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Old 11-08-2013, 11:10 AM
 
537 posts, read 551,395 times
Reputation: 884

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sean98125 View Post
Random checkpoints have been challenged in the courts and not found to be unconstitutional. Driving isn't a right, and checking to make sure that people who are operating motor vehicles are sober isn't a violation of any right.
SCOTUS is an embarrassment. Driving a car is a "privilege"? Only in the mind of a Bolshevik. Was it a "privilege" to ride a horse, a bicycle, a carriage -- even a car, until recent rulings? The right of the people to be secure from unreasonable search and seizure shouldn't be subject to the death of a thousand cuts through statutory fiat and judicial activism. The judiciary, like the other two branches of government in the U.S. is a joke. We live in a post-Constitutional Kleptocracy.

Marbury v. Madison, 1803
“A law repugnant to the Constitution is void.”

With these words, Chief Justice John Marshall established the Supreme Court’s role in the new government. Hereafter, the Court was recognized as having the power to review all acts of Congress where constitutionality was at issue, and judge whether they abide by the Constitution.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:34 PM
 
320 posts, read 353,329 times
Reputation: 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canyon Cat View Post
SCOTUS is an embarrassment. Driving a car is a "privilege"? Only in the mind of a Bolshevik. Was it a "privilege" to ride a horse, a bicycle, a carriage -- even a car, until recent rulings? The right of the people to be secure from unreasonable search and seizure shouldn't be subject to the death of a thousand cuts through statutory fiat and judicial activism. The judiciary, like the other two branches of government in the U.S. is a joke. We live in a post-Constitutional Kleptocracy.

Marbury v. Madison, 1803
ďA law repugnant to the Constitution is void.Ē

With these words, Chief Justice John Marshall established the Supreme Courtís role in the new government. Hereafter, the Court was recognized as having the power to review all acts of Congress where constitutionality was at issue, and judge whether they abide by the Constitution.
My goodness, Bolsheviks??!! Are you sure you don't mean Mensheviks?!

Your last paragraph is plagarized (using someone else's words, without attribution, as if they were your own). The source is Robert F. Tedeschi, The U.S. Constitution (1998).

Speaking of the Supreme Court: In 1990, the Court ruled that sobriety checkpoints are constitutional (Michigan Dept. of State Police vs. Sitz). However, as you've pointed out, since 1988 Washington State has held that such checks violate the Fourth amendment. The issue will need to make its way through the normal legislative and legal processes. There's a long way to go at this time. It is far from a fait accompli.

In the meantime...

To drunk drivers: If you believe exercising your freedom includes driving drunk and possibly injuring or murdering my loved ones, please know that, following your criminal prosecution, I shall be exercising my 7th amendment rights, and I will sue you for everything you've got -- your house, your assets, and your income.
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Old 11-08-2013, 02:28 PM
 
1,006 posts, read 1,623,515 times
Reputation: 1553
In the famous words of Dean Vernon Wormer, "Fat drunk and stupid is no way to go through Life".
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Old 11-08-2013, 02:44 PM
 
537 posts, read 551,395 times
Reputation: 884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Monkey View Post
My goodness, Bolsheviks??!! Are you sure you don't mean Mensheviks?!

Your last paragraph is plagarized (using someone else's words, without attribution, as if they were your own). The source is Robert F. Tedeschi, The U.S. Constitution (1998).

Speaking of the Supreme Court: In 1990, the Court ruled that sobriety checkpoints are constitutional (Michigan Dept. of State Police vs. Sitz). However, as you've pointed out, since 1988 Washington State has held that such checks violate the Fourth amendment. The issue will need to make its way through the normal legislative and legal processes. There's a long way to go at this time. It is far from a fait accompli.

In the meantime...

To drunk drivers: If you believe exercising your freedom includes driving drunk and possibly injuring or murdering my loved ones, please know that, following your criminal prosecution, I shall be exercising my 7th amendment rights, and I will sue you for everything you've got -- your house, your assets, and your income.
I meant Bolsheviks. Mensheviks would be preferable by comparison.

The last paragraph is a quote. Jeez! Guilty as charged, Occifer. Forgot the last ". Sue me. Wait, nevermind.

Sue the drunk driver. Fine. Whatever. But don't put everyone through checkpoints when other means are available. Checkpoints for child porn, Twinkies, no flu shot, bad hygiene?? My liberty is more important than someone's good intentions. Otherwise, we're no better than a banana republic.
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Old 11-08-2013, 03:22 PM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
18,125 posts, read 33,599,337 times
Reputation: 16599
I have dealt with random checkpoints for 40+ yrs, Has not done me any harm, I have seen a lot of people banned from the road and hauled home. I appreciate that.
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Old 11-08-2013, 07:14 PM
 
537 posts, read 551,395 times
Reputation: 884
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
I have dealt with random checkpoints for 40+ yrs, Has not done me any harm, I have seen a lot of people banned from the road and hauled home. I appreciate that.
Until it's your turn, for . . . whatever. Spoken like a true knave. Don't forget to bow as your King's chariot passes.

Quote:
"If ye love wealth better than liberty,
the tranquility of servitude
better than the animating contest of freedom,
go home from us in peace.
We ask not your counsels or your arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you.
May your chains set lightly upon you,
and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."

--Samuel Adams, patriot
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Washington State. Not Seattle.
1,581 posts, read 1,711,045 times
Reputation: 1537
Personally, I haven't really developed an opinion on this one way or another, but I wonder how many people who are pro-random drunk driving checkpoints, looking for drunks, are also anti-random no-documentation checkpoints, looking for illegals?
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:45 AM
 
537 posts, read 551,395 times
Reputation: 884
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS90 View Post
Personally, I haven't really developed an opinion on this one way or another, but I wonder how many people who are pro-random drunk driving checkpoints, looking for drunks, are also anti-random no-documentation checkpoints, looking for illegals?
I'm consistent. No checkpoints in a free country.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:56 AM
 
1,006 posts, read 1,623,515 times
Reputation: 1553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canyon Cat View Post
I'm consistent. No checkpoints in a free country.

This is where many people misunderstand what free means. They forget about the part that references the greater good. And then there are the masses that can't follow the rules of being free and would abuse them. Part of being in a free country is putting up with annoyances like random stops, for the greater good. Thats not just my greater good, but yours and your family. if we could all be trusted to never do anything that would hurt the freedom of others that would be great, but we cant. hence we need things like checkpoints.
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Old 11-09-2013, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Bothell, Washington
2,638 posts, read 4,120,867 times
Reputation: 3539
Quote:
Originally Posted by cocaseco View Post
This is where many people misunderstand what free means. They forget about the part that references the greater good. And then there are the masses that can't follow the rules of being free and would abuse them. Part of being in a free country is putting up with annoyances like random stops, for the greater good. Thats not just my greater good, but yours and your family. if we could all be trusted to never do anything that would hurt the freedom of others that would be great, but we cant. hence we need things like checkpoints.
Excellent post. I wish more people understood this! Their freedom to not be checked fir intoxication does NOT trump my family's right to come home alive safe from drunk drivers. As long as there will be people stupid enough to drink and drive, we need checkpoints to protect the rest of us from those idiots. Say a checkpoint stops only one drunk driver in a night, saving the the lives of my family on that road- are some of you really saying a brief inconvenient stop is not worth the tradeoff to stop a senseless death on the roads? If so, you are extremely selfish.
We already get checked by security at the airport before getting on a plane, obviously to make sure to find anyone intending to create a dangerous situation on a flight. That is no different, do you all feel that inconvenience to you is not worth it, either, to keep everyone else safe?

I also think these checkpoints should not be advertised. if they are just going to be advertising on the radio where the checkpoints are, then people who have had a few before driving will plan alternate routes to drive, negating the effect of the checkpoint.


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