Joe90 was right, veg defines winter climate (snow, averages, temperature)
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It's easy in a place like NZ, because it's a visibly obvious natural progression within a similar context- Motueka looks different to Invercargill, and Auckland looks different Motueka etc.
I guess for between completely different regions of the world, with different flora and fauna, indicator species could be used -- bees and citrus for example, have been introduced to any climate that can sustain then. Measuring the level of activity/growth of those in the colder months, would be indicative of a lessening of seasonality within environments.
All good points but temperature must play into it as well as seasonality. Torshavn has a greater seasonality than New Orleans in terms of temperature but it's pretty obvious which one has a more subtropical environment. So in addition to seasonality, I wonder what that temperature threshold might be. Maybe Trewartha was on to something with his subtropical definition...
All good points but temperature must play into it as well as seasonality. Torshavn has a greater seasonality than New Orleans in terms of temperature but it's pretty obvious which one has a more subtropical environment. So in addition to seasonality, I wonder what that temperature threshold might be. Maybe Trewartha was on to something with his subtropical definition...
How green in winter and lush is your area compared to that streetview from southern England?
What are the characteristics of a subtropical forest? I generally have a hard time identifying subtropical forest vs a temperate one. Yes some forests are dominated by evergreen broadleaf trees, but often times it's still deciduous forests. I know that generally subtropical forests will have more biodiversity but sometimes that can be hard to see with just your eyes, especially since not all species will be found within your vicinity. Do subtropical forests generally have more undergrowth than temperate forests? I would assume that stronger sun would at least in theory allow more undergrowth under the shade of trees, but then that would mean temperate forests at higher altitudes in southern regions will also have more undergrowth too. Or am I missing something?
Actually in North America is quite easy, due to the existence of genus like Pinus, whom are widely distributed from boreal environments to even tropical ones. Let's see:
The differences are quite obvious. You can notice each climate or biome to wich they belong only by seeing those images and compare them to each other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneb78
All good points but temperature must play into it as well as seasonality. Torshavn has a greater seasonality than New Orleans in terms of temperature but it's pretty obvious which one has a more subtropical environment. So in addition to seasonality, I wonder what that temperature threshold might be. Maybe Trewartha was on to something with his subtropical definition...
+1. I defined these thresholds in my own climate classification:
By anual mean:
>23ºC: Tropical
20-23ºC: Tropical/Subtropical borderline
15-20ºC: Subtropical
10-15ºC: Subtropical/Temperate transitional ("Subtropical higland" as well)
3-10ºC: Temperate
0-3ºC: Hemiboreal
-10ºC-0ºC: Boreal ("Taiga")
-10ºC to -15ºC: Transition to polar, end of the favorable conditions for trees to develop.
How green in winter and lush is your area compared to that streetview from southern England?
Pretty similar but I think Southern England can grow a few more tender species than we can. There are lots of broadleaf evergreens here and most of the native vegetation are tall conifers so it's pretty green here in winter.
Pretty similar but I think Southern England can grow a few more tender species than we can. There are lots of broadleaf evergreens here and most of the native vegetation are tall conifers so it's pretty green here in winter.
Can they grow washingtonia palms (best native palm in North America) or phoenix palms?
All good points but temperature must play into it as well as seasonality. Torshavn has a greater seasonality than New Orleans in terms of temperature but it's pretty obvious which one has a more subtropical environment. So in addition to seasonality, I wonder what that temperature threshold might be. Maybe Trewartha was on to something with his subtropical definition...
I guess temperature does matter to environment, but if Torshavn can't support even the hardiest citrus, while New Orleans has many, it's not necessary to know the temperatures.
Trewartha did understand an important distinction about " subtropicalness" imo - it's related to growth in vegetation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons
As you saw Bournemouth in England is lush and evergreen in winter, wouldn't that suggest subtropical features, even if say citrus crops don't do well there?
Compared to a place with less of those, it would rate higher as a subtropical environment, although it looks a bit grim from that photo.
It doesn't just have to be about citrus, but anything that needs a warmer winter to survive - if Bournemouth has more flowering plants, or higher levels of insect activity than NYC during winter, then I would say it has a more subtropical environment. Likewise, the ease of growing citrus in Motueka compared to Bournemouth, indicates more subtropicalness to its environment.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marlaver
Actually in North America is quite easy, due to the existence of genus like Pinus, whom are widely distributed from boreal environments to even tropical ones. Let's see:
The differences are quite obvious. You can notice each climate or biome to wich they belong only by seeing those images and compare them to each other.
+1. I defined these thresholds in my own climate classification:
By anual mean:
>23ºC: Tropical
20-23ºC: Tropical/Subtropical borderline
15-20ºC: Subtropical
10-15ºC: Subtropical/Temperate transitional ("Subtropical higland" as well)
3-10ºC: Temperate
0-3ºC: Hemiboreal
-10ºC-0ºC: Boreal ("Taiga")
-10ºC to -15ºC: Transition to polar, end of the favorable conditions for trees to develop.
So by your system, we would be Tropical (our annual mean is around 24°C)
Extreme winter mins too low then compared to England?
Yeah cold snaps are more severe with lower winter lows and it's also a lot wetter here in winter which I think plays a role.
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