Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Definitely climate #2 can grow more species of palms as it hardly ever gets frost but climate #1 would do better with the heat loving palms like Sabal Palmetto
Definitely climate #2 can grow more species of palms as it hardly ever gets frost but climate #1 would do better with the heat loving palms like Sabal Palmetto
The climates are very similar, except for record lows. The avg high is the same in summer, so both could grow sabals I assume. Imo, climate #1 seems unrealistic in the context of the Southeast US as it would not have a record low of 6F, without having a higher avg temp in summer. So, in that regard climate #2 would grow more palms since the summer temps are the same, winter temps very similar, and only record lows far apart.
I know people in Europe love to brag about their high USDA growing zone, but there is no where in the UK, even London, with CIDP this large. Where are the Queen palms in the UK? Record low Brunswick is 5F.
And Deneb, you really need a trip to a place like New Orleans or Mobile, AL just to see how many tropicals they can grow compared to the same 9a locale in places like Victoria or London. I doubt you will see viable commercial citrus groves even in the Scilly Isles. Winter sun and heat during the day make a huge, huge difference, despite cold winter nights.
Definitely climate #2 can grow more species of palms as it hardly ever gets frost but climate #1 would do better with the heat loving palms like Sabal Palmetto
I think the heat requirement for Sabal palmetto might be overstated. I don't have any myself, but know of a couple around here, and the owners say they grow at about the same rate as Butia.c (wine palm), which is slow but steady.
I do have a young Sabal minor, which was still growing a new spear until mid June, and has grown three fronds in it's year in the ground .... that was until the f***** ****hole sheep got out of their paddock - now it's just a stump, but I'm sure it will jump away by late September.
The climates are very similar, except for record lows. The avg high is the same in summer, so both could grow sabals I assume. Imo, climate #1 seems unrealistic in the context of the Southeast US as it would not have a record low of 6F, without having a higher avg temp in summer. So, in that regard climate #2 would grow more palms since the summer temps are the same, winter temps very similar, and only record lows far apart.
I know people in Europe love to brag about their high USDA growing zone, but there is no where in the UK, even London, with CIDP this large. Where are the Queen palms in the UK? Record low Brunswick is 5F.
And Deneb, you really need a trip to a place like New Orleans or Mobile, AL just to see how many tropicals they can grow compared to the same 9a locale in places like Victoria or London. I doubt you will see viable commercial citrus groves even in the Scilly Isles. Winter sun and heat during the day make a huge, huge difference, despite cold winter nights.
More Waycross, GA (well inland) Washingtonia Palms
Valdosta, GA (well inland)
And Citrus Groves in south Alabama (I took this photo in April with the orange trees blooming and the scent was incredible).
Awesome pics! Yeah, I'd love to visit the Gulf Coast sometime. I've been to Orlando and Miami before and both those places obviously grow a very large variety of palms. I think the large standard deviation in winter temperatures of the SE US also allows a lot more winter growth due to more heat and sunshine between cold snaps. Like you said, this is one of the major reasons why USDA zone 9a in a place like New Orleans will always be able to grow more subtropicals compared to USDA zone 9a in a place like London.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
^^^^ nice photos.
I think the heat requirement for Sabal palmetto might be overstated. I don't have any myself, but know of a couple around here, and the owners say they grow at about the same rate as Butia.c (wine palm), which is slow but steady.
I do have a young Sabal minor, which was still growing a new spear until mid June, and has grown three fronds in it's year in the ground .... that was until the f***** ****hole sheep got out of their paddock - now it's just a stump, but I'm sure it will jump away by late September.
I know of a few Sabal Minors that grow around here in people's yards but they don't do very well due to lack of heat. I wonder what the minimum heat requirement for Sabal Palmetto in summer is because their native environment has very hot summers and I know for a fact that they won't grow around here at all.
I know of a few Sabal Minors that grow around here in people's yards but they don't do very well due to lack of heat. I wonder what the minimum heat requirement for Sabal Palmetto in summer is because their native environment has very hot summers and I know for a fact that they won't grow around here at all.
I don't think the heat requirement for Sabal palmetto is that great, as my climate will grow them slowly. It's the length of time without active growth, that will stop them growing.
Other palms seem to me to have a much greater heat requirement. I've tried to grow a Florida Sawtooth palm for years (outside in a pot) - it's about 6 inches tall, although I'm hoping planting it in the ground will get a better result.
I know people in Europe love to brag about their high USDA growing zone, but there is no where in the UK, even London, with CIDP this large. Where are the Queen palms in the UK? Record low Brunswick is 5F.
The reason there are no CIDP's that large in London is that most have only been planted in the last 20 years, they just were not available until recent years & were thought to be house/greehouse plants only. Give it another 40/50 years & the London skyline will be full of them
And there are some large CIDP's in the UK:
Torquay:
Scilly Isles:
Guernsey:
Obviously Queen palms wont grow in the UK as they have a higher heat requirement, but there are plenty of palms that happily grow in the 'cold' UK...
The climates are very similar, except for record lows. The avg high is the same in summer, so both could grow sabals I assume. Imo, climate #1 seems unrealistic in the context of the Southeast US as it would not have a record low of 6F, without having a higher avg temp in summer. So, in that regard climate #2 would grow more palms since the summer temps are the same, winter temps very similar, and only record lows far apart.
I know people in Europe love to brag about their high USDA growing zone, but there is no where in the UK, even London, with CIDP this large. Where are the Queen palms in the UK? Record low Brunswick is 5F.
And Deneb, you really need a trip to a place like New Orleans or Mobile, AL just to see how many tropicals they can grow compared to the same 9a locale in places like Victoria or London. I doubt you will see viable commercial citrus groves even in the Scilly Isles. Winter sun and heat during the day make a huge, huge difference, despite cold winter nights.
More Waycross, GA (well inland) Washingtonia Palms
Valdosta, GA (well inland)
And Citrus Groves in south Alabama (I took this photo in April with the orange trees blooming and the scent was incredible).
Great pics. I've been to all those places.
Wow, Queen Palms in Valdosta, GA, didn't know they could grow those.
Nice Washingtonia's in Waycross, I've noticed that more and more places (hotels/businesses)
in SE US are planting Washingtonia's as opposed to "native" Sabals, I have mixed feelings
on that, the Washy's look a bit better but I like to see the Sabals as they look "right" for US SE.
When travelling south on I-75 in Georgia, I always try to spot the first palm.
I think Macon is about the dividing line,
I stayed once at a motel just south of Macon in Cordele that had lots of big nice looking palms.
Even though they are hardy to zone 8a, both Sabals and Washingtonia's need heat and sunshine,
I doubt either would do well in Seattle, Vancouver, or London.
Can't answer without knowing the average annual minimum winter (I mean lowest temp reached on average each winter, aka USDA growing zone) temp in climate #1. Sure the 6F would kill off a lot of palms, but how often does that occur? I'd like to know the average lowest temp reached each winter in climate #1 to answer the question properly.
Climate 1 has an average annual minimum of 23F(-5C) making it 9a.
Climate 2 has an average annual minimum of 36F(2C) making it a borderline 10a/10b.
My climate is most similar to the first option. The averages for January are 58.6/38.0 F (14.8/3.3 C). The record low is 3 F (-16 C) and averages measurable snowfall once every 4 to 5 years. Temperatures in January have been as high as 87 F (31 C).
It usually reaches the lower 20's F or below during the winter and about 25 days with lows below freezing on average.
It was the southeastern United States I had in mind for climate 1. For climate 2 I was thinking more of maritime coastal climates like in the Northwest or England thought with higher winter temperatures and a subtropical summer.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
because their native environment has very hot summers and I know for a fact that they won't grow around here at all.
