Home Rule (Charleston, Huntington, Parkersburg: environment, equity, property taxes)

[creemarie]

There has been a lot of talk around the state recently about Home Rule. I was just wondering what everyone thinks of this issue.

Has anyone ever lived in an area where they practiced home rule, and what's your experience with it?

Do you think it would be a good thing for the major cities in West Virginia?

Just curious...

[tbailey1138]

We'll see what happens with home rule but here are a couple of articles from today's paper about it.

Home rule plan released - Huntington, WV -- The Herald-Dispatch
Plan getting good reviews, but there are some questions - Huntington, WV -- The Herald-Dispatch

I found this quote interesting "Morgantown officials, who made the strongest push for the bill's passage during the legislative session earlier this year, are now saying they will not submit a proposal to the state panel that will decide which city or cities get to participate." Anyone know why? Morgantown was initially pushing to be the only pilot city to be allowed to have home rule. That's a complete turn around and seems interesting.

[TruePride]

Seems like the government within the city just wants more power therefore im against it.

[tbailey1138]

I think cities being able to determine their own course is a better situation than what we have know. I think that the cities already have the power to do a lot of the things they are proposing but they currently have to get permission from Charleston to enact them. This allows a lot of bureaucracy rather than doing what's best for the area. I think it would be better to have a little more power regionally to deal with problems as needed but still having to answer to Charleston if they overstep their bounds. Home rule could definately be abused but also could do a lot of good.

[David Kennedy]

Morgantown backed away from 'Home Rule' beause of the revolt of the people to the north...Pittsburgh.

After years of excessive city taxation, Pittsburghers reached their limit and voted in a new conservative city council.

Morgantown tried an end run and was successful, without a whimper a 'User Fee' was instituted on everyone working in the city. $2.00 per week.
With the idea that eventually it would be changed to a percentage of the wage. (rough estimate: $150,000 additional tax per month.
The only outcry coming from the part-time college food/service workers...and in Mo-town, they don't really count. Now all the big cities in WV want a 'User Fee'. Its all in how you label the package...and the 'User Fee' does not have any strings tied to the yahoos in Charleston.

[tbailey1138]

Originally Posted by David Kennedy

Morgantown backed away from 'Home Rule' beause of the revolt of the people to the north...Pittsburgh.

Now all the big cities in WV want a 'User Fee'. Its all in how you label the package...and the 'User Fee' does not have any strings tied to the yahoos in Charleston.

Morgantown was the city that pushed the hardest for home rule though, already knowing what was going on in Pittsburgh. Their position has only changed in the last month or so and that article was the first mention of it. I'd like to hear the official line from the Morgantown leaders about this.

WBOY-TV – News for Clarksburg, Fairmont, Morgantown, West Virginia

As for the user fee, Huntington was the first to institute a user fee in the state about 3-4 years ago. Then Weirton and Charleston followed suit. Morgantown is actually one of the last of the big cities to institute a user fee. Without homerule though, they won't be able to turn the user fee into a payroll tax as the Legislature and constitution won't allow this. Mon County is the first county to have a user fee though, meaning those who work in Morgantown will get hit by two separate $2 user fees each week.

Here's an article from 2005
The State Journal - News for West Virginia's Leaders

[corestrength101]

The concept of this, though it will great to enhance Monongalia county & make more space on the roads, should be thoroughly examined. Note that the citizens will incur a tax for the next 30 years. Right now it is $2/ week but there is no guarantee that the $2 fee will remain at that price, it could very easily increase. Not to mention the stress & traffic jams individuals will encounter on the roads for many years to come. Projects do not complete in a timely fashion very often & given that the fee can exist for 30+ years, I do not see anyone speeding up to get things done. Consider voting February 2, 2008 in Monongalia County.

[Lone Star Rebel]

OK, I'll bite. What is the "Home Rule" thing y'all are discussing?

Thanks.

[harborlady]

Originally Posted by tbailey1138

I think cities being able to determine their own course is a better situation than what we have know. I think that the cities already have the power to do a lot of the things they are proposing but they currently have to get permission from Charleston to enact them. This allows a lot of bureaucracy rather than doing what's best for the area. I think it would be better to have a little more power regionally to deal with problems as needed but still having to answer to Charleston if they overstep their bounds. Home rule could definately be abused but also could do a lot of good.

Thanks for posting that article. I'll be a new resident of WV shortly and had no clue what home rule was all about. My input is limited based on mistakes and successes from NY region. I hope it will help you avoid the pitfalls when making your decsions.
I want to start out by saying- nobody wants to pay taxes, but we all know it's a neccessary evil. That's the price of civilization. The next question is, how much 'civilizing' do you want, and at what price? My own bias, which made me choose to live in WV, is that I want less civilizing. I'd rather my tax dollars make sure all children get immunized than sponsor a frivilous dog park.
I agree wholeheartedly that much of a communities problems can be solved at a local level, and to interfere with that is only going to make charlestons job more cumbersome and unmanageable. The abuses will happen in the form of a million paper cuts that bleed people to death. I cited in a previous thread that I'm already being taxed at a socialism level, but I'm not getting the benefits of socialism. Is that the world you want?
The danger lies in governments of all levels (local, county, state, fed) seeing its role to shake down folks as much as possible to sponsor it's causes and feed itself. They become oblivious to the fact that I've already been shaken down and compete for whats left in my hand. Please see the language they used in that article; "capture". Predatory. In other words, we want to target a certain group of people to sponsor our thing by legally imposing it upon them. What a crummy attitude.
Yes, it hurts everyone when abandoned properties are left to pot. Before the government decides it needs to muscle folks over to improve neighborhoods through taxation programs, its best they examine how they've shot themselves in the foot by interfering with commerce.

I'd love to rebuild that house and add value to a neighborhood instead of detract. It would also add to the job base for tradesmen. The fact is, those tax sales come with huge pig in a poke liabilities that the courts pass on to the new owners. Asbestos, lead abatement, and building materials are very costly, and as things stand, it attracts unscroupulous characters who would sidestep environmental laws or fools who can't manage a business plan. Let's not forget the grief from the neighbors who remember the sad story of the previous owner, their resentments for having to tolerate construction workers making their street noisy, or the materials pilfering that goes on in economically depressed areas. I have no assurances that should I invest in rebuilding, that my property taxes won't increase 1,000% the moment I'm done.
Government is saying 'we're open for business', but outsiders see something worse than not helping. I'm witnessing them not having the decency to stay out of the way of people who are committed to being constructive. I see a government who entitles itself to count my chickens before they've even hatched. Like an insincere boyfriend, his words and deeds do not match and shame on me if I take his wooing seriously.

What I've witnessed as highest yield investment in communities has less taxation involved, but more sweat equity from it's citizens. Neighborhood watch programs, cooperative bargaining (rural towns banding together to sponsor locals with blades on their trucks to plow snow as needed etc), urban gardens, seniors for literacy volunteers (helping school efforts with story telling hours at the library, or directly in the classrooms). The more cohesive a community is, the more hospitable the environment is for growth/improvements. Honestly, if I did not see West Virginians taking care of their own, I would not have chosen to live here. I consider it your greatest asset that I hope to contribute to myself.
The second highest yield comes from tax dollars spent as seed money, or training wheels, for business that will go from fledgling to a meaningful contributor to the economic eco system through creation of jobs. The third highest yield comes from tax dollars spent on education that raises standards, because those test scores are intimately tied in with the market value of homes, and provides business with a higher common denominator of job candidates. The least yield comes from programs that never had a plan to pay for themselves built into their architecture.

Whichever side of the political spectrum your expectations lie, I hope every West Virginian would be clear about what their priorities are, and be sure to communicate that directly to their representatives. If your expectations are too high, it won't get delivered. If too much growth is pushed too fast, taxes will shoot through the roof, killing your economy. If what you want is frivilous, it squanders precious resources away from the greater good, and leaves all citizens with less value for their dollar. If what you want is too specific to a special interest group, it burdens the whole community with a potentially infinite subsidy. Choose wisely.

[tbailey1138]

Harborlady, I agree with your post and as I admitted earlier, home rule is something that has the ability to be abused. But so is the sysytem that is in place now. As it stands now, if the good folks in Charleston don't want something to happen then it won't happen regardless of what city the said request involves. Why should Charleston choose what's best for the folks in Huntington, Parkersburg, Wheeling, Morgantown etc. when the leaders and people in each respective city have the greatest feel for what's best for them? I think home rule the way it is planned here allows for a better balance of local power while the state still has the ability to step in and say "you're out of bounds with this, let's back up a little" rather than "we don't care how this will benefit you, we're not letting you do this." The last option happens way more than it should. As I've said in other posts before, part of this problem stems from the mindset of the leaders and people of this state. They want to think that this state is only big enough for one (fill in the blank) and the leaders in Charleston often step in to stop any competition to whatever it is that they want to protect. They do this under the guise of the above mindset when in reality, there is usually some motive behind the scenes that makes them want to stop progress. This motive is usually greed and the "I want it all and want as much power as possible" mindset. In having this mindset though, they are only hurting this great state and it's cities. They say competition breeds success, but competition isn't encouraged in this state but rather it is often discouraged. The good thing about the current Home Rule Pilot project is that it ends after only 5 years. So if it seems that the system isn't working or is being abused, things will revert back to the way they were until a better idea comes along. The way I see it, it's better to have tried something new and failed than to just keep doing the same old thing which obviously isn't working. Home rule hasn't been implemented though and may not make it out of the current legislative session alive thanks to efforts to stall enacting the program.