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Old 05-20-2014, 07:51 AM
 
Location: Western views of Mansfield/Camels Hump!
1,942 posts, read 3,237,232 times
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I think the most unfortunate part of this whole situation is the family's decision to try and help him out themselves and waiting to call for help.Though I do agree that something seems off - if he was packed and prepared for several days out there, he should know enough to change out of wet clothes. Either way, it's just sad.
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Old 05-20-2014, 08:14 AM
 
43,012 posts, read 92,318,555 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambium View Post
Smart enough to pack 70lbs of stuff but not smart enough to change after getting wet at night?
Read the articles. The state police said his backpack didn't have the appropriate gear for the extreme weather he encountered that night.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambium View Post
Drugs impair decisions too, nobody should be assuming things right now.
Hypothermia is enough to impair decisions! It can happen super fast. Less than 15 minutes. The first organ affected is the brain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambium View Post
And For those that were wondering... Evening of May 5th at 1100 feet in Montpelier it was 40į. FORTY DEGREES. Not teens. It was low 30's at 5000 feet! It was low 20s at 8000 feet. So how high up was he when he was found?
Hypothermia most commonly happens when temperatures are between 30 and 50 degrees.

Was there precipitation that night? Was the perception rain or sleet at 5,000?
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Old 05-20-2014, 08:18 AM
 
43,012 posts, read 92,318,555 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tkln View Post
I think the most unfortunate part of this whole situation is the family's decision to try and help him out themselves and waiting to call for help.
This is truly the most unfortunate part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tkln View Post
Though I do agree that something seems off - if he was packed and prepared for several days out there, he should know enough to change out of wet clothes. Either way, it's just sad.
Does everyone find some type of personal security in believing that he was on drugs? The state police said his backpack wasn't filled with appropriate stuff for the type of weather he encountered. He was missing a shoe---that indicates he may have fallen. It's possible he had a concussion. It's possible he couldn't think simply due to hypothermia setting in super fast. It can happen suddenly within less than 15 minutes and the brain is the first organ to be hindered from it.
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Old 05-20-2014, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Near the Coast SWCT
69,217 posts, read 51,442,002 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
Was there precipitation that night? Was the perception rain or sleet at 5,000?
High Pressure coming into control. No storms or precip but a storm had just happened and dropped some snow in the higher elevations I think.

WPC Surface Map archive for May 5th 11pm. Or this Surface Map



Without getting too technical.. Each NWS office releases weather balloons 12z and 00z everyday. These balloons return back data from the atmosphere from surface to 80k+

Looking at NWS Albany's sounding from that evening it was Dry at the Lower levels and Upper levels but some clouds around at 6-9k feet. So it was dry all the way up to 6000 feet at least. And clouds don't mean rain/snow either. Could be fog...



One last look just for my curiosity as well... Mt Washington Blog from May 5th. Keep in mind this is done from the summit which is 6200'. Most likely the hiker was below 5000'.

18:35 Mon May 5th

Even though the calendar reads May, it has felt more like February on the summit over the last 3 days. A slow moving upper-level disturbance has resulted in wave after wave of precipitation across New England. On the summit, afternoon high temperatures around 30 degrees Fahrenheit have allowed the precipitation to fall as a mix of snow, snow pellets and ice pellets. Yesterday, we recorded 8.1" of new snow, the most snow the summit has seen in a single day since March 20th. Although it is only May 5th, the summit has seen 12.6" of snow so far this month (as of 1:30 EDT today), which is 0.4" above normal. This is the most snow recorded during the month of May since 2006.

Looking ahead to the next few days, high pressure will begin to build tomorrow, likely clearing the summits of fog during the overnight hours and keeping mostly clear conditions in the forecast through at least Thursday. The next chance for significant precipitation appears to be sometime early this weekend and temperatures at this time look to be above freezing, which would allow for plain rain to fall.
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Old 05-20-2014, 05:29 PM
 
Location: Near the Coast SWCT
69,217 posts, read 51,442,002 times
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So my unprofessional opinion is it looks to have been dry as far as weather goes. But fog could have been a factor. Hard to pin point fog because fog can happen in select locations especially if there was snow on the ground and warmer air temps at night. And since there was fresh fallen snow and air temp was 30-40 degrees fog may have been around. Thanks for making me look into that.

Now I'm thinking it's highly possible he got lost in the fog, maybe panicked, came into deeper snow drifts, lost track of time while staying in wet clothes. ect. ect.

But did the family come across fog? Maybe it cleared by then.
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Old 05-21-2014, 03:50 AM
 
Location: Live - VT, Work - MA
819 posts, read 1,270,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
As if hypothermia isn't enough to impair a person's thought process.

You don't wait until you have symptoms of hypothermia because then it's too late if you're alone. His mistake was not immediately seeking shelter when he got wet and drying off. But many of us have hiked in winter/early spring rain for 15 minutes or after getting wet some other way so we can't really fault him for that error. Everyone does it. Hypothermia can happen extremely fast. It was probably very sudden and then he couldn't think properly.

Instead of being dumbfounded over his death, everyone should take this as a warning. It could have happened to any of us if we were alone. This is why I'm glad my son was a boy scout. Buddy system. Nobody should go into the wilderness, no matter how old, smart, familiar, skilled, or prepared, without a buddy.

Let's review the symptoms of hypothermia to realize it was a miracle he even called his parents.
I was speaking of the events leading to hypothermia........
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:40 PM
 
12 posts, read 12,519 times
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The 3 most important things to remember when hiking, rappelling, camping or doing anything out in the wilderness.

1: Never hike alone.
2: Never hike alone.
3: Never hike alone.

If he fell and hit his head, had a stroke (yes, even the young can have a temporary cranial blood clot effecting judgement and never know it), fell into ice cold water and hypothermia set in fast as he was already cold, all can be deadly and having someone there to help is mandatory.
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Old 06-18-2014, 09:54 AM
 
35,324 posts, read 25,177,423 times
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LOL, I hike alone. Not going to stop. I go hiking/camping to be alone!
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Old 06-18-2014, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Vermont
5,439 posts, read 14,783,011 times
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That is a good rule but not practical. If I never went without a partner I'd never leave the house. I am alone almost 100% of the time, sometimes with my trusty dog. Here are more realistic options to minimize risk.

-Be prepared for weather - I went for a hike the other day and it was probably in the 40s at the top of the mountain in June. Hat, gloves at a minimum are so small and go a long way.
-Water - bring more than you think you need. Lifestraw /iodine,UV backup.
-Don't be afraid to ask for help
-Let people know where you are going and stick to plan
-If you have cell service, know how to convey your position by reading GPS coordinates and relaying this info
-Backup communications (Fido, Resq-link (PLB), vhf/uhf radio)

You can fall and knock yourself out, but I am guessing here, you are probably more likely to be incapacitated before you are unconscious.

I would recommend reading "between a rock and hard place", about the guy who survived 4-5 days with his arm pinned by a boulder before breaking / cutting it off. it definitely makes you think about getting yourself into that position and how you would want to be prepared.

Last edited by joe moving; 06-18-2014 at 12:35 PM..
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Old 06-19-2014, 05:49 AM
 
Location: Near the Coast SWCT
69,217 posts, read 51,442,002 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe moving View Post
I would recommend reading "between a rock and hard place", about the guy who survived 4-5 days with his arm pinned by a boulder before breaking / cutting it off.
Sounds like the movie 127 Hours I saw. Might of been the same true story?
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