Do you think Washington state taxes are burdensome? (Camas: tax lien, low income)

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by jinj

People in WA want to spend an unlimited amount on education and health care, but want everyone else to pay for it, not themselves.

sorry, you mean "politicians" supposedly representing the popular vote, not 'people'. And certainly not the business owners / employers / farmers in WA. Have you paid your quarterlies yet?, or are you not an employer? Those who generate jobs and payroll could use some representation

[Heiwos]

Originally Posted by RainyTownGal

Washington has many wonderful things to offer, but low taxes are not one of them! In fact, it is one of the primary reasons that my family and I are considering a move elsewhere. Property taxes in Snohomish County run between $3,500 and $4,000 annually for your average-sized single family home.

I would love to know where you think you can move that offers a higher value for the taxes paid. $4K annual property taxes and no state income tax is a steal in my book, compared to other states, even with 9.5% sales tax. I would move to King County, which offers a higher value than Snohomish County. The King County Library System is excellent, e.g.

[SkinnyKidCTL]

Originally Posted by 509

I was rummaging through Christine's budget and the Office of Financial Management wesite and it looks like the state is paying several million dollars for both Safeco field and Allen's stadium (which he thinks he owns!!). The state is shifting the lottery monies to the stadiums since the state of Washington guaranteed those revenues.

So much for the lottery being for education funding!! Remember that?? And the politicians wonder why the public is fed up?

But why do we keep re-electing incumbents?? Just keep throwing them out until somebody finally takes the publics side.

I looked through that website too after reading your post, but I can't find where it shows that shifting of funds is occurring. Can you please post a link? I am trying to write a paper for an college English class and the information could really help.
Also, do you know where it is documented that lottery funds were originally intended for education?
Thanks.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Heiwos

I would love to know where you think you can move that offers a higher value for the taxes paid. $4K annual property taxes and no state income tax is a steal in my book, compared to other states, even with 9.5% sales tax. I would move to King County, which offers a higher value than Snohomish County. The King County Library System is excellent, e.g.

You make a good point about income tax... it's a no-brainer especially for high income earners...

The "Nice" thing about income tax is that it is only due on earnings... so the more you earn the more money you have available to pay it.

The problem with WA State Property Tax is some of us have seen one year increases of 30% or more and assessed values jump by 70%. This was my situation 14 months after buying a property that had languished on the market for 9 months and I've been blessed with double digit increases every year since.

Appealing the Assessment is great in theory for the first and even the second time... but in all truth, it does get old and wears you down. I really think the appeal process for Home Owners is set-up to wear you down... at least from my experience in Thurston County.

You CAN literally be taxed out of your home in WA and this is a problem... I've lost two long term neighbors because of this... Property Tax is assessed simply on the Assessor's Office opinion of value...

If given a choice, I would much rather pay State Income Tax than be faced with selling my home because my income has not kept up with my property tax increases...

I researched and did my due diligence before I bought and decided I could live with the existing system... I never thought the WA Supreme Court would throw out the Property Tax Protection passed by the voters and for this reason I caution those thinking of moving here and buying property. The Election of Governor was also a fiasco... changing the winner with each recount.

I really like everything else about the State.... even the rain of Western WA... I just can't come to terms with property tax roulette each year as I open my tax statement...

Which reminds me... I've got to send in over 13k by the end of this month... well, at least half of that... almost double what I was paying based on my purchase price back in January 2005...

Where else in the country has property doubled in price between January 2005 and January 2009???

[Heiwos]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

You CAN literally be taxed out of your home in WA and this is a problem... I've lost two long term neighbors because of this... Property Tax is assessed simply on the Assessor's Office opinion of value...

I think it's fine that some people are taxed out of their homes. I don't want people living here who can't afford to live here. There are other places they can go, or perhaps they can switch to a cheaper house. It's hard to be against the assessor's opinion of value when that value is clearly less than the saleable value, which it was in the past few years. Now it's more like the same as the saleable value, due to falling prices.

If given a choice, I would much rather pay State Income Tax than be faced with selling my home because my income has not kept up with my property tax increases...

If the total tax burden is greater and you're a responsible citizen, you should lose your home faster. Only welfare lovers would keep the house when the equity could pay a state income tax payment they otherwise can't afford. The total tax burden is greater in most other states.

Which reminds me... I've got to send in over 13k by the end of this month... well, at least half of that... almost double what I was paying based on my purchase price back in January 2005...

There's a lag on the assessment; it's an average of the last 3 years value or something like that, so that tax amounts don't jump around so much. Assuming your property hasn't significantly increased in value since you bought it, this means that you didn't deserve the previous lower property taxes; that was a gift to you from the state.

Where else in the country has property doubled in price between January 2005 and January 2009???

I've seen reports of people in other cities getting hit with big property tax increases because of the assessment lag.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Heiwos

I think it's fine that some people are taxed out of their homes. I don't want people living here who can't afford to live here. There are other places they can go, or perhaps they can switch to a cheaper house. It's hard to be against the assessor's opinion of value when that value is clearly less than the saleable value, which it was in the past few years. Now it's more like the same as the saleable value, due to falling prices.

I'm too compassionate to be OK with people being taxed from their homes... eventually there will be no place for them to go and then what? Homeless require greater public services all around and I do have a real problem seeing some of our Vets being forced to move over property taxes.

Total tax burden is greater and you're a responsible citizen, you should lose your home faster. Only welfare lovers would keep the house when the equity could pay a state income tax payment they otherwise can't afford. The total tax burden is greater in most other states.

Sorry, I'm having trouble following you? I said that I'm in favor of Income Tax because it taxes earnings and is more just because of it...

There's a lag on the assessment; it's an average of the last 3 years value or something like that, so that tax amounts don't jump around so much. Assuming your property hasn't significantly increased in value since you bought it, this means that you didn't deserve the previous lower property taxes; that was a gift to you from the state.

I have no problem paying property tax on the price I willing paid... I do have a problem when the assessed value increases 70% above my purchase price within 14 months. I never paid the "Previous Lower Property Taxes"

I've seen reports of people in other cities getting hit with big property tax increases because of the assessment lag.

Me too and this is happening as prices continue to plummet... worst decline in decades

Hard to understand how the WA Supreme Court can throw out the will of the people exercised through the democratic process by claiming the "People" didn't understand what they voted for The People Voted to instill some predictability to property taxes and a Government that can't protect those that are vulnerable is questionable at best... just my opinion.

[Heiwos]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

I'm too compassionate to be OK with people being taxed from their homes... eventually there will be no place for them to go and then what? Homeless require greater public services all around and I do have a real problem seeing some of our Vets being forced to move over property taxes.

The problem with being too compassionate is that you then get people who don't save enough during their working years. Why should I work harder so that some couple in their 80s can continue to enjoy their waterfront house with senior exemptions on property taxes, when they took cruise vacations when younger? I probably won't get the same favor when I'm older, because such system is unsustainable. A system that is sustainable does not have long-term welfare. The bottom line is, your compassion to people being taxed from their homes comes at the price of being mean to those who are paying for that and won't receive the same service.

Sorry, I'm having trouble following you? I said that I'm in favor of Income Tax because it taxes earnings and is more just because of it...

OK, I get it. But what are the odds that any change in tax structure is going to result in lower taxes for you? The sun would stop rising first.

I have no problem paying property tax on the price I willing paid... I do have a problem when the assessed value increases 70% above my purchase price within 14 months. I never paid the "Previous Lower Property Taxes"

Are you saying that the initial assessed value was not lower than the price you paid? That would be unusual. Every house I saw that sold in 2005 had a lower assessed value than the sales price. Same in 2006. Only now am I seeing assessed values that match property values.

Hard to understand how the WA Supreme Court can throw out the will of the people exercised through the democratic process by claiming the "People" didn't understand what they voted for The People Voted to instill some predictability to property taxes and a Government that can't protect those that are vulnerable is questionable at best... just my opinion.

I don't know what vote you're referring to. One thing is, the people can't retroactively change contracts; that's unconstitutional I think. For example, the people can't vote to enter a contract to build a tunnel, and then later vote to not pay the bill. So there's a limit to what the people can have through voting.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Heiwos

The problem with being too compassionate is that you then get people who don't save enough during their working years. Why should I work harder so that some couple in their 80s can continue to enjoy their waterfront house with senior exemptions on property taxes, when they took cruise vacations when younger? I probably won't get the same favor when I'm older, because such system is unsustainable. A system that is sustainable does not have long-term welfare. The bottom line is, your compassion to people being taxed from their homes comes at the price of being mean to those who are paying for that and won't receive the same service.

Maybe we know the same couple in their 80s... it sounds like them except for the cruises... they live very modestly... I didn't think to mention them before. My other references were to retired military that settled in WA and are now being squeezed out.

The Husband of the couple in their 80's was discharged shortly after WWII and he and his bride bought a parcel just shy of 2 acres with a small amount of tide lands... it's not really waterfront... more like mudflat for oysters.

50 years ago, they built a very modest 2 bedroom home of about 900 square feet... no garage or out buildings. The home is minimal by any standard. The setting is beautiful because they left the land forested. For years their taxes increased modestly... until 2007... when their assessed value went from 220k to 500k

The assessor said the value was adjusted to reflect the increased value of the land based on 20 acres that recently sold in the area to a CA venture capitalists... This couple had planned on living out their days in their home and and I do feel sorry for them... they were unable to have children and yet 50% of the taxes they've paid since 1946 goes to schools...

OK, I get it. But what are the odds that any change in tax structure is going to result in lower taxes for you? The sun would stop rising first.

I don't know... but it would do wonders for my well being to pay tax on realized gains as opposed to unrealized or perceived gain. It's like paying tax on securities because they increased in value on paper... even-though no money changed hands.

Are you saying that the initial assessed value was not lower than the price you paid? That would be unusual. Every house I saw that sold in 2005 had a lower assessed value than the sales price. Same in 2006. Only now am I seeing assessed values that match property values.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying... the couple I bought it from was from CA and they owned the property less than 2 years. This was to be their forever home and instead they ended up divorcing and a lot had to do with the wife being very unhappy living in WA... she missed her Southern CA lifestyle very much. I ended up paying exactly what the assessed value was within 10k

I don't know what vote you're referring to. One thing is, the people can't retroactively change contracts; that's unconstitutional I think. For example, the people can't vote to enter a contract to build a tunnel, and then later vote to not pay the bill. So there's a limit to what the people can have through voting.

That's easy... It was voter initiative 747 that was passed back in 2001 by the voters.

Here's the first and second links that came up when I googled it... I''m not endorsing the sites...

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...ebi74708m.html

INITIATIVE 747 FACT SHEET | FreedomWorks

[70Ford]

News; New "temporary" state sales tax was approved by the House.
House committee passes state sales tax hike

It's so that "people won't die."

While that is happening, Nickels is sloughing (or trying to slough) money to make the Key Arena even more grand.
KeyArena tax no slam-dunk - Puget Sound Business Journal (Seattle):

So....gotta have that arena while people die, huh? Nickels. I remember watching him on local access and thinking he was OK. Then I got to enjoy being sidelined (and sideswiped) during this last freeze. All while he and his cronies got curbside service. You know what? Someone might've (probably?) died because the ambulance couldn't make it through snow. I saw a bunch of kids hanging over an embankment on a bus, and I'm thinking, "This is not supposed to happen in a city called Seattle." Then he starts praising people on doing a good job.

F'ng clueless. Fn'g snow job, is more like it. Maybe he thinks people will forget. I hope not. I'm voting against him because he let a major metropolitan area get buried for the better part of a week, and what did he do? Not a hell of a lot, that's what.

[Ira500]

A big priority for Nickels has been to spend taxpayer money on the South Lake Union area, which, just coincidentally mostly belongs to one man, a certain Paul Allen.
Whatever Master Allen requested, Nickels was always at his beck and call, but always said things like "This is great for the City, providing jobs and revenues."