[MRVphotog]

Article from the Rutland Herald/Times Argus. Vt. home sales: Sales up, prices down *:*Rutland Herald Online Good to see an improvement in the Vermont real estate market from a year ago. Real estate sales down from June and the 10% price reduction are not a big deal or surprising, respectively, IMHO.

[tkln]

I've had my eye on the market for months as we sold our house in NY and just got up here last week...I can say, just based on observation, the Waterbury/Morrisville/Stowe area has had a lot of houses that sat for a long time (some for more than a year), dropped in price and finally sold quickly early this summer. Homes that have been priced right go quickest...

[Flashback]

Homeowners always think their house is worth more. Sometimes it takes a year on the market for a seller to get realistic.

[FrugalYankee]

I think it's the real estate agents. My house has been on the market for over a year with the realtor advising patience. W've been dropping the price stradily and are now at 17 % less than what it initially was listed at. Sometime it does take time to find a good fit. Also I think some realtors were expecting a rebound sooner and hate to leave money on the table for themselves and their clients.

[arctichomesteader]

We need far bigger drops before prices will be more realistic.

[sugarmaple]

FrugalYankee, good morning. I am a real estate broker, and unfortunately, it is still a difficult market. I do firmly believe, however, that if a property is listed at fair market value, which is, to me, current fair market value, it has a somewhat better chance of selling. However [always the however caveat-smile] ... there are so many properties on the market, some areas more than others... I am finding that many buyers are either a bit more savvy, or certainly want 'great deals' --- lenders continue, unfortunately, also in my opinion and w/my recent experience w/the length of time -- to be over the top prudent with their lending; some appraisers appear to be so concerned about appraising a home, that they too are being over the top conservative w/their values.

Yes, there are still some sellers who believe that their properties are worth more than they are; I may present my opinion of value [again based on current market conditions] and an owner may disagree and what a different price on their property - I can simply encourage and suggest - I have some properties that have been shown - others, regardless of the advertising, no showings at all.

I do believe that the market will begin to improve, not necessarily in the next 3-6 months, but it will. I do not think, however, that the market will get back up to the crazy insane prices that we had a few years ago.

At the risk of sounding like your broker/agent - [smile], do have patience and certainly, keep the faith!

[FrugalYankee]

sugarmaple - thanks so much for you input, I greatly appreciate it!

I'm one of those people who was behind the delivery room door when patience was handed out. Also this property is not only nowhere near one of those locations that appeal to transplants or is in one of the pockets of VT that has a halfway decent economy, the neighborhood that the house is in has gone very far downhill in recent years. People who have seen the house tend to remark that it is a lovely house (which it is) and that they would love to pick it up and move it. Most potential buyers won't even look at the house because of its location.

I'm not looking foward to another winter on the market - paying for plowing, fuel oil to say nothing of taxes so I have no problem dropping the price radically on the chance that I can sell it before winter starts. As it is I have been spending 2 - 2-1/2 hrs every working day making improvements in the hope of making the house so attractive that if someone does stumble in, at least they will be pleasantly surprised.

As a seller I don't have a clue what the house is worth other than to say it is worth what someone is willing (and able) to pay for it. There isn't the contingent of financially stable first time homeowners in that town, and not only the lenders are wary, so are potential buyers. I've talked with a few who have said they are doing well now. The family breadwinner may have decent employment now but who knows what will happen in five years. They don't want to run the risk of being foreclosed on so they prefer to remain renters.

I suspect that what will have to happen is that house prices will come down far enough that buying a home will look financially attractive compared to renting, so that renters who qualify for the fantastic mortgage rates offered currently will take the plunge.

But who knows? If I had a crystal ball I'd be wealthier than I am now and might acted differently with this particular property.

[pauldorell]

Originally Posted by FrugalYankee

I think it's the real estate agents. My house has been on the market for over a year with the realtor advising patience. W've been dropping the price stradily and are now at 17 % less than what it initially was listed at. Sometime it does take time to find a good fit. Also I think some realtors were expecting a rebound sooner and hate to leave money on the table for themselves and their clients.

The realtors probably have some effect on the market, and we noticed that Vermont realtors aren't as effective at selling houses as Chicago area realtors. If you're selling a house in the Chicago area, many realtors make you go through hell to sell it fast, but it works. In selling our house in Evanston, we had to repaint most of the interior, put half our stuff in storage, buy staging furniture, move all the plants onto the back porch, fix everything that obviously needed repair, and rearrange much of the interior - and it took a little over a month to get an offer. In Vermont there seems to be none of that urgency, and many houses sit on the market indefinitely. When we looked at houses in Addison County in 2011, all of them had several serious problems that had not been addressed. The house we ended up buying had been poorly maintained for many years, but we were able to knock down the price enough to make it worthwhile. As with many things in Vermont, the markets are so small that there isn't much competition, and everyone is used to things being that way. On the positive side, the pace of life is slower here, but on the negative side, many Vermonters would quickly be put out of business if they had to compete in urban areas.

If I were you I'd dump my realtor and get one with a good track record.

[sugarmaple]

Yikes! We do work hard!

Many of 'us' agents/brokers do recommend/frequently recommend to our clients to do x, y and z. Sometimes, some of our clients just are simply not in a position to do a lot to their properties; on occasion, we can coordinate something with a vendor [i.e., painting/cleaning, and the like] and either owner will pay for materials [when possible] and/or vendor is willing to wait until a closing, and sometimes they have to wait a considerably long time, unfortunately. In fairness to us, sometimes we also have to be very careful with what/how we say something to a homeowner as well -- not everyone is putting their home on the market because they want to sell but because they have to sell.

There are areas that are currently inundated with properties and that does not help either.

Certainly, in my opinion, removing unnecessary clutter in itself, can help.

[Logs and Dogs]

One of my best friends is an appraiser and I can confirm what SugarMaple said, he has gone conservative with values and the additional requirements are really screwing him and other appraisers as well. Working twice as hard for the same money is never a good thing.

As far as bank lending goes, again I can confirm what SugarMaple has observed. The loan terms and underwriting are very conservative at this point. So you have sellers with unrealistic expectations, plenty of homes to choose from and money isn't readily available with good terms, that is a tough market.

If you want to laugh, check out the terms on land loans. They wanted something like 40% down and wouldn't offer a loan term any longer than 10 years in some cases, that is a tough nut.