The good, the bad, & the ugly (Burlington, South Burlington: real estate, renting)
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Okay, first I want to thank everyone for the info. on Vermont again. Everyone is very open about their passion for Vermont, one way or the other. I would like to dive deeper as the title suggests and ask for the good, the bad, and the ugly on South Burlington, Springfield and their surrounding areas? Any info. would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Kind of hard to really comment on a question so broad as this. South Burlington is a middle and upper middle class area in Chittenden County, where the largest cluster of population and business exists. Springfield as many may agree is a relic of a past machine factory town with a host of problems that had manifested themselves well before the current economic downturn. If you have money and don't rely on immediate solid income to stay afloat, then both areas no doubt may offer options for living. The towns and cities here are small and therefore country type atmosphere readily abounds within proximity. The fact of the matter right now is that large amounts of folks are losing their jobs each and every week and apparently soon a good amount of state employees will be thrust into the ranks. In many parts of the state state jobs are the primary ones which offer the ability to have a liveable wage. If a move a move to Vermont relies on obtaining steady employment then you must make sure that this is lined up before coming.
PaBear...Vermont is a hard place to live, I know because I lived there for 9 years. 'Hard' you say? Yes, especially if you have to work a 8 to 5 job everyday and commute from the mountains in the WINTER months. It is a real eye-opener if you are from a more moderate climate like NC. Make sure you buy a house close to your job...commuting takes a bite out of you everyday...
PaBear, I appreciate your enthusiasm about moving and living up here but a few things to know...
Yes, what people say about finding a job up here is very true. It's hard to do. Add to that, MANY employers see an out of state resume/application and toss it. The logic behind it is simply, so many come up here to visit, believe they would love it, move and then spend a winter here. After one winter (if they make it all the way through), a large percentage of flatlanders flee. I am sure you understand, when an employer is looking to hire, they want someone who is going to stick around and many feel it's a safer bet to hire someone who has already been through a winter or two. We moved BACK here from out of state and regardless of the fact that we had been through winters before, employers were leery of hiring from out of state.
If you can get past the job hunt and you are truly prepared for temperatures FAR below what they are in PA (my husband grew up there and I went to school near State College), then you might really love it. Just be aware that employers have seen many who thought they would love it and many left because they couldn't tolerate the cold and the lack of good Chinese food.
Last week, while taking my daughter to the bus stop. And yes... we had school at those temps.
PaBear, I appreciate your enthusiasm about moving and living up here but a few things to know...
Yes, what people say about finding a job up here is very true. It's hard to do. Add to that, MANY employers see an out of state resume/application and toss it. The logic behind it is simply, so many come up here to visit, believe they would love it, move and then spend a winter here. After one winter (if they make it all the way through), a large percentage of flatlanders flee. I am sure you understand, when an employer is looking to hire, they want someone who is going to stick around and many feel it's a safer bet to hire someone who has already been through a winter or two. We moved BACK here from out of state and regardless of the fact that we had been through winters before, employers were leery of hiring from out of state.
If you can get past the job hunt and you are truly prepared for temperatures FAR below what they are in PA (my husband grew up there and I went to school near State College), then you might really love it. Just be aware that employers have seen many who thought they would love it and many left because they couldn't tolerate the cold and the lack of good Chinese food.
Last week, while taking my daughter to the bus stop. And yes... we had school at those temps.
Good luck.
I never thought about the fact that employers would be Leary about out of state applicants. I ended up being hired at FAHC after several years of trying and I often times felt I was over qualified. It wasn't until I was here that I realized that most out of state hires didn't make it a full year.
I personally have not witnessed the survive a winter and flee aspect, but understand that there of course are those who may have misjudged their tolerance to deal with winter. While it may be true that many employers prefer to only hire "locals" I really don't see the excuse being a concern over the fear of losing an employee based on our climate. Employment nativism pretty much exists everywhere. The problem we have here is that even locals are having a hard time landing a job or retaining one. Of the many folks I work with that are multi generational Vermonters, with rare exception have previously lost good jobs before the current economic meltdown. I feel the primary factor for people to relocate out of here is of course the desire for milder climate, but more so the lack of ability to be able to economically make it. Quite a few who come here assume being a small and rural state that their ability to maintain lower budgets would be more realistic here despite the fact that for most occupations the wages are also lower. After the first two years you start to see the realities of day to life and then for many you start to realize that you can work only so many hours. Now we are starting to face the reality that certain second jobs for income opportunity are either hard to come by. Granted, you can cut out quite a bit of spending, but the core expenses will always be there and it gets very frustrating when you start to realize that it has become a stretch to just pay the mandatory bills.
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAA. Please don't remind me...I have been craving good Chinese food for weeks. Places here do not cut it.
If you find yourself in Bellows Falls, try Joy Wah. It's about as close to the Chinese back on LI as I have found in VT. The interior is real old school Chinese restaurant with ornate ceilings, tassled lamps, dragon decor and all. Joy Wah Chinese Restaurant | Bellows Falls, Vermont
If you find yourself in Bellows Falls, try Joy Wah. It's about as close to the Chinese back on LI as I have found in VT. The interior is real old school Chinese restaurant with ornate ceilings, tassled lamps, dragon decor and all. Joy Wah Chinese Restaurant | Bellows Falls, Vermont
Maybe the food is inconsistent? The three times I ate there, my meals and those of my companions were gag. Greasy and bland. :-p
Brattleboro has two excellent Chinese restauants, Panda North and Panasian. There are also two good Thai restaurants, but I have only been to one.
I have also been to two Chinese restaurants in Greenfield, MA, just a little bit south on the Interstate. Both were good. I started to go to one of them a second time. I was in a hurry and asked the cashier questions about how long certain dishes took to be served. She seemed irritable and rude. I walked out.
There are actually lots of good restaurants in Brattleboro and in the surrounding area. There are even several high-priced gourmet "fine dining" places. I haven't been to those places in Brattleboro, but I did like a good restaurant in Putney. I think it is called the Front Porch Cafe.
There are several pizzarias in town. I've been to two. One was pretty good, although they serve personal pies rather than individual slices. Their pizza didn't taste quite like New York pizza, but it was still tasty.
Honestly, most of the complaints I hear about Vermont I do not have in Brattleboro. Yes, it's cold, but not much colder than in New York. It is also hard to find work. Prices are very high, especially in restaurants. (Maybe that is due to Vermont's hefty restaurant tax). But I am renting. I do not have to shovel snow. I do not have to pay real estate taxes, which are high. I may be working at a place within walking distance of my house, although that is certainly not a sure thing. I hope I do not have to commute very far. I do not want to take the time and I do not want to deal with having to get to places, and on time, no matter what the road conditions are.
It is amazing what kind of amenities Brattleboro has for a small town. Except for a shoe repair place. You have to take shoes to Keene for repairs and then, I am told, it takes 3-4 weeks to get them back. But you can take your shoes to a cleaners near my home, and they send them out. But they send them out to that same place in Keene, and it still takes the same long time to get them back. They told me are looking for a new place to send shoes to.
If I eventually leave Vermont, it will almost certainly be due to the economy, not the winter. So far, I am enjoying the winter. Except for that ice storm, which came close to disrupting my plans to get to a conference in Stamford, CT, things have been fine. Studded snow tires help.
When April comes and there is still snow on the ground, and no blooming bulbs, I may feel differently. I'll know in 3 months.
If I leave Vermont, though, I don't know where I would go. Either to southern Rhode Island, where I know people, back to New York or the surrounding area, to southern Maine, to the Pioneer valley in Massachusetts, or to places unknown. I strongly doubt I'd go to the South, and certainly not to south Florida.
But when I visited my cousin in Fort Lauderdale, I did go to some nice restaurants.
Last edited by arel; 01-26-2009 at 05:16 PM..
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