The Infamous PG County "Mall Curse" (Baltimore, Bowie: high school, income)

[EducatedBro82]

Originally Posted by sufloc

agree with perception - I was wondering why several stores leaped from BTC to Waugh Chapel. Teens are also at Waugh Chapel - however so are nicer stores and restaurants. Regarding another perception or stereotype...Section 8 residents. As a realtor, I have placed model tenants into homes in Bowie and the homeowners were pleased to have. Some of these section 8 tenants were grandmothers raising a grandchild. People are from a multitude of economic backgrounds and I have seen many unruly, disrespectful, destructive kids in our million dollar neighborhoods and our lower hundred thousand dollar homes. Bowie still has a lot to offer and I do hope the city and county will do all to keep it up. Retailers and restaurants....trying to get them to this county has not been easy.

Originally Posted by bowian

I definitely agree with you on many counts. Some of those unruly kids in the million dollar neighborhoods could very well be Section 8 kids, just like they could be wealthy kids, foster kids, etc.

Hung out at Waugh Chapel this past weekend. The layout is growing on me, but too much traffic is blocking the entrance without a smooth flow. Definitely nicer stores and restaurants than BTC and Woodmore Town Centre. We ate at Houlihan's, and it was good (and crowded). There were teens and families walking around. The entire place was very busy. BTC needs more of that.

Youre both right. Unruly kids are in the so called "million dollar" homes (400,000 now post recession). However, working in Probation, you see a lot of things.. A lot of those homes that people think you own really dont own, majority rent them. A lot of them rent to Section 8. If The Johnsons are losing their home, rent it out to Section 8, that is guarantee money from the Govt, and the family only pays $700 on a $2500 mortgage. If the owner is smart the voucher pays teh mortgage and they can pocket extra $$$. It happens.

I have so many youth in Fairwood, Collington Station, Devonshire that are Section 8 families as well as the folks in the BelairTown Section and Pointer Ridge in Bowie that are section 8... Bowie, Laurel, and UM took a huge hit with the million dollar homes post recession, UM is doing well (rural, quiet area), Laurel is doing well recovering also (ICC, LTC building).. Bowie is more lagging due to less building of services and goods.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by EducatedBro82

Youre both right. Unruly kids are in the so called "million dollar" homes (400,000 now post recession). However, working in Probation, you see a lot of things.. A lot of those homes that people think you own really dont own, majority rent them. A lot of them rent to Section 8. If The Johnsons are losing their home, rent it out to Section 8, that is guarantee money from the Govt, and the family only pays $700 on a $2500 mortgage. If the owner is smart the voucher pays teh mortgage and they can pocket extra $$$. It happens.

I have so many youth in Fairwood, Collington Station, Devonshire that are Section 8 families as well as the folks in the BelairTown Section and Pointer Ridge in Bowie that are section 8... Bowie, Laurel, and UM took a huge hit with the million dollar homes post recession, UM is doing well (rural, quiet area), Laurel is doing well recovering also (ICC, LTC building).. Bowie is more lagging due to less building of services and goods.

You figure there would be a cap on square footage for Section 8 applications. should the government really be footing the bill for a family of 4 in a 4500sq ft home?

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

You figure there would be a cap on square footage for Section 8 applications. should the government really be footing the bill for a family of 4 in a 4500sq ft home?

I attempted section 8 with my condo and almost every call I got was someone asking if my property was a house. People seem as though they try to get the biggest things they can.

The other thing to consider though is it's difficult to be too restrictive about Section 8 because it's really up to the landlord if they even want to do it. It's not like you can guarantee that people with smaller homes will join the program.

[North Beach Person]

Section 8 can be a good deal for the landlords, a significant portion of the rent guaranteed.

We have one condo here which started life right before the meltdown as a "luxury lifestyle". Prices bought in at $400K and up for 600 or so sq. ft., Bay view.

Very few were sold, mostly to pre-buyers (the units really aren't "luxury". Things like builder grade appliances, finishes, etc. but remember how crazy everyone was 6 or 8 years ago.). The meltdown hit and nothing sold.

It's about 70% rental now (47 units total) and the vast majority of the rentals are Section 8.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by North Beach Person

Section 8 can be a good deal for the landlords, a significant portion of the rent guaranteed.

We have one condo here which started life right before the meltdown as a "luxury lifestyle". Prices bought in at $400K and up for 600 or so sq. ft., Bay view.

Very few were sold, mostly to pre-buyers (the units really aren't "luxury". Things like builder grade appliances, finishes, etc. but remember how crazy everyone was 6 or 8 years ago.). The meltdown hit and nothing sold.

It's about 70% rental now (47 units total) and the vast majority of the rentals are Section 8.

Same thing happened with my condo, which is why I considered section 8. I figured that maybe the only tenants I could attract. Maryland needs to do a better job taking care of condos, because this is becoming a big issue across the board.

[North Beach Person]

Originally Posted by pgtvatitans

Same thing happened with my condo, which is why I considered section 8. I figured that maybe the only tenants I could attract. Maryland needs to do a better job taking care of condos, because this is becoming a big issue across the board.

Well, rentals proliferating is an issue everywhere in the state. People wanted sell, no one was buying except in investors.


We also have a high-dollar townhouse development on property the Town annexed (just for that reason. The annexation changed the Critical Area designation from 1/20 acres to IDA). The houses started out at $600K and up. The final units are being built and are going for $240K+/-. They originally thought that the rental rate would be low. It's now at around 25% of units being rented and goes up every month. Overall North Beach is 52% rentals, up from 22% in 2004.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by North Beach Person

Well, rentals proliferating is an issue everywhere in the state. People wanted sell, no one was buying except in investors.


We also have a high-dollar townhouse development on property the Town annexed (just for that reason. The annexation changed the Critical Area designation from 1/20 acres to IDA). The houses started out at $600K and up. The final units are being built and are going for $240K+/-. They originally thought that the rental rate would be low. It's now at around 25% of units being rented and goes up every month. Overall North Beach is 52% rentals, up from 22% in 2004.

Part of that is because of FHA. For a while they made a restriction of the loans they were giving out based on the amount of rental property existed in a complex. Our complex met that standard so obviously unless you have 20% to put down no one was buying and for an older condo, it makes no sense to go conventional, so we definitely got those investors as well. They eventually did away with that restriction. I would imagine that hurt a lot of places especially places like Bowie, where like you said, investors tried to cash in.

[Khemistry]

Well, this thread has had an atomic derailment from the original topic!

[pwright1]

Imo I think there really is no excuse for PG County to not have any midend or highend retail anywhere. Sorry Macy's stores, DSW Shoes, the Golden Corral, the wig and beauty supply stores is unacceptable. And to say black people don't shop in those stores is absolutely insane. Malls like Landover Mall and Whiteflint close all the time but Montgomery County has other options for nice shopping and restaurants. Prince Georges doesn't. I use to live in DC and briefly in PG and we would always get in the car a drive out to Tysons, Montgomery and Pentagon City. Most of my shopping is done at Nordstrom and Bloomingdales. Nordstrom Rack is not the answer because 90% of its merchandise is not from any full line Nordstrom store. The county population has changed over the past 2 decades but its shopping and dining amenities haven't. What a shame. I remember when a little chinese carryout opened in Lake Arbor with bulletproof glass. Thank god the residents protested and made them take it down.

[Khemistry]

Originally Posted by pwright1

I remember when a little chinese carryout opened in Lake Arbor with bulletproof glass. Thank god the residents protested and made them take it down.

Not attempting to further derail this topic, but you brought up something interesting. I'm shocked at the level of difference in lifestyles, just within Prince George's County. I am from Northern PG County. For most of my life, I didn't have any exposure to Central or Southern PG. I remember when I first had a chance to actually walk around Central Avenue around Suitland/Silver Hill. I was in high school. I went into a supermarket and there were metal detectors at the store entrance and exit! It was such a culture shock. We don't have metal detectors at our stores in Northern PG. Can't name a single one.

Then, I had a chance to go to a few carry-outs down there. Another culture shock: the bulletproof glass you mentioned. It was so odd ordering and being served through a bulletproof glass. It was totally unfamiliar territory for me. I don't know a single carryout in Northern PG (at least in the areas I frequent), which have bulletproof glass... I mean many do, but there is usually a portion that can be opened up so the glass is not present. All the carry-outs I frequent keep them open — if they even have them at all.

It's so amazing one can travel a few miles from where they live, and have a totally different lifestyle experience. I don't think I could ever become accustomed to living someplace where metal detectors and bulletproof windows are the norm. I felt so awkward and like I was a criminal.