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Old 09-25-2010, 09:46 AM
 
Location: New York City
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Also correct me if I'm wrong but Toronto has a perceptible "maritime" influence from the Lake Ontario that explains the crappy early summer days.
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Old 09-25-2010, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Perth, Western Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMarbles View Post
Also correct me if I'm wrong but Toronto has a perceptible "maritime" influence from the Lake Ontario that explains the crappy early summer days.
I wouldn't say early summer,
but it definitely affects Spring, especially early-mid Spring.
March avgs (4/-4 C) are lower than November (7/-1 C) so that makes it seem partially-maritime.

I've seen 99-100 F sometime between June 3-5.
Only have seen 99+ F here maybe 3 days in my entire life.
We can also see 90 F in May with dewpoints around the mid-high 60's F.

The crappiness I'm talking about is NOT early summer.
I've seen days in the high 50's F some summers in July and early August; mid-summer imho.
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Old 09-25-2010, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Perth, Western Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMarbles View Post
CC,
1. Toronto would be near the northern periphery of a "classic" temperate climate, so keep that in mind.
2. The classification is not based on subjective perceptions of what is "warm". 60F is a very high bar to clear during winter in a temperate climate. In NYC they are very rare. According to Weatherbase, there are 0 average days that reach above 65F in Dec, Jan and Feb. 4 such days in Nov, and 3 in March.

If you want to see 60F days during the 3 winter months, you would probably need to live somewhere south of central Virginia.

Think of it this way. You love summer and like wearing short sleeves and sandals. Pretend you also liked snow in the winter and enjoyed winter sports. Would you like living in a climate that often reaches above 40-45F even in the dead of winter? For a person like that, even a 45F degree day would be VERY warm (Dec-Feb obviously). 60F would be scorching hot.
Liking snow and finding temps warm or hot are probably two unrelated ideas,
however if I loved snow 40+ F would usually be annoying in winter.

I would find a "classic temperate" climate that can see 60+ F even once each winter still temperate.
We usually max out at 50-55 F once each winter.

It angers me that we can have zero 60+ F days mid-Oct to the start of winter,
and zero 60+ F days until late-Apr, even early-May some years.
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Old 09-25-2010, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Cloudchurch, Subantarctica
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wavehunter007 View Post
In the USA for example…the annual mean temps in cities in the Temperate Oceanic Pacific Northwest…are very close to the annual mean temps in the Temperate Continental Eastern US…in fact they a few degrees cooler. Seattle has an annual mean of 11 C (52 F)….Portland, Oregon has an annual mean of 12 C (54 F)…while NYC has an annual mean of 13 C ( 55 F) and Washington DC has an annual mean of 14.5 C (58 F) . Many other temperate oceanic climates in Europe have similar annual mean temps.
That's probably generally true. I read somewhere that continental climates tend to be warmer than maritime climates below 45 N/S while the reverse is true above 45 N/S. So in the midlattitudes (40 - 50 N/S) they should be about the same.
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Old 09-25-2010, 12:11 PM
 
Location: New York City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCanadian View Post
Liking snow and finding temps warm or hot are probably two unrelated ideas,
however if I loved snow 40+ F would usually be annoying in winter.


I would find a "classic temperate" climate that can see 60+ F even once each winter still temperate.
We usually max out at 50-55 F once each winter.

It angers me that we can have zero 60+ F days mid-Oct to the start of winter,
and zero 60+ F days until late-Apr, even early-May some years.
To phrase it better, during winter months in a temperate climate I would find temps above 45F (much less 60F) very uncharacteristic of the season.

But North American winters are notoriously unstable so there is a wide range of possible temperatures.
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Old 09-25-2010, 12:58 PM
 
Location: Perth, Western Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMarbles View Post
To phrase it better, during winter months in a temperate climate I would find temps above 45F (much less 60F) very uncharacteristic of the season.

But North American winters are notoriously unstable so there is a wide range of possible temperatures.
Yes, but there's a difference between uncharacteristic and improbable or impossible.
Toronto is more likely to see a high of -10 F than a high above 50 F in January.
I think that's pretty dramatic considering our mean is around 27 F.
When impressive winter warm fronts hit the eastern side of North America,
the Great Lakes often "cheat" us out of 10-30 F compared to somewhere like Cleveland or Pittsburgh.

Toronto January:

Uncharacteristic: 37 F/3 C or 14 F/-11 C
Improbable: 50+ F/10 C or -13 F/-25 C
Impossible: 60 F/16 C or -40 F???
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Old 09-25-2010, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Perth, Western Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovemycomputer90 View Post
I remember that day too. I got windburn at work.
It amazes me how you can have a similar reaction to me,
yet still prefer cool/cold/cloudy/windy climates.

I find a heat index of 110 F a lot easier to deal with than conditions causing "windburn"
yet you often gripe about extended sunny weather in the 80's F.

To me windburn in summer is unnacceptable and equally as "brutal" as heat indexes of 125+ F "could be."
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Old 09-25-2010, 01:14 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCanadian View Post
It amazes me how you can have a similar reaction to me,
yet still prefer cool/cold/cloudy/windy climates.
It's surprising how cool a windy 70 F can feel. It actually felt refreshing initially, but the after effects weren't pleasant. I would still rather deal with that than excessive heat, humidity, and sunburn. At least it was cool out when I was effectively getting "burned".

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCanadian
I find a heat index of 110 F a lot easier to deal with than conditions causing "windburn"
yet you often gripe about extended sunny weather in the 80's F.

To me windburn in summer is unnacceptable and equally as "brutal" as heat indexes of 125+ F "could be."
That's because constant sunshine with warm temperatures gets so boring after a while. I'll take a little windburn in return for cool temperatures.

I think it's also important to consider that at that point in early July, we were more acclimated to warm weather (80s+), so as one would expect, a high of only 70 F would feel almost chilly. But if it were March, a breezy 70 F would feel very warm and probably wouldn't have the same physical effects. Although I guess you could get windburn anytime of the year if outdoors long enough.
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Old 09-25-2010, 01:40 PM
 
Location: New York City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCanadian View Post
Yes, but there's a difference between uncharacteristic and improbable or impossible.
Toronto is more likely to see a high of -10 F than a high above 50 F in January.
I think that's pretty dramatic considering our mean is around 27 F.
When impressive winter warm fronts hit the eastern side of North America,
the Great Lakes often "cheat" us out of 10-30 F compared to somewhere like Cleveland or Pittsburgh.

Toronto January:

Uncharacteristic: 37 F/3 C or 14 F/-11 C
Improbable: 50+ F/10 C or -13 F/-25 C
Impossible: 60 F/16 C or -40 F???
A high of -10F? Maybe you meant -10 C? Any stats I can see on how often this occurs?
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Old 09-25-2010, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Western Massachusetts
25,130 posts, read 11,511,800 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMarbles View Post
A high of -10F? Maybe you meant -10 C? Any stats I can see on how often this occurs?
No clue for Toronto, but for Ithaca, NY (which I would assume would be a bitcolder due to elevation and distance from the Great Lakes despite it being further south), tThe coldest maximum I could find was 0°F in Jan 2004. I'm sure -10°F could happen, but not very often. Coldest minimum I could find was -22°F.

Brr.
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