What's Up with DC Restaurants? (Washington: university, taxi driver, live)

[Mr Beco]

Originally Posted by slim04

I find DC restauranting scene to be more corporate than a lot of other cities. The restaurants are funded by investment partnerships who often partner with well known chefs from other cities or bring concepts that were successful elsewhere. So these are really businesses designed to make a profit to take advantage of the amount of expense account business that happens around here.

Those great mid-range restaurants in other cities are often restaurants that were founded by families and grew from strong word of mouth. They aren't run by financial professionals. My favorite Italian restaurant in Chicago had this amazing appetizer that was their most popular dish and what they were known for. They never raised the price for it in over 10 years, despite almost every diner ordering it and probably would be willing to pay more for it. At a corporate place, they would double the price of it.

The only real family owned type restaurants I see in this area are Chinese, Vietnamese, Thai, El Salvordorean, Ethiopian etc. Those are the best bargains you can find.

Baltimore has that neighborhood restaurant feel, DC does not, overall. We don't have a little Italy, and our China Town is very small, its whats missing

[dbau12]

Only DC natives or people with too much money would go so far out of the way to deny the obvious. I've lived here and dined all over the city for the past 6 years. It IS overpriced, and furthermore a lot of the restaurants have no idea what they're doing with their food. It's a city filled with inequality and oblivious urbanites. I've been to nice places with my work, I've been to "casual dining" places, dives and diners. All pretty substandard, although if you're willing to pay top dollar for something that someone in NYC, Chicago, Albuquerque or Austin could cook you for half the price, you'll certainly get what you pay for. Honestly, out of anywhere I've visited in the US in terms of large urban centers, DC has some of the absolute worst food at the absolute worst prices. It's extortion.

[DCforever]

When my friends from Austin, Chicago and NewYork come the often marvel at the diversity of our restaurant scene. It really is second only to New York. You get better BBQ in Austin and better deep dish pizza in Chicago, but that really isn't the comparison. When I get back to DC from a road trip I always am greatful for how few chain restaurants we have to contend with in DC.

[dcallday]

Originally Posted by dbau12

Only DC natives or people with too much money would go so far out of the way to deny the obvious. I've lived here and dined all over the city for the past 6 years. It IS overpriced, and furthermore a lot of the restaurants have no idea what they're doing with their food. It's a city filled with inequality and oblivious urbanites. I've been to nice places with my work, I've been to "casual dining" places, dives and diners. All pretty substandard, although if you're willing to pay top dollar for something that someone in NYC, Chicago, Albuquerque or Austin could cook you for half the price, you'll certainly get what you pay for. Honestly, out of anywhere I've visited in the US in terms of large urban centers, DC has some of the absolute worst food at the absolute worst prices. It's extortion.

You put Austin and Albuquerque ahead of DC?? You have now lost all credibility partner. Smfh

[halfamazing]

Originally Posted by dbau12

Only DC natives or people with too much money would go so far out of the way to deny the obvious.

I've lived here and dined all over the city for the past 6 years. It IS overpriced, and furthermore a lot of the restaurants have no idea what they're doing with their food.

Honestly, out of anywhere I've visited in the US in terms of large urban centers, DC has some of the absolute worst food at the absolute worst prices. It's extortion.

Originally Posted by DCforever

When my friends from Austin, Chicago and NewYork come the often marvel at the diversity of our restaurant scene. It really is second only to New York.

When I get back to DC from a road trip I always am grateful for how few chain restaurants we have to contend with in DC.

I am just taking notes. Don't mind me but do you see how the two posts are so extreme. They both speak in absolute terms. They are not merely passing mild opinions. They speak with somewhat great certainty.

At the end of the day, we don't normally question greatness or purity. Only when it is not of greatness and or purity do we question the reasons for it not being so. But in DC, on both forums, articles, and in person, it seems that the "truth", which lies somewhere in the middle between the absolutists, never reveals itself.

The idea is not for me to continuously undermine or hate DC. But as I said before, if something is no great and not without question, we should strive to figure out the reasons and also understand who are the ones that find fault in it. This way, we can improve. But instead, many of us take lazy action and dissmiss those that question. Understanbably, the questions come in the form of harsh negativity and can reasonable cause some to be defensive. But at the end of the day, when questioned, one should want to know where this question stems from.

[halfamazing]

Believe it or not, doing some nightclub/consultation here in DC, I am crossing referencing some of the same responses in person when speaking to managers and staff to what I see on these threads. I am seeing a connection here.

Originally Posted by nasridian

Okay, so I have to finally rant about this particular scene in DC. I can't hold back any longer after having paid $27 for lunch yesterday for what was basically a glass of water, a dried out stuffed chile, beet soup and leaks - yeah, that's it for 27 bucks.

OP has gripe and goes as far as to list 7 venues in DC. Ok, we need to address and find out why does he and so many others have this issue. And if they are found to be legit, how we can improve his and the others' experiences.

Originally Posted by DC Bossman

Are you visiting or do you live in the area? Either way you should seek recommendations next time. Most those places you listed are where tourists who don't know any better end up. It's like any other major city there will be a lot of overpriced bad restaurants the closer to downtown you are but there are also a lot of good restaurants if you know where to go.

It just so happens that these 7 restaurants are in "touristy" areas but the OP is being told that he has to "research" good restaurants- especially closer to downtown. Apparently you can't simply walk into downtown city center and enjoy the taste of DC. You have to spend 15 hrs asking around and going online. You can't simply venture and even after 7 Restaurants, OP IS NOT DOING ENOUGH RESEARCH. That's a certainly an issue to be looked at.

Originally Posted by stateofnature

I 100% agree with the last post. You hit up all the tourist places. It's like going to times square and expecting a good fairly priced meal.
Vinoteca isn't that touristy, but its a wine bar. I would never go there for the food.
Hit up yelp.com/dc and look at the restaurants that people from here like. There are tons of good places. There are also a ton of cheap great ethnic restaurants in the suburbs.

Again, being told he is going to touristy places but now also is being told to go to the suburbs despite his gripe being with DC itself. Again, a problem.

Originally Posted by JEB77

Seems to me the OP is feeling bitter about DC at the moment, but maybe the cognoscenti should provide some specific recommendations of good, non-touristy places. I assume the OP doesn't want to travel to the suburbs, as it's pretty well-known that there are some relatively good and inexpensive, and frequently ethnic, dining options there.

Again, being redirected to the burbs. What is wrong with DC? Why can't he stay in DC? Isn't this a DC rant about DC restaurants inside of DC thread? Once again, problematic.

Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer

It's funny, but on the NYC board people complain about the same thing. The more expensive restaurants have smaller proportions of food. Go figure.

Here we have a statement which reads- "you can say the same thing about any other city". They are indirectly telling him to leave DC into the suburbs but then every other city is like DC.

Originally Posted by PhenomenalAJ

Why are you going to these upscale yuppie places then complaining about them? I usually hit up good decently priced cheap meals of all types and ethnicities in the suburbs. Going to a restaurant in the highest rent areas, they have to overcharge on food to make rent. Look up the Washingtonian site for Cheap Eats or Yelp

These posters fail to realize that they keep pushing the OP to the suburbs and indirectly and not addressing the DC restaurant scene. It's an issue.

So unfortunately for the OP, it seems as that the good places ARE ALL IN THE SUBURBS (OUTSIDE OF DC) and he is not looking hard enough despite all the money and time spent patronizing these venues. This means that to many, DC actually means the DC area as a whole, which is an aka for DMV, which also mildly indicates that DC itself, has no true identity.

[halfamazing]

Originally Posted by stateofnature

A drive from DC to say, Arlington, would be a drive within city limits of most cities. It really makes no sense to compare city limits DC to other cities who haven't had their boundaries fixed by a unique federal political arrangement.
If you were to look at the DC area's restaurants in a similar geographic range to the size of other cities with similar population sizes---a range that would go well beyond District borders--I think you will find a similar amount of diversity in types of restaurants and price options.

Now, this statement does make a lot of sense. It makes total sense. It is like limiting NY's scene to the meat packing district and not taking into considerations the other areas. Totally fair point. But if we are discussing Long Island's food scene, are we going to tap into woodside Queens to justify its boundaries?

See to me, if DC has its own thread, if DC is getting the waterfront, if DC is getting the city center, if DC is getting revamped, if DC wants to be on par, wants to be world class, wants to be a boom town, why bring Arlington or Alexandria into the picture? Not having a go but I fail to see why we need to reroute the points being made to other cities with their own brand and culture.

[halfamazing]

Originally Posted by BillH

DC also suffers from a conservative populace, conservative fashion choices and a bunch of chains (again, there is a Potbelly on every other block in DC). DC's only real trump card is it's international populace. Ethiopian is probably the only area that DC truly excels in and has an advantage in over most of the country.

Originally Posted by BillH

4. DC area restaurants do tend to be overpriced and bland for what you get. Good ethnic food is more flavorful, fresher and more cheap in NYC and LA. The blandness comes from the conservative gov't worker populace. They don't really prefer interesting, innovative food like other cities. Chains (although hopefully the better ones) dominate the DMV. There's practically a Potbelly's on every other corner in DC.

Now this is what I am interested in. Understanding why there is a rant on the DC food scene and where this comes from. I see it as no different than the nightclub industry for the most part.

As I have said before my experiences and knowledge in living in many countries to include living in Miami for 10 years and from NY, I have been exposed to many nightclubs and music trends. Because of this, I have been consulting as a music manager for some here in the DC that area in the red.

I have noticed that packed nightclubs or music lounges isn't an indicator of a venue having a true identity. There a many places that receive business by "default" due to their location and proximity to other venues along the major strips. Sure, this can be said about all cities but DC currently doesn't have a dance scene that attracts nightclub developers to cultivate the scene. It's just a place for guests to appear. Yes, the general party crowd can come down here and have a great time at these bars and lounges. They can come in and out of DC and there are no cover charges for so many of these venues. Keep in mind that many are 18+. However, when it comes to nightclub culture, it suffers immensely. Many venues are in the Red and many don't have their own identity. From when I first got here, I wondered if the government mentality bled into the businesses or if there was a direct link to how these business owners thought. And upon research, there is a direct correlation.

In order to consult, I have to visit competitors and research venues in the area. I also have to research the local booking agents and if their roster banks consist of djs and acts that pair with the local scene. If their roster only consists of techno djs, pairing a vocal house venue with a techno dj just "to be on par" with the underground scene is not creating identity- even if there is a good turn out. This is what is happening and why nights are turning over from hip hop to top40 to dance and failing here in DC. There is no identity and or sticking plan. They just go with the wind. The local booking agents haven't tapped into a diverse group of djs outside of DC to help cultivate the "mid-range" dance venues here (outside of commercial and extreme underground acts). Most people fall into the mid-range style of music but the venues that do well are those that went from dance to top40.

What I noticed when I go to these clubs is that I am surrounded by what I consider the "children and cousins of expats" along with educated/well versed cool people. There aren't true underground folk that have lived and been exposed to the underground culture as a lifestyle. They are underground on weekends or for those 3 hours at the club but don't carry that mentality. Just good down to earth young adults that have educated and wealthy parents. Many of the latins in the mix look like immigrants with good hard working parents that haven't trully been americanized. There is no city trend, style, vibe, or bad asses. It's not a good look when a venue is playing full on techno to a crowd in suits and cocktail dresses.

Even for for those top40 clubs that are just making it, the themes aren't really wow! There is no talent behind the dancers, the technicians, the djs, the promotion groups. It's just a we are throwing a party and you show up. No going beyond the norm. There isn't a reason to go far when your business is by default. There is no strive to make things bigger, better, faster than last year. It's copacetic. Promotion groups are with limited budgets for any real acts or themes because they don't bring anything more than just a party and dj. They don't need to. Their events are by default.

The ones that are struggling, they aren't making any movements to go beyond sticking point. They hope everything falls into place. This past Ramadan was an eye opener. There excuse is "it's always dead like this". But when they get a new demographic, they cut djs, and tell the djs to play hard core rap to keep the "blacks" because they will "save us tonight". Who suffers? The bouncers, the floor crews, the door men, the djs, and bartenders because tips are less and there isn't more money coming in. But these are the same owners that don't want to promote, don't want to charge at the door, don't want to go beyond the norm. It's like this in many of the venues around here.

But this mentality of course comes from somewhere. It's a sense of non-hustle. Other cities with major nightclub venues don't settle for this because the people that create and cultivate the scene aren't children of expats. They are hustlers. The djs from these cities are making moves from ground up. But here, many djs are given keys to nightclubs and have no idea how to cultivate it.

This is a promoter in miami. He actually starts nights from the ground up to include having meeting with other promoters and being part of structural development of the venue. It's not just showing up and throwing a party. It's work and hustle. DC should be able to do this but general hustle isn't there. There are djs here that were handed over keys to nightclubs and they are just sitting there because nobody around them has a clue.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ockY1Haoaqk


So essentially, it comes down to who is patronizing these restaurants. Is there a reason to drive all the way to the burbs just for good inexpensive food? And after 7 restaurants, should it mean that one isn't looking deep enough? Can't find friendly people, you are looking in the wrong neighbor hoods, can't find the right type of women, you aren't researching hard enough. DC isn't that big for all this digging.

As for myself, I don't have a problem with the food here in this area. I eat anything and everything off the menu. I am happy with chain restaurants However, for those that really know their ways around the restaurant world, it is interesting to read their takes on it.

[halfamazing]

I'm sorry to hog this post but I have to make one other point. In another thread, someone is looking to come to DC for the weekend. As per them, "In philly we normally just try out local restaurants and go to free local events". This means that they simply "try out" in the city that they actually live in.

That being said, I would gather that many also come to "try" here in DC rather than fully research. So if one happened to "try" all of the 7 restaurants the OP listed, would it be fair to DC itself to cast these venues off as "touristy places" and that the visitors don't know any better? See what I'm getting at?

So essentially, what it comes down to is in order for one to find the good stuff in DC, you have to be a native, do a lot of research and dig deep, and go to the suburbs.

[PK12]

DC itself is good for steakhouses, seafood, sushi, Italian, Greek, Mediterranean and Ethiopian... all of which trend upscale, other than Ethiopian.

Most ethnic food is best found in the suburbs - Fairfax, Annandale, Falls Church, Springfield, Rockville, Silver Spring