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My family owns property in Rappahannock County, VA. That area is southern. But DC and NoVa? There may be some remaining vestiges of Old Southern DC still there, but it's being gobbled up by Urban Northeast Corridor DC.
D.C. and Maryland are southern in the same way that Missouri, Kentucky, Virginia, Delaware and West Virginia are southern. These states started industrializing at the same time much of the north industrialized. This is the reason cities like Richmond, D.C., Baltimore, Louisville, Wilmington, St. Louis and Kansas City look like their counterparts in the Northeast and the Midwest. During the slavery period slaves were treated totally different, often as skilled labor who could sometimes earn their own money and buy their freedom. These states also had large free black populations with Maryland and Delaware having nearly fifty percent of their black population being free. During the Jim Crow era some places were segregated and others were not. In D.C. and Baltimore you could ride anywhere on the bus and trolly but things like the amusement park at Glen Echo were segregated. The border south desegregated in the 40's and 50's with no major outbreak from the native white population, unlike the lower south. The accents of the native white and black population of the upper south has never sounded like the lower south's accent so you cannot compare accents. Most of the heavy southern twang that you hear coming out of the black community usually comes from the first and second generation decendant of North Carolinians and other lower Southerns. In conclusion how could the Chesapeake not be the south when it is the creator of southern culture and southern royalty with names like Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, Francis Scott Key, The Blair family and many others. Black royalty includes Benjamin Bannaker, Fredrick Douglass, Nat Turner and Harriet Tubman. Trying to compare the upper south to the lower south is like comparing tabacco to cotton. The Chesapeake and border states culture is neither like the Northeast and upper midwest nor the lower south and any native Washingtonian can tell you that
It seems pretty clear that the only arguments in favor of DC being southern involve vestiges from centuries ago. I've, personally, never heard Jefferson, Washington, or Key referred to as southern and I'm not sure how they differentiate really from the patriots of Boston from that same era. Jefferson was clearly Virginian back in a time when people put a strong sense of identity into their home state before the U.S. became unified, but one would be hard pressed to link him to the conservatism and religiosity most associate with southern culture.
I'm sorry, but in the end, the most southern thing about DC is the fact that it's the southern anchor of the Northeast corridor. It was created out of nothing to be a middle point between the north and south, so certainly has elements that reflect that, but for the past century it has had significantly more in common with Boston, NY, and Philly than anything south of it.
You can call DC Mid Atlantic or whatever but it is not the south and anyone from the real south would tell you it does not feel like home in DC, Baltimore, or even rural or suburban Maryland. The density of people alone along with all of the foot traffic downtown cannot be found in the south. I do understand the historical argument but that is no longer valid today. The DMV have a whole different culture from the south. The weather is not the same, food is not the same, homes and buildings aren't the same, and even the accents are not the same.
The Southern Gentleman has spoken! Not sure there can be any debate left on the subject after that.
Though, I must ask, where in the world did you get the idea that Columbia, SC, of all places, is the same size as DC? Even comparing just city to city DC's about 5 times as large. Metro area, and you're comparing the 8th largest metro in the country (slightly larger than Atlanta and a whole lot larger if you include Baltimore) to an MSA of about 750,000.
Also - it's a peculiar southern trait to deem places "southern" or not, even if they're smack dab in the middle of it (like Atlanta). It's not like Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, New York, Philly etc... became southern just because millions of southerners moved there.
The metro area of Columbia, about 750,000 is in comparable size of the city of DC and arlington areas, not the whole DC metro. But it was just a rough estimate in a quick time.
And also, Atlanta is still a southern city, just it is becoming less southern because more northern and midwest transplants are moving there. Compare a wealthy Atlanta suburb to a wealthy suburb of Jackson, Mississippi. They are very different because of the more transplants in Georgia than Miss.
And there is absolutely no way that Chicago, Detroit , Cleveland, New York, or Philly are southern! Southern culture is traditionally associated with the southern whites, not the southern blacks.
And there is absolutely no way that Chicago, Detroit , Cleveland, New York, or Philly are southern! Southern culture is traditionally associated with the southern whites, not the southern blacks.
Plenty of southern whites moved to Chicago. Check out the history of the Uptown neighborhood.
And there is absolutely no way that Chicago, Detroit , Cleveland, New York, or Philly are southern! Southern culture is traditionally associated with the southern whites, not the southern blacks.
Wow. I personally know a lot of southern blacks in this area who would adamently, passionately, and vehemently disagree with you. They're more connected to their southern roots and culture than any of the white southerners I know living here. The whites may mention their homestate once in a while without much sense of difference, but the black friends regularly point out the differences in culture or talk about life back in Mississippi or Louisiana or Alabama or wherever they're from.
And I don't think it's fair to compare a metro area to such a small single city. Might as well compare Green Bay to Dallas. It's not like Tysons, Bethesda, Dulles, Silver Spring, etc... aren't part of our lives and culture here.
Anyway - I don't mean to sound harsh, if that's how this is coming across. Sometimes hard to convey tone when speaking matter-of-factly on here, but I enjoy your perspectives.
The metro area of Columbia, about 750,000 is in comparable size of the city of DC and arlington areas, not the whole DC metro. But it was just a rough estimate in a quick time.
And also, Atlanta is still a southern city, just it is becoming less southern because more northern and midwest transplants are moving there. Compare a wealthy Atlanta suburb to a wealthy suburb of Jackson, Mississippi. They are very different because of the more transplants in Georgia than Miss.
And there is absolutely no way that Chicago, Detroit , Cleveland, New York, or Philly are southern! Southern culture is traditionally associated with the southern whites, not the southern blacks.
Well not to be picky. Even if you're not counting outer suburbs DC and Columbia are still not comparable. Arlington and the District alone that's over 800,000 people. Then you've got all the other little inner-beltway suburbs.
Are we seriously comparing Columbia, SC to Washington, D.C.?
Whats next Cleveland vs New York City?
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