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So we have been having conversations about Washington Post articles talking about the declining amount of students from middle class families in the school system, and I have to say that I think the Washington Post is being a bit lazy on this topic (that shouldn't surprise anyone). The only thing they seemed to focus on was how black families are going to private schools, but I haven't seen one of their articles talk about the possibility that some of these families are just leaving the county altogether. Of course some of you may know, personally, I made that decision, but I was hoping for a more in-depth look into this. After all Charles County, for example, has a growing black population, the schools there are now majority black, is it possible that they are growing in population because a middle-class exodus out of PG? What about all those families who have been displaced because of foreclosures and subsequently moved to possibly a different region altogether? Just curious on your thoughts, do you think this is happening? Do you think we are seeing a trend? Of course there is no data to confirm our speculation, but I am just curious of everyone's initial thoughts.
Not sure this an elephant in the room but a reality. Charles County schools are majority Black as you state mostly because of PG flight. However I suspect the same issues found in PG will materialize in Charles County especially at schools north of La Plata.
The brutal truth is that middle class black kids perform worse on average than their middle class non black peers. In fact studies show they perform worse than whites on food stamps.
In PG it's easier to blame poor Blacks. When the schools start declining in Charles County that excuse will no longer be available and maybe the black middle class will be spurred into action.
i liked your article very much. black flight is the same as white flight. its about escaping dangerous communities where the local people either cannot or will not control their youth. the youth whose behavior has become criminal in large numbers.
(1) Why are we identifying the middle-class in specific?
Why I am questioning this: As we have seen with other developments that surround the DC region in concentric circle lines, we have flights of demographic groups (usually lower income minority families) as areas are gentrified and cost of living vis-a-vis property taxes become prohibitive to stay for those families. If anything, that would denote the poor are fleeing areas of PG county.
(2) Why are we making a sweeping generalization of black Americans as 'fleeing' over an area so large as PGC?
Why I am questioning this: I live in Fort Washington, which is in PGC. We are a white and asian mixed family. We live in a middle/upper middle income class community, which has an awesome large mix of racial groups, which does not reflect the average racial distribution of PGC as a whole. My neighbors, black or otherwise, are all extremely happy living where we live. There is virtually no crime in our region. My black neighbors do not feel threatened by the non-blacks in their neighborhood, and vice versa. The 'white flight' in PGC of the past was because of white fears of encroaching middle-class black families. At least for our area, we are very progressive and I see no racial tensions.
That said, schools are a concern for us as a socioeconomic group (consensus across racial lines). We all are currently (or planning to in the future) sending our children to private schools. I think WaPo is accurate in its reporting of these developments, as it explains why the figuratively and literally poor PGC public schools are overly dominated of children from socioeconomically disadvantaged families.
(1) Why are we identifying the middle-class in specific?
Why I am questioning this: As we have seen with other developments that surround the DC region in concentric circle lines, we have flights of demographic groups (usually lower income minority families) as areas are gentrified and cost of living vis-a-vis property taxes become prohibitive to stay for those families. If anything, that would denote the poor are fleeing areas of PG county.
(2) Why are we making a sweeping generalization of black Americans as 'fleeing' over an area so large as PGC?
Why I am questioning this: I live in Fort Washington, which is in PGC. We are a white and asian mixed family. We live in a middle/upper middle income class community, which has an awesome large mix of racial groups, which does not reflect the average racial distribution of PGC as a whole. My neighbors, black or otherwise, are all extremely happy living where we live. There is virtually no crime in our region. My black neighbors do not feel threatened by the non-blacks in their neighborhood, and vice versa. The 'white flight' in PGC of the past was because of white fears of encroaching middle-class black families. At least for our area, we are very progressive and I see no racial tensions.
That said, schools are a concern for us as a socioeconomic group (consensus across racial lines). We all are currently (or planning to in the future) sending our children to private schools. I think WaPo is accurate in its reporting of these developments, as it explains why the figuratively and literally poor PGC public schools are overly dominated of children from socioeconomically disadvantaged families.
The truth is:
1. African-American middle class residents are moving to Charles, Montgomery, and Howard counties.
2. Hispanics are moving to PGC (langley Park) from Montgomery and Fairfax counties.
3. Low-income to lower-income Blacks are moving from DC to PGC.
The question is why are middle-income blacks leaving PGC, a haven at one time for this demographic? I don't think there is a single factor. It may be a variety of reasons. Crime, education, cost-of-living, the housing market, employment, and financial factors all can play a role in someone making a decision to leave or stay.
On the other hand, those that have moved to the outer suburbs in Charles and Howard counties may come back in the next ten to fifteen years as more developmental focus is on the inner suburbs of the two metro areas in MD (DC and Baltimore). Charles county may very well remain a rural county for the next few decades due to the inner-suburban smart-growth focus of Maryland. If a rural feel along with its relatively cheap housing costs are what some people like, rural areas will keep or even continue to grow it's minority population. On the other hand, if it becomes increasingly expensive to live so far from job centers without job centers moving closer to the rural areas, there may be a shift back close to metro areas. Especially if PGC gets its act together on crime and education. But by then, would those who moved away be priced out? Or would they shift to areas like Prince William or Caroline counties in VA which have no plans to impede development in the rural tiers.
(1) Why are we identifying the middle-class in specific?
Why I am questioning this: As we have seen with other developments that surround the DC region in concentric circle lines, we have flights of demographic groups (usually lower income minority families) as areas are gentrified and cost of living vis-a-vis property taxes become prohibitive to stay for those families. If anything, that would denote the poor are fleeing areas of PG county.
Two things to this question. One you have to remember social economics are important to school systems which is the premise of this discussion. Looking at the original article, the county executive is more or less saying that the rising number of FARM students is negatively contributing to the success of the school system. These aren't my words, I'm just taking what he and his advisors are saying and trying to understand what conclusions they are drawing here.
The second thing is this is all about image. If the county executive has a school system that has a FARM rate of 60% or higher, there is either a perception of a poor county or a school system where the middle class and above do not send their kids there. That is a bad reflection on the county in his eyes and can be harmful when you are trying to attract businesses and young families.
Quote:
Originally Posted by molukai
(2) Why are we making a sweeping generalization of black Americans as 'fleeing' over an area so large as PGC?
Why I am questioning this: I live in Fort Washington, which is in PGC. We are a white and asian mixed family. We live in a middle/upper middle income class community, which has an awesome large mix of racial groups, which does not reflect the average racial distribution of PGC as a whole. My neighbors, black or otherwise, are all extremely happy living where we live. There is virtually no crime in our region. My black neighbors do not feel threatened by the non-blacks in their neighborhood, and vice versa. The 'white flight' in PGC of the past was because of white fears of encroaching middle-class black families. At least for our area, we are very progressive and I see no racial tensions.
That said, schools are a concern for us as a socioeconomic group (consensus across racial lines). We all are currently (or planning to in the future) sending our children to private schools. I think WaPo is accurate in its reporting of these developments, as it explains why the figuratively and literally poor PGC public schools are overly dominated of children from socioeconomically disadvantaged families.
No one is making a generalization, it is what it is. The school system is predominantly black and the economics of the families who have kids in the school system is becoming poorer and poorer. I don't think there is anything that is hidden about this, it's clear whether they are leaving to private schools or leaving the county altogether, there are a lot of students not going to county schools. When a school system like PG is shrinking in size while the population is growing, I think it is smart to look into anything and everything.
And I agree that the school system is an issue across racial lines, but my whole purpose of this discussion, is the articles the Washington Post posted never discussed people leaving for other areas. I mean there was a family that pays $3400/month to send their kids to private school and stayed in the county. The perception that came off in the article is that people are staying in the county, particularly black people, given how large the black population still is in the county. All I'm asking is if the number of kids from middle class families are declining, and this is a majority black student system, then are there examples of black families leaving? We know about white flight, that has been documented, but why is nobody talking about black middle-class flight?
Black middle class flight is very real and if you spend any time down in CC you will know it to be true. I lived in Indian Head during my teens and early adulthood. There were hardly any blacks down that direction then. It is like most sections of PGC now. They move to get away from the same crap we complain about. The school thread opened and closed today - strange. My thoughts on that were immediate.
The county banned pit bulls for no reason but people still have them. I would have an AmStaff if the other white guy on my block wasn't such an a$$. My black neighbors think it's funny that I say such as they feel the same way.
My point...if the county can ban a breed of dogs for no reason - the people of this county are more dangerous and we all know it - they can do something about the school system. I have lived in more than a few states and this county is lost in space when it comes to elected officials doing anything for their constituents, schools being of the most important. Ergo...residents hightail it out of here for what they see as greener pastures.
You know what happens to PGC next? It falls back into the sad state it was after white flight took place. Those of means are gone and there is no longer reason to make it pretty. Eastover will remain the same as will Marlow Heights, Oxon Hill, Hillcrest Heights, Suitland and other less desirable locales. The wealthiest black county in the USA will become diluted with immigrants who are given amnesty and we will all move away.
Welcome to the new America. I hope everyone enjoyed Independence Day because a lot of people are becoming dependent.
why is nobody talking about black middle-class flight?
Who is "nobody?" Who would you like to talk about this particular migration? I do a quick search on, "Black middle-class migration Prince George's County" and I pick up a good number of articles from the Post, the Examiner, a few academic study papers, census data, etc. I have heard the PGC administration mention a number of times that they would like to retain the current middle-class in the county while growing the middle-class base. It's hard to grow the middle-class base if as many people are leaving as there are coming in. I think there is no elephant. It just wasn't mentioned in this particular article.
There are countless initiatives to retain and grow the middle class. That's why Baker did what he did with the school board. That's why there is a $50 million economic fund to bring jobs to the county. That's the reason behind the casino and FBI push. That's why they are trying to build a first-class research hospital to central county. All of these initiatives are to make PGC a viable middle-class option. Some initiatives will fail, others won't. But I don't think people are unaware of what's happening to the black middle-class in the county.
Who is "nobody?" Who would you like to talk about this particular migration? I do a quick search on, "Black middle-class migration Prince George's County" and I pick up a good number of articles from the Post, the Examiner, a few academic study papers, census data, etc. I have heard the PGC administration mention a number of times that they would like to retain the current middle-class in the county while growing the middle-class base. It's hard to grow the middle-class base if as many people are leaving as there are coming in. I think there is no elephant. It just wasn't mentioned in this particular article.
There are countless initiatives to retain and grow the middle class. That's why Baker did what he did with the school board. That's why there is a $50 million economic fund to bring jobs to the county. That's the reason behind the casino and FBI push. That's why they are trying to build a first-class research hospital to central county. All of these initiatives are to make PGC a viable middle-class option. Some initiatives will fail, others won't. But I don't think people are unaware of what's happening to the black middle-class in the county.
"nobody" as in the Washington Post, the County Executive, his advisors, the school board, shall I go on? I haven't seen a great deal of information on black flight out of PG. I have heard people talking about leaving the school system, but not about black middle class families leaving the county, which I believe would be important for the school system and the county leadership to know. Even when I did a search on what you suggested, there is little to nothing about black flight out of PG. Instead there is a lot of information about blacks moving to PG and perhaps migrating out of urban areas like DC.
To say that the administration is trying to attract middle class families, is not completely accurate and is really why this is more of opinions than facts for this particular thread. Again, in the article I posted up in the OP, they admitted that they have not studied why middle class families are taking their kids out of schools. If they haven't done a study for that or a study for why they are leaving the county, then these initiatives to allegedly keep them are being done blindly. I think I remember someone making this comment somewhere, and it's so true, if you are a business and you want to find out how to keep customers, wouldn't it be wise to figure out why they might leave? If you don't have anything definitive to go by to back up the reasoning of your ways to convince those individuals to stay, then who is to say that it will be successful? I mean nothing says middle class families like casinos, low paying jobs, and traffic right?
If you have any articles that you have found on this topic, please do post them, I think it would add to the discussion.
This has been a very interesting thread.. as my husband, 10yr old son and I are thinking of moving from Rockville and buying a home in PG or Accokeek. I have never lived outside of Montgomery county so I am very very nervous. Thanks for the discussion.
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