What Virginia city is Most Southern?

[KeyserSoze]

Originally Posted by cpterp

Are you serious? Arlington County (and Alexandria and Fairfax county to an extent) socially, culturally, and poltically is different than the rest of Virginia. Try to find another Ballston or Rossyln in VA. Do you honestly believe Northern Virginia is just like the rest of Virginia? Fredericksburg, and other parts of PWC are excpetions. If you can find me one town remotely similar to F'burg in MoCo or PG I'll pay you.

Regarding the Southern accents:

File:Southern American English.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
File:Yall US Map.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
American Dialects : Dialect map of American English
South Regional Map

I've been through this with you before. I'm not going to go through it again. Virginia is what is referred to as a moderate state. For every liberal, there is a conservative. I think you just buy into this "Northern Virginia vs. Rest of Virginia" crap without having ever been past Fairfax or Prince William. The state has different regions, and therefore will have different feels and influence. Doesn't make them any less part of Virginia. So Northern Virginia is near Washington, DC. It has a large, urban population and attracts people from all over the world. So what? Does this not make it any less Virginian? Since you know so much, why don't you tell me what a Virginian is supposed to be like? Or you could just get out and travel more and stop making ill-informed assumptions. Everything isn't black and white.

I can find you plenty towns in Prince George's or Montgomery County, Maryland that are similar to Fredericksburg. Rockville comes to mind. So does Upper Marlboro. But I think Fredericksburg is more like Annapolis. But I said that it LOOKS more like suburban towns you'd find in PG or Montgomery. You can actually go to Fredericksburg and come to your own conclusions, or you can continue to see things through your own twisted point of view. And as tempting as the money sounds, I don't want it.

And why did you bring up those maps? They prove nothing in what I've been saying. Especially maps from Wikipedia. Besides, all accent maps tend to vary, as there's no definite answer. But I know that finding an accent in Virginia, much less Northern Virginia, is more likely harder to find these days. Not including older residents born before the 70s.

[cpterp]

Originally Posted by KeyserSoze

I've been through this with you before. I'm not going to go through it again. Virginia is what is referred to as a moderate state. For every liberal, there is a conservative. I think you just buy into this "Northern Virginia vs. Rest of Virginia" crap without having ever been past Fairfax or Prince William. The state has different regions, and therefore will have different feels and influence. Doesn't make them any less part of Virginia. So Northern Virginia is near Washington, DC. It has a large, urban population and attracts people from all over the world. So what? Does this not make it any less Virginian? Since you know so much, why don't you tell me what a Virginian is supposed to be like? Or you could just get out and travel more and stop making ill-informed assumptions. Everything isn't black and white.

I can find you plenty towns in Prince George's or Montgomery County, Maryland that are similar to Fredericksburg. Rockville comes to mind. So does Upper Marlboro. But I think Fredericksburg is more like Annapolis. But I said that it LOOKS more like suburban towns you'd find in PG or Montgomery. You can actually go to Fredericksburg and come to your own conclusions, or you can continue to see things through your own twisted point of view. And as tempting as the money sounds, I don't want it.

And why did you bring up those maps? They prove nothing in what I've been saying. Especially maps from Wikipedia. Besides, all accent maps tend to vary, as there's no definite answer. But I know that finding an accent in Virginia, much less Northern Virginia, is more likely harder to find these days. Not including older residents born before the 70s.

Actually I have been to Fredericksburg, Richmond, and Hampton Roads (VA Beach, Williamsburg, Norfolk) so there's no need to insult my "ill-informed" assumptions. I'm just saying what I've experienced, and what I've heard from many others. I doubt many others on the NoVa board would agree with your opinions. I'm sure you must have missed out on the last election season as well if you've never heard about the "real Virginia" controversy.

It seems you're the one that needs to travel if you think Fredericksburg is anything like Rockville, which is a wealthy semi-urban town with more than twice the population of F'burg. Upper Marlboro is similar in size only, but not demographically, historically, or culturally. Plus it has twice the median income of F'burg. Same with Annapolis, the "sailing capital of the world." The only thing I can think of is that they're both older than America, but that's just my "twisted POV."

Oh yeah, I apologize for putting up those maps for trying to help you out. Won't do it again. The Wikipedia maps are actually copies of reputable maps from the Atlas of North American English and the Univ. of Wisconsin, and if U Penn is not a reputable source I don't know what is.

[KeyserSoze]

Originally Posted by cpterp

Actually I have been to Fredericksburg, Richmond, and Hampton Roads (VA Beach, Williamsburg, Norfolk) so there's no need to insult my "ill-informed" assumptions. I'm just saying what I've experienced, and what I've heard from many others. I doubt many others on the NoVa board would agree with your opinions. I'm sure you must have missed out on the last election season as well if you've never heard about the "real Virginia" controversy.

It seems you're the one that needs to travel if you think Fredericksburg is anything like Rockville, which is a wealthy semi-urban town with more than twice the population of F'burg. Upper Marlboro is similar in size only, but not demographically, historically, or culturally. Plus it has twice the median income of F'burg. Same with Annapolis, the "sailing capital of the world." The only thing I can think of is that they're both older than America, but that's just my "twisted POV."

Oh yeah, I apologize for putting up those maps for trying to help you out. Won't do it again. The Wikipedia maps are actually copies of reputable maps from the Atlas of North American English and the Univ. of Wisconsin, and if U Penn is not a reputable source I don't know what is.

If you've been to these areas, then why do you make such broad generalizations, and are often corrected for your lack of knowledge? You said Richmond was conservative, and called Hampton Roads liberal. Then you tried to throw that biased "research" study to verify how liberal Maryland is. If you'll notice, most people on the Northern Virginia forum aren't native to the area, or region, so of course what they say or feel is going to be different. And since you want to bring up the "Real Virginia" controversy, it was a strategy used to try and get a swing state to vote for the Republican side. And I pointed out earlier that Virginia is middle of the road, politically. AND Virginia ended up going with Obama. Maybe you missed THAT part.

Unless you're incredibly superficial, population & more specifically money has very little to do with similarities. Or else many things that could be comparable wouldn't be.The incorporated areas of Rockville, Upper Marlboro DO look like Fredericksburg. Your twisted point of view also forgets to include that Annapolis & Fredericksburg are VERY similar. Aside from Annapolis being the state capitol of Maryland, and not having Civil War battlefields, how are they different? Similar history, similar status in the region(satellite cities), same climate, similar demographics, same topography. I'd throw in Upper Marlboro, but Annapolis is more nearly identical to Fredericksburg.

Those maps were reputable about 20-25 years ago. Even then, I still wouldn't agree, as most people on this forum picked it apart. As it is now, much has changed. If you want my honest opinion, they look like poorly-formed maps that attempt to categorize cultural regions. My little advice for you -- don't take everything at face value.

[Dixiebound]

Originally Posted by KeyserSoze

In terms of geography, I don't think it matters much. I think it depends on how rural the place is. The more rural, it may be a little harder to break into the social scene. You said you're considering moving to Roanoke area. I don't think you'd have much problems, since there are people from all over living there. But it's best to post your question to the people of the Roanoke area forum. Hope that helps.

Thanks so much; my time near and in Roanoke has been very positive. The people are great.
I was just curious if sections of VA had clear differences in personality, particulary when people in the Roanoke forum post back and forth whether they are more mountain types as opposed to pure southern.

[cpterp]

Originally Posted by KeyserSoze

If you've been to these areas, then why do you make such broad generalizations, and are often corrected for your lack of knowledge? You said Richmond was conservative, and called Hampton Roads liberal. Then you tried to throw that biased "research" study to verify how liberal Maryland is. If you'll notice, most people on the Northern Virginia forum aren't native to the area, or region, so of course what they say or feel is going to be different. And since you want to bring up the "Real Virginia" controversy, it was a strategy used to try and get a swing state to vote for the Republican side. And I pointed out earlier that Virginia is middle of the road, politically. AND Virginia ended up going with Obama. Maybe you missed THAT part.

Unless you're incredibly superficial, population & more specifically money has very little to do with similarities. Or else many things that could be comparable wouldn't be.The incorporated areas of Rockville, Upper Marlboro DO look like Fredericksburg. Your twisted point of view also forgets to include that Annapolis & Fredericksburg are VERY similar. Aside from Annapolis being the state capitol of Maryland, and not having Civil War battlefields, how are they different? Similar history, similar status in the region(satellite cities), same climate, similar demographics, same topography. I'd throw in Upper Marlboro, but Annapolis is more nearly identical to Fredericksburg.

Those maps were reputable about 20-25 years ago. Even then, I still wouldn't agree, as most people on this forum picked it apart. As it is now, much has changed. If you want my honest opinion, they look like poorly-formed maps that attempt to categorize cultural regions. My little advice for you -- don't take everything at face value.

You know what, I'm done. I have no problem whatsoever disagreeing with people and engaging in debate with others but, this is like arguing with a brick wall. Maybe you should remove your hands from your ears and actually listen to others' opinions instead of ignoring them and insulting their intelligence. Instead of countering my points you simply ignore them, and now you're discrediting all the posters on the NoVa board. Honestly, do you even live anywhere near Virginia or Maryland?

Anyway, Rockville, (the incorporated city-pop. 53,279; density 4,381 sq/mi) with an urban downtown area, is nothing like Fredericksburg (pop. 21,918 1,833 sq/mi), and the incoporated area of Upper Marlboro has a population of 837. You can't use climate when comparing two communities in the same region. Population and wealth are two of the most important features when comparing localities. Also, the demographics of the Upper Marlboro and F'burg couldn't be anymore different with the former 81% African-American and the latter 71% White.

Obama had a higher margin of victory in Norfolk, Newport News, and Hampton than in Richmond. Virginia also voted Republican for 30 straight years, or maybe you missed THAT part. All the while Maryland continuosly voted Demcratic and was one of Obama's top 5 states, and of course I seriously doubt that you could find one person to back up your theory that Maryland isn't liberal.

These are all cold, hard facts, since my personal experience apparently isn't worth anything, but I guess the Census Bureau (where I've interned) and CNN aren't good enough sources either. Also those maps that were only good "20-25" years ago were mostly published 2005-2006, including the UPenn atlas which won the "Linguistic Society of America's biennial Bloomfield Book Award in 2008," but that probably doesn't matter to you anyway. Anyway, I'm moving on since I'm apparently too "superficial" and "twisted" to keep up this argument to nowhere. Goodbye...

[ecko_complex24]

I agree with cpterp. I am a virginia native and know the whole state along with most of maryland. And rockville, annapolis, and upper marlboro in no way are like fredericksburg. If you go into old town fredericksburg down rt. 1 there is a rebel flag on the sign. annapolis, upper marlboro and rockville as far as I am concerned are northern. Maryland didnt secede with the south... remember. Very different places.

[thejoe]

The city that is the most southern in Virginia is the one that is literally, physically, a stone's throw over the border from North Carolina. City wise, i"m sure Danville is a top qualifier. But thejoe is sure there are some little burghs a literal hop away from NC border, but they have names we have never heard of.

[roanoker 4]

Roanoke Southern? I have never seen debutante balls listed in the local paper or seen names such as Beauregard or Scarlett for kids names. There is old railroad money people here but they aren't as snobby as the FFV(First Families of VA). I don't know of any confederate monuments in the City. I believe there is a confederate cannon in Salem that is really out of place along with a statue of an Indian. Geograhically Roanoke is southern but the mindset of the southern past is not there like it is in Richmond of course.
Roanoke really didn't exist or start to grow until after the civil war so the people here rarely discuss that period of U.S. history. I think Roanoke has a unique definition as being a mountain town. I think everyone has their own definition of what "southern" means. Remember the western part of VA was not a big fan of the civil war, like West VA. It is a huge difference 50 miles south of here when you enter NC or even in nearby Lynchburg or Lexington.

[ToughLuv]

There's nothing in PG County that mirrors Fredricksburg whatsoever..I cant believe you said that..And places in MoCo like Rockville and Silver Springs not much alike there either..I think places in NoVa like Alexandria, Tysons Corner, Alington could be switched around with MoCo cities and there would not be a noticeable difference, but Fredricksburg...no

[ecko_complex24]

I say that cause pg county is liberal not like the conservative south like VA has been until this past year. as for MD they have pretty much always been liberal that is what I am saying I know that you can say some parts of MD might have a mild southern feel but nothing in comparison to Fredericksburg on down and as for the person who said that western VA did not get involved in the war and are not really southern I suggest you read about Moseby's Rangers that were in the Shenandoah Valley