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Old 08-07-2012, 06:46 AM
 
6,663 posts, read 4,984,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Kennedy View Post
We are living in a new era...

It's identical to the era of 1900 when the Fisks, Carnegies, Morgans, Astors, Rockefellers and others owned everything.

The little guy barely made it then and it was our american children in the sweat shops of New York City.

Locales have changed...it's the chinese school kids in the sweat shops now...poverty...misery...its still there.

There's an old adage...'The more things change...The more they stay the same.
In some ways it is similar, David, but it is not identical. The early elites had Christian underpinnings and felt a direct connection to the ordinary person. They profited enormously, but they made sure the money stayed here and was invested here, and they used philanthropy to actually benefit the ordinary person rather than as a tax dodge to find a way to give some of their lazy relatives a job. The current elites are not nearly as altruistic. They are "globalists" who not only feel little connection to the rest of us, they are more than willing to stab us in the back if they can make an extra buck doing it.
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Old 08-07-2012, 08:10 PM
 
Location: The great state of Texas
15,755 posts, read 7,391,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTMountaineer View Post
In some ways it is similar, David, but it is not identical. The early elites had Christian underpinnings and felt a direct connection to the ordinary person. They profited enormously, but they made sure the money stayed here and was invested here, and they used philanthropy to actually benefit the ordinary person rather than as a tax dodge to find a way to give some of their lazy relatives a job. The current elites are not nearly as altruistic. They are "globalists" who not only feel little connection to the rest of us, they are more than willing to stab us in the back if they can make an extra buck doing it.
SPOT ON.
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Old 08-09-2012, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Huntington, WV
2,952 posts, read 3,524,385 times
Reputation: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Coal worker deaths so far this year in WV - 19.

Oil and gas related deaths so far this year in WV - 0.
Very good point. Although the gas industry does seem to have some widespread health issues in some communities as well. When you consider the jobs lost with the decline of the coal industry directly and indirectly, how will that affect well being as well? Especially considering the minimal jobs created by the gas industry.
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Old 08-09-2012, 09:03 PM
 
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The answer to that lies in whether the spin off industries made possible from the wet gas deposits are developed here. There is great wealth to be distributed in that manner, but if I were running things in the wet gas areas I would insist that if they are going to take the product out of the ground in say, Marshall County, there needs to be a cracker facility built in that county. The jobs would follow. The danger is that the super rich will simply build pipelines and ship the gas to Canada to be processed. Then we get few jobs long term. We are not known as an industry friendly state, so that might take place unless we can get some laws passed, like right to work laws for example.

We all know wealthy energy interests in fact control our state government. They also control our national representation. New York has a moritorium on gas exploration until they can get some guarantees in place, and that might be a good thing. They have even more gas than do we.
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Old 08-09-2012, 09:13 PM
 
Location: Huntington, WV
2,952 posts, read 3,524,385 times
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I think West Virginia will see even less direct benefit with natural gas than we did with coal. Our resources will be extracted and they, along with the profits, will be taken elsewhere. The worst part is, gas is reducing the impact of the only real economic egg in West Virginia's basket. It will be interesting to see how that affects the future.

to re-emphasize this quote:

Quote:
Apt said having a natural resource bounty is one thing, and using it wisely is another. The current wholesale price of natural gas is about $3 here, but $12 or more in Europe and Japan.

"It's clear people will want to export" the Marcellus gas, Apt said, adding that such an outcome could lead to what economists call "the resource curse," which is when the general population hardly benefits, while a few get very rich.
Marcellus becoming most productive - The Herald Dispatch
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Old 08-10-2012, 06:13 AM
 
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The average voter in our state is illogically blinded by party loyalty. Parties have absolutely nothing to do with it. The super rich can easily dominate either party. We need to vote in some people who actually represent the state's people, not the special interest group hacks we traditionally have running things.
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:48 PM
 
6,351 posts, read 3,924,201 times
Reputation: 1689
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTMountaineer View Post
The average voter in our state is illogically blinded by party loyalty. Parties have absolutely nothing to do with it. The super rich can easily dominate either party. We need to vote in some people who actually represent the state's people, not the special interest group hacks we traditionally have running things.
We need to tar and feather the crooks in Charleston, disband the Charleston machine, and start over.
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Old 08-10-2012, 02:33 PM
 
Location: Huntington, WV
2,952 posts, read 3,524,385 times
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1,300 coal jobs lost for West Virginia in the 2nd quarter of 2012 alone. This will likely only increase with time.

MSHA: W.Va. lost 1,300 coal jobs in 2nd quarter - The Herald Dispatch
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Old 08-10-2012, 11:39 PM
 
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The reason that is happening is the elites have a surplus of natural gas right now, and until they can figure out a way to rip us off by taking it out of the ground and sending it to foreign countries, they will use it here because it is cheaper to extract than coal.
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Old 08-11-2012, 03:10 PM
 
Location: Western Pennsylvania
2,380 posts, read 4,372,135 times
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When the North Shore oil fields in Alaska started to be developed (40 or so years ago), didn't they put into effect an excise tax on oil?

If I recall, the tax money went into a state-wide fund, and annually every Alaskan receives a check for their share of the fund. I think there are some limitations, like you have to be a resident for X years before you're eligible, etc.

To follow up on CT's proposal, maybe the tax could be reduced or waived if the wet gas is processed within the state.
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