than reality.
In Proctor for instance, our mortgage constantly
went up because of the constant increase in taxes....
When gas went up a dollar a gallon that affected my
Wife.....all this stuff that doesnt show up on statistics
really makes a difference in real life....

[68vette]

Originally Posted by KoZmiC NinJa

As always, you are right on the money, Harry !
Statistics are very different than reality.
In Proctor for instance, our mortgage constantly
went up because of the constant increase in taxes....
When gas went up a dollar a gallon that affected my
Wife.....all this stuff that doesnt show up on statistics
really makes a difference in real life....

That's my point. If you are financially secure then statistics don't mean that much. My wife and myself make a better than avg. living in Vermont. Our property taxes are close to $5,000. That's an almost $2,000 increase in the past 3.5 years. That's a tough bill for anyone to swallow, but according to the statistics I should have nothing to complain about.

There's a misconseption on this forum about negative comments. I don't see it as negative comments. Many state the positives of living in Vermont. We all know the positive things about this state or people wouldn't consider moving here. What is being taken as negative comments are real peoples real experiences with living here, just as many people make comments about there life in NYC or wherever they may be. I have nothing to gain by making up stories about life here. It's not all roses all the time. We deal with many of the same problems you have to deal with anywhere else. There are many pluses to life here, but on the other hand there are negatives.

[GypsySoul22]

The bottom line is ANYWHERE can change, and there is no perfect place like some 1800's novel about life in the woods...

However, and I do defer to the people from the area as knowing their state more than we do, I could point out that if someone wanted to move to Niagara Fall, NY vs. Long Island, NY their experiences would be vastly different.

There ARE less jobs in rural places(whatever state you live in). You do know all the folks in the ten mile radius. However, not everyone is moving to rural Vermont who is seeking information on this board.

Also, you take 2 people and A is willing to adapt, go with the flo, and be realistic. Then B is all starry eyed and keeps saying 'where is this miracle place I was looking for?'

I've moved enough to know every place has its good and bad points. Not every place is a perfect fit for everyone. However, if you look on all these forums you will see people are seeking 'something' as they migrate around the USA.

Any state thread can make you insane. There are the people who are fed up with Texas, the people who LOVE Texas, the guy who had the worst experience of his life in MA, the lady who made it big in MA...and so on.. In the end do you NOT move because of the negativity/realism?

Eventually you have to live it for yourself. I am constantly on the Long Island board warning anyone of modest means NOT to move there. I don't do it out of spite--If they have money, I wish them well. However, in our case, no matter 'how bad' "Vermont/NH" are (we're looking on the boarder) we still have a better chance of a life there then on Long Island.

The rich can live anywhere and do well. It's the rest of us who I'm concerned about.