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Old 05-11-2017, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Hartford, Connecticut
2,721 posts, read 2,048,901 times
Reputation: 2091

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Nothing. The industry that you guys relied on for decades is slowly disappearing. Coal is a non-renewable source and once it's mined, it's all gone.
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Old 05-12-2017, 06:47 PM
 
4 posts, read 3,040 times
Reputation: 30
Default Not gonna happen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colt .45 View Post
it'll never happen but I think it should....
WV became a state because they were a financial drain on Virginia and did not get the money to keep going. Scotland is facing the same thing right now in the UK. Should they leave the UK? After Brexit, things will only get worse, and could even get catastrophic if the Brexit is a firm one. There is no way Virginia would want WV and even if they did, things would not get better. In other words, we would just want to secede again. History is our teacher. If we were a wealthy state, then VA might take us back. Being practically impoverished, there is no way!

WV needs to export things. Any things. Exporting coal got us this far. Some ideas on things that can be exported are:

Manufactured goods
Assembled goods
Sand and gravel
Timber
Pulp and paper
Intellectual property
Natural gas
Agricultural goods
Beer, wine, and spirits
Foods
Electricity
from Wind
from Natural gas
from Nuclear energy ? Why not??

Venezuela is facing a crisis much worse than us because they were an oil producing state who became dependent on imports. They had money, so they stopped being self reliant. Now that the oil industry there is in such a shambles, they will need to become self reliant and eventually start exporting other things as they had in the early 20th century. They knew how, they need to relearn that. If you don't have money, then you can't export it. Instead, you must IMPORT money. They only way to do that is to sell (export) things.

WV could use a few corporate headquarters. Do we have something to offer big corps that others don't? Look at Ireland as an example. Why did all the giant corporations flock to them? What does Delaware have that we don't?

Let's rely less on government handouts, which come with strings attached. See the previous paragraph for good reasons to not let the fed tell us what to do. When they give money, they call the shots.

Tourism is a great thing here in the state. How many times have you plugged a destination into your car NAV only to find that it does not know about many of the state corridors. For example sr48. It is an absolutely beautiful drive and one of many which have not been included in modern NAV's. I have a 2015 Range Rover Sport and a 2011 SuperDuty Ford with a 2016 GPS update, and neither of these vehicles knows about 48. That road has been there for a decade at least!

Tourism is importing money. We want it, we need it, and it is the only thing I can think of which is self propagating.

Why shouldn't the state work with large REITS to build lake homes on all the watersheds? Imagine a lake like Stonecoal surrounded by vacation properties one can rent? Our state has dozens of these lakes, which are just waiting for tactful development so that folks outside the state will actually want to come. Just the property alone is worth several years of the states budget. I say, why the hell not?

I have many other ideas which may or may not be unique. What I do know is that all three of my sons plan on leaving the state. That is 3 college educated bright young men. They represent most young adults. It is very sad, but understandable.
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Old 05-12-2017, 07:11 PM
 
641 posts, read 381,988 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang_guy View Post
WV became a state because they were a financial drain on Virginia and did not get the money to keep going. Scotland is facing the same thing right now in the UK. Should they leave the UK? After Brexit, things will only get worse, and could even get catastrophic if the Brexit is a firm one. There is no way Virginia would want WV and even if they did, things would not get better. In other words, we would just want to secede again. History is our teacher. If we were a wealthy state, then VA might take us back. Being practically impoverished, there is no way!

WV needs to export things. Any things. Exporting coal got us this far. Some ideas on things that can be exported are:

Manufactured goods
Assembled goods
Sand and gravel
Timber
Pulp and paper
Intellectual property
Natural gas
Agricultural goods
Beer, wine, and spirits
Foods
Electricity
from Wind
from Natural gas
from Nuclear energy ? Why not??

Venezuela is facing a crisis much worse than us because they were an oil producing state who became dependent on imports. They had money, so they stopped being self reliant. Now that the oil industry there is in such a shambles, they will need to become self reliant and eventually start exporting other things as they had in the early 20th century. They knew how, they need to relearn that. If you don't have money, then you can't export it. Instead, you must IMPORT money. They only way to do that is to sell (export) things.

WV could use a few corporate headquarters. Do we have something to offer big corps that others don't? Look at Ireland as an example. Why did all the giant corporations flock to them? What does Delaware have that we don't?

Let's rely less on government handouts, which come with strings attached. See the previous paragraph for good reasons to not let the fed tell us what to do. When they give money, they call the shots.

Tourism is a great thing here in the state. How many times have you plugged a destination into your car NAV only to find that it does not know about many of the state corridors. For example sr48. It is an absolutely beautiful drive and one of many which have not been included in modern NAV's. I have a 2015 Range Rover Sport and a 2011 SuperDuty Ford with a 2016 GPS update, and neither of these vehicles knows about 48. That road has been there for a decade at least!

Tourism is importing money. We want it, we need it, and it is the only thing I can think of which is self propagating.

Why shouldn't the state work with large REITS to build lake homes on all the watersheds? Imagine a lake like Stonecoal surrounded by vacation properties one can rent? Our state has dozens of these lakes, which are just waiting for tactful development so that folks outside the state will actually want to come. Just the property alone is worth several years of the states budget. I say, why the hell not?

I have many other ideas which may or may not be unique. What I do know is that all three of my sons plan on leaving the state. That is 3 college educated bright young men. They represent most young adults. It is very sad, but understandable.



While I appreciate your input, you obviously no idea why West Virginia became a state. You might want to refrain from that topic in the future. But, on your other topics you have very good input. The problem in West Virginia - and I have tried to not go there because I would like to discuss this subject without this injection but here goes - West Virginia is the way it is because for almost the last 100 years it has had one party rule. If I can leave the topic there we might be lucky.
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Old 05-12-2017, 07:21 PM
 
4 posts, read 3,040 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caden Grace View Post
I have really avoided the main issue of this thread because I see no winning answer to it. West Virginia's economic problems are culturally. I love West Virginia, I love everything about it and even most of the qualities of its people as they can be a wonderful niche in a crazy world. You can go any where and not meet a stranger. I am talking about people that were born and raised, not those that moved here because of work or to import drugs, but real West Virginians.


West Virginians can be very noble, generous and tender people and just as easily be filled with duty, honor and grit.


But...


They are some of the dumbest people intellectually and culturally as you will ever meet.


It is the Celtic clannish heritage that threads its way into our West Virginia lineage. We distrust everyone if they don't live next door. While we are nice to others we think of anyone not from "our holler" as an outsider. So stupid.


When a high school students tells mom and dad they want to go to college - even in state, the reaction of the parents in those rural communities is, "Do you think you are better than us?!?!?!"


When you have that sort of environment in common across the state between all rural families one must weep for the intellectual future of the whole state.


The people that eventually do get a job - always through nepotism - it is usually with the state, because if you work for the state, you really do not do any work, get a fat paycheck - relative to other West Virginians - superb insurance for you and your family and a big fat retirement - all for doing nothing, mostly.


There are other fields to obtain employment but they mirror the government sector, mostly medical or legal and what used to be coal. They are all one stop jobs, meaning you get in and you ride it until you retire. Another set of industries where you don't have to produce much. More than in the government but not that much more.


Then we have the elite academia idiots otherwise known as the education system and college professors of West Virginia. Again, all entitled people feeling like life owes them and if not life, at least the tax payer via the government. West Virginia has 3 or 4 dozen colleges and universities and it needs ONE. There is not even any need for Marshall; all of it should be under WVU and almost every single campus should be closed across the state. Tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars wasted every year!


The last major working group are those in the service industry, usually working 1.5 jobs and dreaming of the day they can get the hell of this state!


Everyone else is on welfare, Medicaid, HUD and food stamps, laying back on the sofa, watching their big screens, playing with their consoles, driving rather nice cars and often, doing a decent amount of recreational drugs and all of them are F A T asses and speak English one level above caveman. You know them, the kind that wear florescent sweatpants and flip-flops to Walmart.


So what is wrong with West Virginia - West Virginians and no one is going to fix that.
I have lived in Parkersburg, WV my entire life, and I do not agree with most of what you have said. You seem like a disgruntled person with lots of stones to throw. Either that, or you have been watching too much TV.

If you only need one college, why not make it university of Charleston? It is centered in the state and in the capital. Farther away for brains to drain, the supporting systems for the university including it's employees would live in the state instead of PA, KY, OH and MD.

I could go on rebutting all the stones you threw, but I think you were just ranting. Although there is value in a good rant now and then, it is not productive to this thread. WV is a beautiful state full of giving and loving people who have a strong work ethic.

Say what you will. You are obviously being surrounded and influenced by a different sort of West Virginian than I am.
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Old 05-12-2017, 08:19 PM
 
4 posts, read 3,040 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caden Grace View Post
While I appreciate your input, you obviously no idea why West Virginia became a state. You might want to refrain from that topic in the future. But, on your other topics you have very good input. The problem in West Virginia - and I have tried to not go there because I would like to discuss this subject without this injection but here goes - West Virginia is the way it is because for almost the last 100 years it has had one party rule. If I can leave the topic there we might be lucky.
The mountains were a natural border between what is now Virginia and West Virginia. This border removed those in power from those in need, and it had been stated in early documents many times that those people on the west felt abandoned by those in power. This was true as early as Westylvania and during Vandalia colony. I assume you read the wiki to get your history. Sit down and actually read some things that were written during the times before the civil war.

Your knowledge of history obviously only scratches the surface of the truth.

Now I am getting the impression you are just an aggrieved blow hard.
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Old 05-12-2017, 08:27 PM
 
1,429 posts, read 1,117,217 times
Reputation: 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang_guy View Post
I have lived in Parkersburg, WV my entire life, and I do not agree with most of what you have said. You seem like a disgruntled person with lots of stones to throw. Either that, or you have been watching too much TV.

If you only need one college, why not make it university of Charleston? It is centered in the state and in the capital. Farther away for brains to drain, the supporting systems for the university including it's employees would live in the state instead of PA, KY, OH and MD.

I could go on rebutting all the stones you threw, but I think you were just ranting. Although there is value in a good rant now and then, it is not productive to this thread. WV is a beautiful state full of giving and loving people who have a strong work ethic.

Say what you will. You are obviously being surrounded and influenced by a different sort of West Virginian than I am.
LOL you have GOT to be trolling! Hahahahahahahahahahaha
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Old 05-12-2017, 08:34 PM
 
71,717 posts, read 30,658,897 times
Reputation: 14168
Quote:
Originally Posted by motownnative View Post
I have to agree that some of the problem is cultural and I don't think that part is fixable. Others stated it well. I was born here but my parents who weren't didn't necessarily fit in and nothing has changed in that regard in 50+ years. People are truly proud of their mountain heritage here; much of which involves living off the land, purposefully being isolated, etc. Even WVU's Mountaineer mascot reflects that.

This is just the predominant mindset here and I accept it. I don't agree with all of it but experience has caused me to question the motives of trying to change it. It would be like me moving to New Mexico (using this as an example as it's another poor state) and trying to change the culture and the people there. It would make more sense to settle in a place that I accept for what it is.

This topic about the economy comes up a lot. I just wanted to throw out another opinion. I have to wonder if many have considered that the rural nature of our state happens to attract people who aren't all that interested in the economy. The rural parts around me are a haven for homesteaders, people who want to live "off the grid", militia types and even doomsday "preppers". A lot moved from other states TO live as isolated as they possibly could.

One other factor that should be considered is our weather is just not attractive. That's not changing either. https://www.currentresults.com/Weath.../cloudiest.php
Elkins WV is tied for 4th in the nation for rainiest cities in the US. The 10 Worst Weather Cities - Farmers' Almanac
Seattle of course has more rain but has very mild winters which we don't. These are big factors that people consider on where to locate. There are plenty of people I know who were raised here and had good opportunities but left for Florida or California just for better weather.

I have learned to tolerate the gloominess here even though I find it depressing. But this got me thinking; To "me" there are worse places. Personally, I am afraid of storms and you couldn't pay me any amount of money to live in tornado alley. (Literally, if my salary doubled I wouldn't move there). Sadly, many people feel the same way about WV for lots of reasons - the hick stereotype #1 - and I think that there are many executives of companies saying this about our state when it comes up for a prospect to locate to: "No way, you couldn't PAY me to live there".
I love being in the mountains when it's raining. Standing in the stream with a pole in your hand and rain falling is something many people miss out on.

Is that something the state can exploit for great riches? No but it's priceless.
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Old 05-12-2017, 09:42 PM
 
9,438 posts, read 11,592,872 times
Reputation: 1525
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang_guy View Post
If you only need one college, why not make it university of Charleston? It is centered in the state and in the capital. Farther away for brains to drain, the supporting systems for the university including it's employees would live in the state instead of PA, KY, OH and MD.
Surely you jest? Tell somebody in Martinsburg, Wheeling, Morgantown or Clarksburg that is somehow the center of the state and see what reaction you get. It isn't even the center of Kanawha County. I will agree that it is more completely isolated and further removed from positive influences found in areas located in larger population centers such as DC and Pittsburgh, but existing for more than a century as the center of our state's corrupt and nepotistic state government sure doesn't lend anything special to the place.

As I said before, our state has various problems in the six distinct areas that are different from one another, but one thing that is universal is the fact that open borders, cheap labor policies promoted by the wealthy elite who control both major political parties have devastated heavy industry which was once the bedrock of the state's economy. Most of the best jobs have been moved to China and any other cheap labor place they can dredge up. That needs to change.
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Old 05-12-2017, 11:16 PM
 
Location: Elkins, WV
1,981 posts, read 5,250,078 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTMountaineer View Post
Indeed... you have been supporting one area as much as anybody. The meat of NCWV runs Monongalia, Marion, Harrison. Those 3 counties have close to 200,000 residents alone (combined), and geographically (again combined) they are about the same size as Kanawha. Just because Mon County borders PA, does not mean it is any less relevant than any other county. Cabell borders Ohio and Kentucky, and nobody would suggest it is a fringe area due to that. I'm not supporting just our county. I'm suggesting that expanding I-68 would have a bigger impact than Corridor H. It is within the proximity of the bulk of the population of NCWV. The fringe areas ... Barbour, etc. are much smaller in size. If you go south of Bridgeport/Anmoore, there is scant population until you go 130 miles to the fringe areas of Charleston. Buckhannon and Elkins together have around 34,000 total, spread out, and they are already connected to I-79.

If you are talking about growing areas ... right now there are only two. The Eastern Panhandle and NCWV. Even Putnam County lost a small amount of population with the most recent estimates, and until recently, that was the only southern tier county to have gains. But since you are talking about finding ways to make all parts of the state grow. My contention is it will take infrastructure in the northern and eastern areas, and a shift of paradigms in the southern areas. There is no one size fits all solution. We really have 5 little states in one here in West Virginia, and the needs of the various areas are vastly different from one another. I'm sorry if you believe it sophomoric to have a different opinion than your own, but if you just want people to agree with you, why would you posit the question?
Randolph and Upshur actually have about 54,000 between the two.. and they are connected to I-79, however Corridor H isn't finished... does I-79 end at Morgantown and not connect it to other areas? I have continually said I'm supporting the whole state. Someone mentioned Corridor H as a road to no-where and I commented... There are other growing areas in the state believe it or not. However, if you look at the map from the WVU College of Business & Economics from 2010-2030... A few dark blue areas is not going to make up for the substantial sea of red most of our state is seeing. When you look at growing states with growing economies you have widespread growth.

I do not consider a difference of opinion sophomoric but the title of this thread is "How do we fix WV". Not how do we fix Morgantown and Martinsburg. I don't mind people not agreeing with me on what types of industries, tax incentives, or marketing will turn our state around. Because disagreement leads to compromise and collaboration... But simply focusing on a few areas isn't going to suddenly catapult the state into growth and I do disagree with that and that is not the point of my original post. I'm thrilled that some places are experiencing growth. But it is time to think out of the box, embrace change, help a neighbor, and move our WHOLE state forward.

So with that being said... WHAT can be done to change the state? The economy? The mindset of the population? The outside perception? One only needs to look at the recent WV Supreme Court rulings and the national news and comment section to see the stereotypes that are still pervasive. Granted the archaic ruling isn't doing much to help recruit younger people... the stereotypes need to end.

How can we fix the WV economy?-wv-pop-30.jpg
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Old 05-13-2017, 12:02 AM
 
4 posts, read 3,040 times
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Yes I was kidding about UC being the only school in WV. I was making a point to the person who said WVU should be the only school. It was a foolish statement, and I was making another even sillier one.

EDIT: Oh and I went to Marshall. GO HERD!
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