What makes West Virginia so different? (Hinton: loan, to live in, prices)

[Threerun]

And Jesus loves you too.

[WVUPharm2007]

Originally Posted by 63AMG

I don't mean to sound rude but, West Virginia is just a backwards cesspool of poor and uneducated " lost causes" (I'm trying to be nice here). Hillary Clinton's core and consistent group of voters. Hillary territory!

What does anyone expect? That's the only thing that can explain this because the overwhelming Hillary percentage as this is out of wack with other states.

So,
Hillary supporters = poor, uneducated "lost causes"
Obama supporters = ?

I don't personally care myself. Anyone stupid enough to believe that any of the three major candidates would actually be a better executive than the other two really shouldn't be blathering on about any sort of intellectual expectancies. None of them have particularly brilliant ideas, nor are they exceedingly charismatic enough to at least fool me into thinking otherwise.

Again, the country will be split 50-50 and two or three states will decide who the next president is. The winner will be an incompetent moron that will continue to let the dollar lose it's footing as the fiat currency of the world in lieu of perpetuating sensationalist politics. Then 20 years from now when the Chinese and Russians buy oil in Euro or Rubles, we will all wonder what, oh what, the devil happened.

I'm voting for Bill Stewart. I figure if the head coach at WVU is also the president, it couldn't hurt recruiting!

[Hinton Bound]

Originally Posted by 63AMG

I don't mean to sound rude but, West Virginia is just a backwards cesspool of poor and uneducated " lost causes" (I'm trying to be nice here). Hillary Clinton's core and consistent group of voters. Hillary territory!

What does anyone expect? That's the only thing that can explain this because the overwhelming Hillary percentage as this is out of wack with other states.

I'm now thoroughly embarrased to be a native NY'er. What an ignorant fool.

HL- I'll try to compose a well thought out answer to the above. My thinking skill is to my typing skill as a cheetah is to a sloth. Well, maybe not a cheetah, but a fast moving, carnivorous mammal I guess I shouldn't have peeked while in typing class....!

[harborlady]

Criticizing Hillary for not having served in military is grossly unfair. Hillary was in different trenches when she was 18-28yrs old. She was born in 1947, and if you'll do the math, see that they 18-28 yr olds the military accepted at the time prohibited her from any armed service. When the door opened, she was past the acceptable age. She was fighting on another front as a Yale graduate lawyer, one that was better use of her abilities. Action figure jokes aside, she's got her own aerobic pace.

To this day, vestiges of that prohibition of women in service still exist in the form of restricted assignments (not based on merit or ability), denial of rank (due to not being at those other prohibited assignments) and denial of honors for combat performance, because they're BY LAW prohibited from being in a combat zone. This was challenged by female heros during reagans stint, who found themselves in a combat zone despite the job title and performed valliantly beyond the call of duty. Despite being highly reccomended by their superiors, they were denied by people who themselves never saw combat but had the authority over the decision. (bona fide elitists, or strict adherants to letters of law, not spirit, depending where you sit on that issue)
Interested in learning more:
Women in the United States Military

There is an entire memorial not many realize just off arlington cemetary in DC. It's there for the women in service, who have served whether or not they were recognized by anyone, not even the Vet Admin. My parkersburg great grandmother belongs on that list for her service to naval base in Va. She stubbornly refused to leave her uniform behind for parades, even if it almost got her arrested for wearing it in public at peacetime.

Hillary didn't quit, she didn't lay down and die, and she didn't whine. She rolled up her sleeves and hoe'd the row. You GO girl!

[snorpus]

Originally Posted by WVUPharm2007

I'm voting for Bill Stewart. I figure if the head coach at WVU is also the president, it couldn't hurt recruiting!

Woo-hoo!!! A Wetzel County native as president. I can hear the Cats moving dirt for I-68 West already.

And as Babe Ruth said when asked why he should be paid more than President Hoover, he replied "Because I had a better year than he did!"

[harborlady]

Originally Posted by Hinton Bound

I'm now thoroughly embarrased to be a native NY'er. What an ignorant fool.

HL- I'll try to compose a well thought out answer to the above. My thinking skill is to my typing skill as a cheetah is to a sloth. Well, maybe not a cheetah, but a fast moving, carnivorous mammal I guess I shouldn't have peeked while in typing class....!

LOL @ hinton. I absolve you of any and all typos. Let your meaning not get lost, I prithee.

[WVUPharm2007]

Check out this thread on the political forum. There are some hilarious quotes on there.

West Virginia is about as relevant as Bangladesh in this election. To even MENTION that hollow Hillary is ahead in the polls in that Godforsaken state is an act of EXTREME PETTINESS

The only argument Hillary Clinton has left is that even though Obama leads in all categories, he is still unelectable because whites will not vote for him in the general election. And it's not just any whites....it's the kind of whites that inhabit the boondocks of West Virginia and Kentucky.

Big deal. She will win 100% of the redneck vote, and that's not going to change the outcome. Obama will be the nominee.
I feel sorry for Hillary Clinton. She has been reduced to depending on rednecks and trailer trash to prop up her dying campaign.

The irony is so thick to me. It's as bad as that scene in Dr. Strangelove where the president scolds the American general and the Russian official for getting into a scuffle then proclaiming, "Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"

Here you have a bunch of people that privy themselves as tolerant, progressive people lambasting the inhabitants of a place they have obviously never been to as prejudiced and too ignorant to make the correct choice. Yet, here I am, certainly not a supporter of Obama, nor Clinton or McCain. I got a doctorate framed on my wall and a smile on my face. Reading about how my lack of education and ignorance fuels my lack of Obama support is quite entertaining.

Honestly though, is this some sort of grand conspiracy designed to humor the people of West Virginia? Are people from other parts of the country really this ignorant?

[Hinton Bound]

OK HL, here's what I think of the human animal. I read this a while back, knew I saved it for a reason!

[SIZE=3]Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident." This is true. Remember, the murder rate is six per 100,000 per year, and the aggravated assault rate is four per 1,000 per year. What this means is that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Some estimates say that two million Americans are victims of violent crimes every year, a tragic, staggering number, perhaps an all-time record rate of violent crime. But there are almost 300 million Americans, which means that the odds of being a victim of violent crime is considerably less than one in a hundred on any given year. Furthermore, since many violent crimes are committed by repeat offenders, the actual number of violent citizens is considerably less than two million. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Thus there is a paradox, and we must grasp both ends of the situation: We may well be in the most violent times in history, but violence is still remarkably rare. This is because most citizens are kind, decent people who are not capable of hurting each other, except by accident or under extreme provocation. They are sheep. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I mean nothing negative by calling them sheep. To me it is like the pretty, blue robin's egg. Inside it is soft and gooey but someday it will grow into something wonderful. But the egg cannot survive without its hard blue shell. Police officers, soldiers, and other warriors are like that shell, and someday the civilization they protect will grow into something wonderful. For now, though, they need warriors to protect them from the predators. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]"Then there are the wolves," the old war veteran said, "and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy." Do you believe there are wolves out there that will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in denial. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]"Then there are sheepdogs," he went on, "and I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf."...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen, a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath, a wolf. But what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow citizens? What do you have then? A sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero's path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Let me expand on this old soldier's excellent model of the sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs. We know that the sheep live in denial, which is what makes them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids' schools. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police officer in their kid's school. Our children are thousands of times more likely to be killed or seriously injured by school violence than fire, but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard, and so they chose the path of denial. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, cannot and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheepdog that intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa." [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Until the wolf shows up! Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]The students, the victims, at Columbine High School were big, tough high school students, and under ordinary circumstances they would not have had the time of day for a police officer. They were not bad kids; they just had nothing to say to a cop. When the school was under attack, however, and SWAT teams were clearing the rooms and hallways, the officers had to physically peel those clinging, sobbing kids off of them. This is how the little lambs feel about their sheepdog when the wolf is at the door. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Look at what happened after September 11, 2001 when the wolf pounded hard on the door. Remember how America, more than ever before, felt differently about their law enforcement officers and military personnel? Remember how many times you heard the word hero? [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move to the sound of the guns when needed right along with the young ones. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America said, "Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes." The sheepdogs, the warriors, said, "Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I could have made a difference." When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warrior hood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, but he does have one real advantage. Only one. And that is that he is able to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the population. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]There was research conducted a few years ago with individuals convicted of violent crimes. These cons were in prison for serious, predatory crimes of violence: assaults, murders and killing law enforcement officers. The vast majority said that they specifically targeted victims by body language: slumped walk, passive behavior and lack of awareness. They chose their victims like big cats do in Africa, when they select one out of the herd that is least able to protect itself. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Some people may be destined to be sheep and others might be genetically primed to be wolves or sheepdogs. But I believe that most people can choose which one they want to be, and I'm proud to say that more and more Americans are choosing to become sheepdogs. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Here is the point I like to emphasize; especially to the thousands of police officers and soldiers I speak to each year. In nature, the sheep, real sheep, are born as sheep. Sheepdogs are born that way, and so are wolves. They didn't have a choice. But you are not a critter. As a human being, you can be whatever you want to be. It is a conscious, moral decision. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]If you want to be a sheep, then you can be a sheep and that is okay, but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes, you and your loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If you want to be a wolf, you can be one, but the sheepdogs are going to hunt you down and you will never have rest, safety, trust, or love. But if you want to be a sheepdog and walk the warrior's path, then you must make a conscious and moral decision every day to dedicate, equip and prepare yourself to thrive in that toxic, corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]For example, many officers carry their weapons in church. They are well concealed in ankle holsters, shoulder holsters or inside-the-belt holsters tucked into the small of their backs. Anytime you go to some form of religious service, there is a very good chance that a police officer in your congregation is carrying. You will never know if there is such an individual in your place of worship, until the wolf appears to massacre you and your loved ones. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I was training a group of police officers in Texas, and during the break, one officer asked his friend if he carried his weapon in church. The other cop replied, "I will never be caught without my gun in church." I asked why he felt so strongly about this, and he told me about a cop he knew who was at a church massacre in Ft. Worth, Texas in 1999. In that incident, a mentally deranged individual came into the church and opened fire, gunning down fourteen people. He said that officer believed he could have saved every life that day if he had been carrying his gun. His own son was shot, and all he could do was throw himself on the boy's body and wait to die. That cop looked me in the eye and said, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself after that?" [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Some individuals would be horrified if they knew this police officer was carrying a weapon in church. They might call him paranoid and would probably scorn him. Yet these same individuals would be enraged and would call for "heads to roll" if they found out that the airbags in their cars were defective, or that the fire extinguisher and fire sprinklers in their kids' school did not work. They can accept the fact that fires and traffic accidents can happen and that there must be safeguards against them. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Their only response to the wolf, though, is denial, and all too often their response to the sheepdog is scorn and disdain. But the sheepdog quietly asks himself, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself if your loved ones were attacked and killed, and you had to stand there helplessly because you were unprepared for that day?" [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]It is denial that turns people into sheep. Sheep are psychologically destroyed by combat because their only defense is denial, which is counterproductive and destructive, resulting in fear, helplessness and horror when the wolf shows up. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Denial kills you twice. It kills you once, at your moment of truth when you are not physically prepared: you didn't bring your gun, you didn't train. Your only defense was wishful thinking. Hope is not a strategy. Denial kills you a second time because even if you do physically survive, you are psychologically shattered by your fear, helplessness, and horror at your moment of truth. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Gavin de Becker puts it like this in "Fear Less," his superb post-9/11 book, which should be required reading for anyone trying to come to terms with our current world situation: "...denial can be seductive, but it has an insidious side effect. For all the peace of mind deniers think they get by saying it isn't so, the fall they take when faced with new violence is all the more unsettling." [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Denial is a save-now-pay-later scheme, a contract written entirely in small print, for in the long run, the denying person knows the truth on some level. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And so the warrior must strive to confront denial in all aspects of his life, and prepare himself for the day when evil comes. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]If you are warrior who is legally authorized to carry a weapon and you step outside without that weapon, then you become a sheep, pretending that the bad man will not come today. No one can be "on" 24/7, for a lifetime. Everyone needs down time. But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... "Baa." [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a matter of degrees, a continuum. On one end is an abject, head-in-the-sand-sheep and on the other end is the ultimate warrior. Few people exist completely on one end or the other. Most of us live somewhere in between. Since 9-11 almost everyone in America took a step up that continuum, away from denial. The sheep took a few steps toward accepting and appreciating their warriors, and the warriors started taking their job more seriously. The degree to which you move up that continuum, away from sheephood and denial, is the degree to which you and your loved ones will survive, physically and psychologically, at your moment of truth. [/SIZE]

[harborlady]

"Are people from other parts of the country really this ignorant?"
As someone who has traveled through extensively in this country for over 25yrs...
YES THEY ARE!
(but they're kin, so we gotta invite them for thanksgiving. smoochie smoo.)





(Let me not forget to mention my own ignorant attitude toward people who squeeze toothpaste from the middle of the tube as some clear sign of mental illness)

[harborlady]

Hinton- could you share the reference.. the author and where the article is found?
Yes, I can agree with it, from having to wear hats of all sorts. On the subject of civil defense, crime and punishment, rogue elements... agreed (even if it's still very hard for me to listen to anyone referencing 911 to make their point).

On stretching that theory to an economic, social, or healthcare plan, what would you write?