West Virginia...Southern or Northern? (Huntington, Wheeling: transfer, gated, taxation)

[Colby "The Punk" Wells]

Originally Posted by GottaHerdOn

See Punk, I'm from Elkins, which is like what? 15-20 minutes from where you grew up in Valley Head. But I've never felt a connection with the South either. Nor have my friends or family. I just can't see it at all. My friends from Alabama and other southern states laugh when I ask them if they considered WV a southern state. While I don't feel particularly attached to the midwest or northeast either. I see more of Mid-Atlantic zone. Which I think has some of both. I feel like WV may be 65/35 Northern-Southern. Ehh, just my opinion

Thank you for your opinion Herd, I really appreciate it. Actually, I grew up in Valley Bend though. I also have lived in North Georgia for 5 years (I was 15 when I moved down there). I'm 22 now, and I admit, I claimed to be a Northerner growing up in Valley Bend, but when I moved to Georgia, I finally realized that WV actually is a Southern state. I've been doing lots of research on the culture of West Virginians for a few years now, and to be honest with you, people in Georgia and West Virginia are completely the same. No different. People there have told me that WV is in the South and some have said it's not.

There's a book out there called "A House Divided: A Study of Statehood Politics and Copperhead Movement in West Virginia" by Richard Orr Curry that explains the true history of WV. Most people think that the citizens of Western Virginia wanted to leave the Confederacy and re-join the Union as a new state, but this wasn't true though. WV was made a state by Wheeling Unionists, and Abe. Lincoln, without the consent of it's citizens.


It just wouldn't make any sense that Kentucky and Virginia are considered Southern, but not West Virginia.

[appalachiangirl]

I honestly don't understand why people care so much whether WV is a northern or southern state. It is in AMERICA as are 49 other states! I have lived in WV,PA and MD and honestly could not notice that much of a difference in the regions . WV is as one poster put it "Both" (at least that is what I'd call it). It is unique in many ways--more "southern" than ,say New York,and more "northern" than Georgia. (Referring to the culture as well as geography)

[Colby "The Punk" Wells]

Originally Posted by appalachiangirl

I honestly don't understand why people care so much whether WV is a northern or southern state. It is in AMERICA as are 49 other states! I have lived in WV,PA and MD and honestly could not notice that much of a difference in the regions . WV is as one poster put it "Both" (at least that is what I'd call it). It is unique in many ways--more "southern" than ,say New York,and more "northern" than Georgia. (Referring to the culture as well as geography)

I find this topic fascinating, don't you?

[NOVAmtneer82]

it is fascinating indeed...and punk ps where can one get that book you mentioned above, i'm a history buff and even though i no longer live in WV, i think it would be an interesting read.

And yes I can agree with your logic that it wouldn't entirely make sense if Kentucky and VA are southern and WV (parts of that is) are not. Howver there is a very distinct line in VA that starts about an hour north of Richmond and heads north. This zone namely consists of the Northern VA burbs of DC and they truly are about as far from southern as it gets. I live in Arlington, right across the river from DC and it is common to go out to the public places in my neighborhood and here DOZENS of different languages being spoken, none of them english lol. The NoVA natives (if you could ever find any) would bust an artery and go into a seizure if you EVER told them they were the dreaded "s word." They just really don't like it for some reason...

[Colby "The Punk" Wells]

Originally Posted by jfronz

it is fascinating indeed...and punk ps where can one get that book you mentioned above, i'm a history buff and even though i no longer live in WV, i think it would be an interesting read.

And yes I can agree with your logic that it wouldn't entirely make sense if Kentucky and VA are southern and WV (parts of that is) are not. Howver there is a very distinct line in VA that starts about an hour north of Richmond and heads north. This zone namely consists of the Northern VA burbs of DC and they truly are about as far from southern as it gets. I live in Arlington, right across the river from DC and it is common to go out to the public places in my neighborhood and here DOZENS of different languages being spoken, none of them english lol. The NoVA natives (if you could ever find any) would bust an artery and go into a seizure if you EVER told them they were the dreaded "s word." They just really don't like it for some reason...

Hello again jfonz, I apologize from earlier. I bought my copy the other day online for $15 ($18 including shipping), I was really fortunate to find it. There are some on Amazon right now Amazon.com: A House Divided: A Study of Statehood Politics and Copperhead Movement in West Virginia" by Richard Orr Curry, but I will find some more websites for you that sell it cheaper.

I definitely agree with you, Northern Virginia has changed a lot throughout the years. Lots of Northerners have moved there along with Maryland and made it more Northeastern or Mid-Atlantic in culture. I really hate to see this happen in NoVa, with all the controversy around it, but that's the way it is. I found this link on Wikipedia and thought you might enjoy this. So Close, Yet So Far Apart - washingtonpost.com

[Colby "The Punk" Wells]

Good news jfronz, I was able to find the book much cheaper. As low as as $17.79.

A house divided; a study of statehood politics and the Copperhead movement in West Virginia. by Richard Orr Curry (Used, New, Out-of-Print) - Alibris UK

[snorpus]

I, too, find this topic fascinating. I don't have time to comment at length now, and I'm leaving after work for a long weekend at Watoga (and the Hillsboro Chocolate Festival). But here's something to think about.

West Virginia was settled by at least two, rather different, migrations. (I'm referring here to pre-1850.) The Scots-Irish largely came across Pennsylvania and New York, then up the Mon and down the Ohio. These would be the "Whiskey Rebellion" folks, who left PA to get further from the tax men. This group was largely not slave-owners, although it might be a stretch to say they were anti-slavery.

The second migration was from western Virginia and North Carolina, via the New and Kanawha Rivers. These would be people more accustomed to slavery, although the topography of West Virginia isn't favorable to the kind of large plantations that we normally associate with the south.

I'll reserve judgment on the thesis of the book you referenced until I can obtain a copy. (Can you see this obscure book mysteriously rising in the Amazon.com sales rankings? ).

[italianbluesboy]

Originally Posted by atlantagreg30127

The accents were not Southern but were more monotone or generic "rural" until you get to the Beckley/Bluefield areas,

Or 5 miles away in Loudendale.

[David Kennedy]

The Catholics of the 1780 migration got it from both ends...They were outlawed in Virginia due to the Church of England. Their route was through Maryland to Cumberland and down into the Morgantown area.
Others, shipped up to Carlisle, Pa and moved west accross Pa to Pittsburgh and down the Ohio or came upstream in to Northern Virginia...once here, religion played almost no part of their lives...about 1790, Bishop Asbury brought the Methodist Religion in from Winchester but he was appalled at the open public sex and drunkeness that he witnessed often and logged into his diaries. Presbertianism came with the Scots...most of the Irish became Methodists and at last in the 1840's the Catholics were recognized/ established because many of them wanted to be buried in sanctified soil and it had to be consecrated.
Snorpus mentioned the 'Whiskey Rebellion'...the Western area of Virginia was still on a barter system...money, unless it was Spanish or French hard money was as worthless as a Continental Dollar. Even nails were used as money for a time...mostly goods were just traded for each others goods...money wasn't needed...
The Whiskey Tax demanded hard cash...it didn't exist..the 'Alien & Sedition Act infered that the citizens of Monongalia were not citizens...although they had fought as Rev. War soldiers and the mix got so bad that The Virginians burnt the courthouses...our courthouse in Mon county and the other over in Fayette Co, Pa...nobody knew who did it either...that brought George Washington over with 15,000 troops and some of the neighbors moved to Kentucky where the could be really free (from Taxes) for a few more years...

When the Civil War broke out and it was spun as an issue of 'States Right's...Western Virginia had not a little love for the mother state...she had neglected her roads, her schools and her everything...
Slavery was not so much an issue here...property was viewed as property....
Quakers were looked upon as seditionists because they ran the underground railroads...
The real history of Wv is much more dramatic and colorful than the propaganda we learned in the 5th grade...Someone needs to tell it truthfully...we deserve that...its the only way...I hope I see a copy in my hands eventually...

[Colby "The Punk" Wells]

Good stuff guys, I appreciate the info. I ordered my copy Saturday and I'm still waiting for it to get here. However, the info I knew about WV's history came from none other than bobilee himself, so I haven't got to read it yet.

I saw on a map earlier the only part of Western Virginia that had a slave population was Kanawha County.

Originally Posted by italianbluesboy

Or 5 miles away in Loudendale.

I agree, there are a lot of people with a Southern accent in Kanawha County.

Originally Posted by snorpus

I'll reserve judgment on the thesis of the book you referenced until I can obtain a copy. (Can you see this obscure book mysteriously rising in the Amazon.com sales rankings? ).

Hurry Snorpus, before it's too late, lol!