Why Virginia... Why US?! (Charlottesville, Washington: low income, health insurance, how much)

[vanyali]

Unemployment in the U.S. is a little over 4%. Unemployment in Australia is a little over 4%. Unemployment in Europe is over 7%.

The only thing that makes illegal immigration "illegal" is that our immigration laws need updating. The fact that people want to be in the US, and put up with a lot of crap to get here, says good things about the country I think.

The U.S. social security system and system of other social welfare benefits is more financially secure than that of most other countries.


Racial tensions in the US are exagerated, and better than in many European countries. Germany (just for an example) won't grant citizenship to immigrants for generations. Notice all the 9/11 terrorists were recruited in Europe? There's a reason for that.

[vanyali]

Originally Posted by Mr_Jonas

Correct me if I am wrong but in the US it seems the more money you make, the better vacation you get. Just an observation. I might be wrong.

No, I don't think you're wrong. I think there are plenty of high-paying jobs that nominally give you a lot of vacation that you're informally not really supposed to take too. That's the thing about the US -- it's diverse in a lot of different ways. Job benefits and compensation and office culture is just all over the map.

[tamitrail]

Originally Posted by Mr_Jonas

Yep, Lynchburg to be exact! Plenty of people here do not want to hire "wierdos" like me. It took me a few years but now I have an OK job with benifits.........



Nope, that wasn't me.



Yeah, in Alexandia I probably be just another white guy....


Correct me if I am wrong but in the US it seems the more money you make, the better vacation you get. Just an observation. I might be wrong.

I guess in some ways that could be true. I would think the more seniority you have in a company, the more vacation you get....and maybe the more money. However, teachers can have the summer off but I would say they don't make too much money.

Different benefits for different jobs. There is probably not a norm across the board.

[Mr_Jonas]

Originally Posted by vanyali

Unemployment in the U.S. is a little over 4%. Unemployment in Australia is a little over 4%. Unemployment in Europe is over 7%.

The only thing that makes illegal immigration "illegal" is that our immigration laws need updating. The fact that people want to be in the US, and put up with a lot of crap to get here, says good things about the country I think.

The U.S. social security system and system of other social welfare benefits is more financially secure than that of most other countries.


Racial tensions in the US are exagerated, and better than in many European countries. Germany (just for an example) won't grant citizenship to immigrants for generations. Notice all the 9/11 terrorists were recruited in Europe? There's a reason for that.

Unemployment numbers
Switzerland 3.10 .
Norway 2.10
Sweden 4.50
Ireland 4.70
United Kingdom 5.40
Portugal 8.00
France 7.50
Spain 7.60
Germany 9.10

United States 5.10

Lets not lump together all of Europe in one number. If you look at statistics, many European countries have roughly the same numbers as the US. Others do not. Look at the German numbers!!!!
…but then look at Norway!! (Their oil driven economy is doing them quite well!!!)

America is a good place. Do not get ME wrong. When it comes to unemployment numbers are VERY, VERY hard to compare. The reason being is that different nations collect data in different manners. Here in the US they only count people registered with the local unemployment office. Most people without a job are not registered. In Sweden, many people are taking classes or participating in programs that are supposed to make them more attractive on the job market. Some of these programs are good but I know some that are…well, basically crap. People in these programs do not show up in statistics.

As for citizenship in Germany I know very little. In Sweden and the UK you can get citizenship after 5 years. Not saying that there are not any racial tensions in various European states.

Comparing countries is a little bit like comparing apples and oranges…and bananas. There are good things in the US…and bad things. The same for Sweden. I have never lived in Portugal but I am sure you can say the same thing there.

[vanyali]

Yes, you are right, US unemployment rate for March of this year is estimated at 5.1%. I was looking at the average for 2007, and looking at 2007 numbers for the other countries too.

My point wasn't to bash Europe, but was to put some of the US-bashing into perspective. My main complaint about Europe is that no one over there wants to give me a work visa or a job. Lots of Europeans have the same complaint about the US. But that's OK, I like DC just fine.

[Mr_Jonas]

Job permits are can be a drag. Since I have a green card and a EU passport I am quite spoiled in that regard. Have you tried Ireland? Sweden actually advertises for people with western college degrees (this might just be inside the EU though). Dutch people seem to be extremely interested in my home country. Kind of interesting.

[lmm05]

Firstly, thanks to everyone for your replies. It's both enlightening and educational.

I will be coming to the US in July. I'll be staying with my guy for 3 months to get a good understanding of how he lives and what life is like over there, etc. The reason I am asking for advice (without having spent any significant amount of time in the US) is because I want to know what unbiased Americans (ie people who don't have a stake in this relationship) think of this. Why I should consider moving there... I don't mind that you might not have been to Australia, but I want to know why you would tell someone to come there...

I'm 30, and he's 35. We were good mates before we started having feelings for one another so we know each other pretty well... together, however, we've spent only 4 weeks... which isn't that long - hence the 3 months. I know that at the moment he is working for a UK based company (how we met) and gets 4 weeks holiday, but he works 50-60 hour weeks. Which is a MAJOR worry for me because he tells me this is normal and expected in the US. But he gets no overtime, nor does he get any time-in-lieu, and it seems like it is slave labour. I know that people in the same role in the UK are leaving at 5pm, but he stays till 10pm some nights. CRAZY!!! Are these kind of hours expected in the US?! He works in IT - but what about other industries...?!

He, like me, is reluctant to leave his country. He was in Australia over Christmas and was appalled with having to wear a seatbelt (it's law over here, in all states). He also said that although he really enjoyed his holiday, there were things he missed - like good mexican food, and cheeses and stuff.

Me? I'm not that particularly fussed about that stuff. For me, all that matters is being happy with the one I love, and raising well-adjusted kids.

Things I will miss will be the beach being a 15min drive away from me. Family - A LOT... and like tamitrail said - my folks not getting a chance to know my kids; and them not growing up with aunts and uncles and cousins will be very hard for me to come to terms with (his dad lives in Minneapolis with wife and 2 younger half-brothers, his mum is travelling around America with her hubby, and one half-sister lives somewhere else, so we'll have no family around us). I've lived in a lot of places, and I know I'm adaptable. I also know that that he's not as adaptable and flexible as me, but yes, I don't want to move there and begin to resent him for it.

In the end, I know it's a choice we have to make... but I'd like to be well informed when I make the choice, so any thoughts you might have will be well received and considered.

[vanyali]

50-60 hours/week isn't all that usual overall, but it is a bit unusual for IT. Those guys are usually clock-punchers. Is he a computer programmer or a cable puller? Computer programmers work more like professionals -- paid a salary, work until the job's done, and it's never done. Cable pullers usually work shifts, and go home at a set time. But every workplace is different. He could probably find a different job with fewer hours if he wanted to, but it might pay less and not be as good in other ways. Maybe when he's married or has kids, he'll want to look for a job with fewer hours, or maybe you'll just get used to it. If he's just a single guy living alone, why not work hard? It's better than spending hours a day at a bar, or in front of a TV. He sounds like a
responsible, ambitious guy from what you've said so far. Those sound like good qualities to me.

[Mr_Jonas]

50-60 hours is a bit unusual I would say, but not un heard of. My father-in-law worked at a bank for a good chunk of his career and did do around 50-60 hours even though he did have a wife and kids. I work about 37,5 hours a week and I work for a social services agency.

I have to say I am quite surprised about he seatbelt comments. It is very much the law in Virginia (most of the US, right??). There was a huge campaign for it a while back “Buckle up Virginia”. Maybe some of the proper Virginians here on the bord can correct me if I am wrong. Sure there are some people who does nit care, but most people I know around here puts on their seatbelt without a problem.

Surely you must have some decent Mexican food in Sydney!! Both Northern Virginia (=Arlington) and Sydney are urban and multi cultural areas. Heck my hometown in Sweden had a pretty decent Mexican restaurant.

Virginia Beach is fairly close to Washington DC/Northern Virginia/Arlington. It is not a few minutes drive though. Someone here who lives in Northern Virginia maybe can explain a bit better.

I know quite a few people who are in, or have been in long cross national relationship. Many people think just because you are from two western countries there are no differences, and yes there are. I would say bigger then people realize. Then we also have to think about how people can grow up in the same town and still come from very different “cultures” or “worlds” just the way they were raised or how the their family interacted within the family.

I am glad you get to spend 3 months in the US and check it out. 3 months should give you a decent taste for Northern Virginia. It is different visiting a country then living in it but 3 months should get both you and your guy a “test” of your relationship etc, etc.

It is important that you both respect and recognize each others cultures. I know more then one couple were one person constantly picks on the others culture. “Well, way are you guys doing it like that, that is stupid” this can range from many topics. Even silly ones like the size of candy bars.

Oh, well, I am blabbing away. I hope I made some sense.

[vamtncat]

lmm05. First and foremost you need to be sure of your relationship with your guy. Spending 3 months with him, here in the states will be a great indicator of what your life will be like here. You do need to experience him on a day to day basis. You never really know someone untill you live with them "behind closed doors" so to speak. If you find yourself willing to be with him, even if you are living in the Arctic, then I say go for it!

You decision about moving permanently, marrying him ( I assume) and leaving everything behind that you know is a monumental decision and I feel for the position you are in. Like I said, you first priority is your relationship and then where you will live.

Look for the red flags and don't ignore them. If worse comes to worse, just make sure you have enough dollars stashed away for a plane ticket home. Your family seems of great importance to you. While I'm sure they will be happy for you if you are truely happy, you can ALWAYS come home.

Good Luck!