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Unread 10-21-2011, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC
1,632 posts, read 1,290,116 times
Reputation: 1047
Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
What an arrogant and misinformed statement. Federal macroeconomic and tax policy has a proven impact on the plight of businesses and labor. Actions (or lack thereof) by the US Federal Reserve can cause the economy to over-heat or not generate enough employment and private-sector investment. Numerous studies have shown that federal government policy has exacerbated income inequality while create disincentives for employers to add labor to payrolls.
You're going to have to explain this one to me. The question was: "to what do you attribute low approval ratings". To which I answered "bad economy, people are looking for something to blame". I didn't touch on the effect of federal policy on employment and private sector investment; obviously federal policy has an effect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
So if you want to engage in a numbers game, I can pull numbers from think tank reports, research books and the like. Of course, the authors will have a more liberal and left-ward bent but I am sure you can pull different numbers from more conservative outfits.
As I've said many times before, I tend to shy away from data that has passed through the filter of an organization with a political bent. They are very good at providing their target audience the answers that they want to hear, and very bad at providing objective information. It's irresponsible to use them as your primary source of information if you're being honest.

If you go back to primary source information, numbers are no longer a game; they are just numbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
Right because everyone has a degree in mathematics, accounting and economics. Every adult citizen is capable of reading pages and pages of federal department balance sheets and understanding mathematical equations that explain how certain items are calculated. Are you serious with this response?
You are outrageously overestimating the effort it takes to access and understand the information. It takes an internet connection and maybe a few hours if you are starting from scratch and want to really get into the details. If you just want a 10 minute cliff's notes version you can follow USAspending.gov or recovery.gov to see where federal resources are being allocated.

It's not interesting, it's not exciting, but is that really an insurmountable effort to educate yourself if you actually care?

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
So, please, KStreetQB explain how dim-witted, irrational, slobbering Mongoloid Americans should be more engaged in politics. I want an Inside-the-Beltway perspective here.
I don't think every American has a responsibility to be a policy wonk. I don't think it makes sense. I wouldn't spend much time on it unless I worked in health policy.

What I do think, is that if you are politically engaged on an issue, and are spending your time, emotion and resources on it, then you have a responsibility to educate yourself on it and wield your first amendment rights with responsibility.

Now if someone were to say; "In FY'11 $43.3 billion (10.38%) of federal contracts went to Virginia; that's too much for one state", that's a conversation worth having. If someone says "DC region is a trillionaire parasite sucking money away from the rest of the states", and is wholly incapable of providing any context to frame their position, then that is damaging to the public discourse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
Believe or not...normal mentally healthy people can be outraged about something. Yeah, it's true...I know it is hard for politico-world wonks to believe this.
Oh I agree. Increasingly, that's all they are capable of. I've seen that outrage directly derail good policy in my field.

If you are going to call your Representatives office and scream at them about funding 'death panels', you have a patriotic responsibility to find out exactly what a voluntary advance directive consultation is.

If you are going to call your Representative's office and scream at them about rationing in health care, then you have the patriotic responsibility to find out exactly how best practices and comparative effectiveness actually mean to our health system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldbliss View Post
There are people out there (beyond the Beltway) who are struggling in life; whether it be chronic unemployment, overwhelming medical bills, student loan debt or some of other critical issue. Some people make ill-advised choices in life and they pay the consequences. But there are many people who lost jobs, lost health care insurance, lost their homes, lost their lifetime savings because of forces beyond their control. And there is no doubt that government policy and/or market-driven greed played a part in the suffering.

The Right is outraged at the federal government. The Left is outraged at the capitalistic system. Just maybe, there is some merit supporting the arguments made by liberals AND conservatives in this nation.
My point is not that these things haven't happened. My point is that a big part of the public policy quagmire is directly attributable to a misinformed, highly manipulated and highly vocal public. The public discourse is overwhelmingly occurring in an environment devoid of facts, defined by pejoratives and guided by unaccountable information sources. I cannot begin to explain how profound of an impact that has on what happens in DC.

 
Unread 10-21-2011, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Montgomery Village
3,911 posts, read 1,563,080 times
Reputation: 1579
My point is why are you guys b*tching about normal middle class people going to work everyday just so they can pay bills and live and be productive members of society. That in federal workers and the contractors in the area. The best and brightest come here because there are jobs and the private sector is growing as well. Believe it or not the vast majority of people working in the DC Metro area are not filthy rich lawyer lobbyists. If we were we'd all be riding around in our Ferraris sipping on lattes from a Starbucks in Chevy Chase. I call it longing schadenfreude.

"I wish all those middle class folks in the DC area lose their jobs or get paid 1/3 less so it makes me feel better about myself because I think they secretly plot to turn this country into defacto serfdom." Smart people are going to go where the money is and work. You guys make it sound like everyone losing their jobs here will miracously make the economy better and give you a raise. sheesh.
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 01:34 PM
Status: "D.C. Totally Rox!" (set 14 days ago)
 
5,024 posts, read 1,605,537 times
Reputation: 1431
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
The current economic situation in the U.S. is a result of greed and unrealistic expectations on the part of the banking, mortgage and real estate industries in conjunction with property flippers and homebuyers who bought way more than they could afford. The bubble and subsequent crash has had a ripple effect across the whole economy. Everybody was looking for a win-win, but instread got lose-lose.

But that's a discussion that belongs on another forum.
I notice you left out "government bureaucrat".

How convenient!
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 01:35 PM
Status: "D.C. Totally Rox!" (set 14 days ago)
 
5,024 posts, read 1,605,537 times
Reputation: 1431
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC Bossman View Post
I love how greed is only associated with DoD contractors or big banks and not with some of the American people at all. Thousands of people taking on subprime mortgages to get homes they knew they could not afford doesn't qualify as 'greed' at all. They were all victimized Whatever happened to having an ounce of self responsibility? The blame game thing gets old. Let's not pretend like the "poor helpless americans" didn't play a role in this mess as well.
It was Congress that forced banks to lend to unqualified individuals because "home-ownership is a right".

Mr. Barney Frank is not a private employee, y'know...
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 01:41 PM
Status: "D.C. Totally Rox!" (set 14 days ago)
 
5,024 posts, read 1,605,537 times
Reputation: 1431
Quote:
Originally Posted by btsilver View Post
My point is why are you guys b*tching about normal middle class people going to work everyday just so they can pay bills and live and be productive members of society. That in federal workers and the contractors in the area. The best and brightest come here because there are jobs and the private sector is growing as well. Believe it or not the vast majority of people working in the DC Metro area are not filthy rich lawyer lobbyists. If we were we'd all be riding around in our Ferraris sipping on lattes from a Starbucks in Chevy Chase. I call it longing schadenfreude.

"I wish all those middle class folks in the DC area lose their jobs or get paid 1/3 less so it makes me feel better about myself because I think they secretly plot to turn this country into defacto serfdom." Smart people are going to go where the money is and work. You guys make it sound like everyone losing their jobs here will miracously make the economy better and give you a raise. sheesh.
I want the 20% of D.C. Federal workers who are highly trained and work hard to ADD something POSITIVE to America to keep their jobs (and perhaps get a raise as well).

I want the 20% of Feds and contractors who, literally, are leeches on the American economy to lose their jobs immediately. I PAY FOR THESE SLUGS!

Regarding the other 60% of D.C. area residents who are either working fully in the private sector or unemployed I have no opinion because I don't directly pay for them. Those people are no different than the people of any other city in America.

How is it wrong to want to take out the (economic) trash?
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Montgomery Village
3,911 posts, read 1,563,080 times
Reputation: 1579
Quote:
Originally Posted by clb10 View Post
I want the 20% of D.C. Federal workers who are highly trained and work hard to ADD something POSITIVE to America to keep their jobs (and perhaps get a raise as well).
awwww.
So for those 20% of federal worker who are highly trained and work hard, how do you know that they do not add something positive to America? What do you do to contribute to American society that you think is so productive.


Quote:
Originally Posted by clb10 View Post
I want the 20% of Feds and contractors who, literally, are leeches on the American economy to lose their jobs immediately. I PAY FOR THESE SLUGS!
Once again, that's your opinion on whether or not they are leeches or not. They pay taxes too. Once again, they are just going to work and doing their job to pay the bills. I'm pretty sure they don't wake up and think to themselves "Hmm, I wonder what I can do to cheat clb10 out of his hard earned tax money... Well at least the 1% of his tax money that actually goes to pay for us...MUHAHAHAH" Mighty nice of you to call tens of thousands of contractors slugs. Stay classy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by clb10 View Post
Regarding the other 60% of D.C. area residents who are either working fully in the private sector or unemployed I have no opinion because I don't directly pay for them. Those people are no different than the people of any other city in America.

How is it wrong to want to take out the (economic) trash?
Nice of you to call working middle class people economic trash. Where are you from and what do you do that is so much better than everyone else in the DMV?
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 02:49 PM
 
699 posts, read 457,856 times
Reputation: 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by btsilver View Post
My point is why are you guys b*tching about normal middle class people going to work everyday just so they can pay bills and live and be productive members of society. That in federal workers and the contractors in the area. The best and brightest come here because there are jobs and the private sector is growing as well. Believe it or not the vast majority of people working in the DC Metro area are not filthy rich lawyer lobbyists. If we were we'd all be riding around in our Ferraris sipping on lattes from a Starbucks in Chevy Chase. I call it longing schadenfreude.

"I wish all those middle class folks in the DC area lose their jobs or get paid 1/3 less so it makes me feel better about myself because I think they secretly plot to turn this country into defacto serfdom." Smart people are going to go where the money is and work. You guys make it sound like everyone losing their jobs here will miracously make the economy better and give you a raise. sheesh.
DC metro sports the highest median income in the country flat out, straight up. Please put my comments in context, I said a secretary making 80k of tax payer funds is unfair to those in other parts of the country that struggle to make ends meet while performing the same work. I get smart people come here to work (really they are just people looking to do 20 years and retire but I digress).....where exactly do you think this money is coming from? DC isn't exactly selling a product and turning a profit. Who pays the salary of the 80k secretary?

Also I question the assertion that DC has the best and brightest compared to Wall Street or Silicon Valley. I see no comparison.
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 03:03 PM
 
8,858 posts, read 6,315,752 times
Reputation: 5121
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicnice View Post
Also I question the assertion that DC has the best and brightest compared to Wall Street or Silicon Valley. I see no comparison.
Silicon Valley sucks. I'd rather eat clay for a living than live there, or anywhere on the west coast.
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 03:28 PM
 
Location: Montgomery Village
3,911 posts, read 1,563,080 times
Reputation: 1579
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicnice View Post
DC metro sports the highest median income in the country flat out, straight up. Please put my comments in context, I said a secretary making 80k of tax payer funds is unfair to those in other parts of the country that struggle to make ends meet while performing the same work. I get smart people come here to work (really they are just people looking to do 20 years and retire but I digress).....where exactly do you think this money is coming from? DC isn't exactly selling a product and turning a profit. Who pays the salary of the 80k secretary?

Also I question the assertion that DC has the best and brightest compared to Wall Street or Silicon Valley. I see no comparison.
I am putting your comments in context. Do you know what the cost of living here is? The secretary is doing a job. She's not here to steal your tax payer money. She's here to work. Just like most of the people you try to try to describe here. Which company pays 80k for secretaries in DC? Anyway. I assume you expect the government to run for free.
Like I said, there are jobs here, and people are going to come here to work them because they pay money. I don't see people flocking to Detroit. I don't see people flocking to Las Vegas. Oh and do believe it that some of the best and brightest do come here to work. That's just fact. The world is not perfect but unless you have a better plan, not try to knock the people that come here to work.
 
Unread 10-21-2011, 03:35 PM
 
656 posts, read 127,561 times
Reputation: 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
Silicon Valley sucks. I'd rather eat clay for a living than live there, or anywhere on the west coast.
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