Tx Governor trying to steal Washington jobs (homes, unemployed)

[AzDreamer]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

Thirty years ago a regular family could afford to live in Washington and have a good sized house with a big yard and have a decent, if humble quality of life. Today, thanks to the influx of wealthy people to the state if you aren't in the upper middle class at least you have to live in a small apartment or trailer park.

Thirty years ago the government didn't take 50% of the people's income.

The natural situation for mankind is poverty. It's a few individuals that through their inventiveness has raised our living standards. Now you want to punish them. Don't blame your failures on the few that have made everything you covet possible.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

Thirty years ago a regular family could afford to live in Washington and have a good sized house with a big yard and have a decent, if humble quality of life. Today, thanks to the influx of wealthy people to the state if you aren't in the upper middle class at least you have to live in a small apartment or trailer park.

When the mayor of Seattle says that 55,000 a year is low income there is a serious problem.

I believe you were referring to Washington as in Washington State...

Of course, Seattle is expensive... so is San Francisco, New York etc... this does not infer everywhere in a given state is expensive...

Acquaintances are Washington School Teachers and Law Enforcement... they have achieved exactly what you mention and they did it about in the last 10 years.

I would hardly called either profession upper middle class...

Washington still attracts a fair amount of retired military... not as much as before due to high property taxes... by and large, military families are not upper middle class either.

I would hope WA still attracts those with means to spend money inside it's borders... never got a job from a poor man.

[Inkpoe]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

Thirty years ago a regular family could afford to live in Washington and have a good sized house with a big yard and have a decent, if humble quality of life. Today, thanks to the influx of wealthy people to the state if you aren't in the upper middle class at least you have to live in a small apartment or trailer park.

When the mayor of Seattle says that 55,000 a year is low income there is a serious problem.

.... So... don't live in Seattle?

There's more to WA than Seattle.

[Xanathos]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

Thirty years ago a regular family could afford to live in Washington and have a good sized house with a big yard and have a decent, if humble quality of life. Today, thanks to the influx of wealthy people to the state if you aren't in the upper middle class at least you have to live in a small apartment or trailer park.

When the mayor of Seattle says that 55,000 a year is low income there is a serious problem.

Then maybe those people should take the necessary steps to obtain a better salary than they're currently making. There are a billion programs to send people to school for free or at a very low interest rate. The concept that the successful should bend over backwards and kowtow to those who won't reach for the brass ring is pretty ludicrous.

One of the biggest reasons this city (Seattle) is so recession-proof is that it's built to attract high-skill, short-supply-high-demand jobs. You can't sit there and decry how it's not fair that someone with no marketable skills can't live a metropolitian lifestyle up here because the successful aren't handing out enough of their money, and then in the same breath decry that there are too many successful people here.

This is a GREAT area, especially Seattle. If you have skills, you'll do quite well for yourself here. If you don't...well, there's no law that says you have some inherent right to live a certain lifestyle anywhere you go. Certain cities are not built for people of limited means. The reality is you're clearly just upset that you go out every day and see people living a better life than you, and you feel that for some reason they owe you some sort of debt which would result in you elevating your status.

You want a better quality of life? Go out and get it. Don't demand it simply be handed to you.

[eskercurve]

Originally Posted by Xanathos

Then maybe those people should take the necessary steps to obtain a better salary than they're currently making. There are a billion programs to send people to school for free or at a very low interest rate. The concept that the successful should bend over backwards and kowtow to those who won't reach for the brass ring is pretty ludicrous. ...

You want a better quality of life? Go out and get it. Don't demand it simply be handed to you.

There is one flaw in your theory (which I agree with mostly). What about the hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of manufacturing jobs that have been lost? Those types of workers (and I work with them often, at my employer, I do some engineering liaison to line workers) are often not educated, and to be 100% bluntly honest, not intelligent enough to be retooled. It would be like trying to put a square peg in a round hole.

I find it laughable that people still honestly think everyone has the ability, wherewithal, and gumption to become an engineer, smart businessman, etc. That is just plain false. It is both genetics and a failing of our school system.

You need at least an IQ of 120 to be really adequate to work at such jobs. Humans follow a bell curve and statistically it can be shown that most Americans score between 75-115 (68%). That means that 32% score lower or higher. Split half and half, that means that only 16% of the population can honestly be intelligent enough to do the sort of engineering or highly skilled work that people in this region can do.

That is the creme de la creme. But even among our intelligent population there's millions who cannot find work because they simply cannot retool.

How would one propose we deal with them? Eugenics? Screw em? Tell me.

[Xanathos]

You don't have to be an engineer to be successful in Seattle. You also don't have to have a respectable IQ.

Any wrench jockey can be trained to be a salesman, for example. Learning Human Resources doesn't take a lot of brainpower, etc. Beyond this....again, there's no law that says you have a right to live in whatever city you want and be successful in that city. Seattle is no longer a manufacturing town. I get that this town was built in blue collar values, but it's long since traded in the idea of mining for gold for the much more lucrative profession of mining for data. Seattle will never be a blue collar town again, it will never be a manufacturing town again. If that's your lot in life, you need to find a new city that caters to your skills.

This is something I've never understood. I don't make any sort of demand that I, as a high level IT professional, should be able to go to a city like Des Moines Iowa, St. Louis MO, or Milford Lake Kansas and be handed a tech position. Nobody ever says that about cities that don't have robust tech sectors. Marine Biologists never go on about how they can't find a job in Denver, Colorado. Yet all we ever hear from so many people is how it's not fair that such and such city doesn't have enough manufacturing jobs and how it's not fair they can't survive there.

I couldn't survive in a lot of cities. You know what I do about it? I choose cities I can survive in. Again, nobody has the right to be comfortable anywhere.

[eskercurve]

I do agree that people first of all need to make an honest approach to where they live. If they fall into the categories of people who I say cannot retool then they need to make a hard decision of where they can live (the South has a booming industrial sector, for example). And I think for more general professions that honestly don't need a genius level amount of brainpower to work (read: fireman, policeman), they need higher wages to offset the cost of living.

However, there's bigger problems at hand: our schools. The school system is broken. Period. I never would have thought this before, but I'm in favor of scrapping the whole damned thing and starting over with private sector taking over with rigorous oversight. Fix the schools, and get GOOD ROLE MODELS, and I guarantee that more people will be able to retool once they become redundant.

Alas, that does leave a significant portion of the population unable to do that, and this nation is woefully losing jobs that can be done by these people. Other countries seem to be doing a better job at keeping them (see Germany, France, and Japan), and the only way I can see doing that effectively when you're a high tech power that is already developed is either a) dumbing down the instructions, which can only go so far (Toyota built a new factory in Quebec instead of Kansas because the workers in Kansas needed picture books on how to work the machines); or b) trade protections (needs to be balanced ever so gingerly so as to avoid trade wars).

[CarlB328]

You need at least an IQ of 120 to be really adequate to work at such jobs

My IQ is in the mid 130's and I can't get a job in Washington. Granted I am currently in Texas and work at a very non prestigious employer, but it's ridiculous that someone with a degree and military experience can't find a job.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

My IQ is in the mid 130's and I can't get a job in Washington. Granted I am currently in Texas and work at a very non prestigious employer, but it's ridiculous that someone with a degree and military experience can't find a job.

Only an observation... it can be very difficult to secure employment in WA when you are not a WA resident.

Of course, there are always exceptions... a very good friend works in High Tech in Palo Alto and has been courted by several Washington Firms as recent as 6 months ago... his wife loves living in California so they will most likely not move.

Have you considered go the route of other talented people in similar situations... go into business for yourself... nothing like taking control of your destiny... sink or swim, you're in control.

[Xanathos]

Originally Posted by CarlB328

My IQ is in the mid 130's and I can't get a job in Washington. Granted I am currently in Texas and work at a very non prestigious employer, but it's ridiculous that someone with a degree and military experience can't find a job.

It's because of your address. No, seriously.

I know someone who's recently made the TX-WA move (I know because he's occupying one of my spare bedrooms right now). He had been trying for like 8 months and got a grand total of about 3 calls, I guess. After I got my house up here, I told him to put that address atop his resume, and all of a sudden his phone wouldn't stop ringing. He ended up picking up a position within a week.

Non-local candidates aren't being considered at most places. You're the first one they throw in the trash can as they whittle down the pile.