Are most people in Appalachia of Scottish ancestry? (Nutter Fort: areas, counties)

[CookieSkoon]

Originally Posted by Smash XY

About your ethnicity we could say you're a Scots-Irish American but I think the history of your ancestors and how they come to America define if you're Scots-Irish American or not.

Well my Irish and Scottish ancestors came here to escape religious tyranny. The English was mixed in only one or two generations back here in the states.

[CTMountaineer]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

The wikipedia stats are from self-reported census data. English or sometimes "American" is often the default answer on ethnicity for people whose roots in this country go back hundreds of years. Over this time identity as German, Scots-Irish or Irish is lost as the nationalities mix and former surnames of the materlineal lines are forgotten. It doesn't mean the ancestors were never there, or that the current residents don't carry the blood of the original settlers.

The Wikipedia stats are not totally from self-reported data unless you are talking about such data for the southern regions, then it would be relatively accurate. It is clearly not accurate for the northern regions, and self reported data would backup that it is not accurate. If you're from Cumberland, surely you know that to be true. That region, including the West Virginia parts of that region have more German ancestry than any other.

Most common first ancestries reported in Monongalia County (Morgantown) (%):

German (18%)
American (mostly Cherokee) (13%)
Irish (12%)
English (11%)
Italian (10%)
Polish (4%)
Scotch-Irish (3%)

Of course, nearly all those folks have blended in with other ancestries. They're Americans
after all. Most of us are mutts geneologically, which means we have the strongest gene
pool in the world.

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/county/Mono...#ixzz1CZjobUE3

[Smash XY]

Originally Posted by CTMountaineer

The Wikipedia stats are not totally from self-reported data unless you are talking about such data for the southern regions, then it would be relatively accurate. It is clearly not accurate for the northern regions, and self reported data would backup that it is not accurate. If you're from Cumberland, surely you know that to be true. That region, including the West Virginia parts of that region have more German ancestry than any other.

Most common first ancestries reported in Monongalia County (Morgantown) (%):

German (18%)
American (mostly Cherokee) (13%)
Irish (12%)
English (11%)
Italian (10%)
Polish (4%)
Scotch-Irish (3%)

Of course, nearly all those folks have blended in with other ancestries. They're Americans
after all. Most of us are mutts geneologically, which means we have the strongest gene
pool in the world.

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/county/Mono...#ixzz1CZjobUE3

In this case, American (13 %) doesn't mean Amerindian but descended of white colonist. But I agree with you, American are a mix of different ethnic.

[CTMountaineer]

Originally Posted by Smash XY

In this case, American (13 %) doesn't mean Amerindian but descended of white colonist. But I agree with you, American are a mix of different ethnic.

There is definitely a strong Cherokee presence in these parts. I married one of them. But, you might be right about the percentage.

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by CTMountaineer

The Wikipedia stats are not totally from self-reported data unless you are talking about such data for the southern regions, then it would be relatively accurate. It is clearly not accurate for the northern regions, and self reported data would backup that it is not accurate. If you're from Cumberland, surely you know that to be true. That region, including the West Virginia parts of that region have more German ancestry than any other.

Most common first ancestries reported in Monongalia County (Morgantown) (%):

German (18%)
American (mostly Cherokee) (13%)
Irish (12%)
English (11%)
Italian (10%)
Polish (4%)
Scotch-Irish (3%)

Of course, nearly all those folks have blended in with other ancestries. They're Americans
after all. Most of us are mutts geneologically, which means we have the strongest gene
pool in the world.

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/county/Mono...#ixzz1CZjobUE3

File:Census-2000-Data-Top-US-Ancestries-by-County.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here is what we need to be looking at. Yes, in Northern Appalachia the Germans make up a plurality of residents. As you can see on the map, the German dominated counties in WV are far fewer and less populous than the counties that indicate "American" as the plurality. As discussed early, American is normally someone of some British background (often Scots-Irish) that have been in America for generations.

I think the Wikipedia page that listed "English" as the predominate ethnicity should read "American." Make that replacement, and the statistics are what they should be based on self-reporting. It could also be that while only one county has a predominance of "English" ancestery, a strong 2nd place showing in every county behind either German or American could end up placing "English" on top.

[CTMountaineer]

That's a bit of a stretch. There is no question that there was a strong old money English element in some parts, but I seriously doubt it was at that proportion. The majority of the English element was east of the Alleghenys, where they owned slaves and worked plantations, or had businesses that catered to those who did. The Germans, Irish, and Scots Irish seldom got involved with that kind of stuff, and the terrain west of the Alleghenies in most cases did not lend itself to that sort of lifestyle. Of course, on the west side of Charleston anything goes, so you just never know there. I heard rumors there was a clan there that pretended to be of English descent but was actually Hungarian, figuring having English background would carry more status. Go figure. (just kidding)

[Smash XY]

Originally Posted by CTMountaineer

That's a bit of a stretch. There is no question that there was a strong old money English element in some parts, but I seriously doubt it was at that proportion. The majority of the English element was east of the Alleghenys, where they owned slaves and worked plantations, or had businesses that catered to those who did. The Germans, Irish, and Scots Irish seldom got involved with that kind of stuff, and the terrain west of the Alleghenies in most cases did not lend itself to that sort of lifestyle. Of course, on the west side of Charleston anything goes, so you just never know there. I heard rumors there was a clan there that pretended to be of English descent but was actually Hungarian, figuring having English background would carry more status. Go figure. (just kidding)

The English weren't just to the east of the Allegheny. In the 17th century, yes, but in the 18th century when the area was discovered there was a migration of Northern English at the same time as the Scottish and Scots-Irish. They were perhaps less present than the other two groups but they were there.

I think the Wikipedia page that listed "English" as the predominate ethnicity should read "American." Make that replacement, and the statistics are what they should be based on self-reporting. It could also be that while only one county has a predominance of "English" ancestery, a strong 2nd place showing in every county behind either German or American could end up placing "English" on top.

But American ancestry doesn't mean necessarily English ancestry so I don't think we should count them together. For example in the Appalachia region I'm sure there are more Scots-Irish American than English American although Wikipedia says otherwise..

[CTMountaineer]

You have to include German descendants in that early group as well. Many Hessians who were the primary British military contingent stayed after the
Revolutionary War and established homes here. Those mercenaries didn't really owe allegiance to Britain, and many fell in love with our country just from being here. Also the group of German Catholics who settled in Maryland in those early times have descendents who are alive and well in these parts today. Most of those have blended in with other groups over time, but the
German last names persist. They are as American National as anyone else
in origin. Some of my ancestors are in that group.

[CTMountaineer]

Originally Posted by CookieSkoon

I know that the northern Appalachians are heavy with English and French (New England and the Adirondacks) then the central Appalachians (southern/central NY down to about mid-WV) are both Scots-ire and German with light English in NY and PA.

Then from there down it becomes more and more Scots-ire in ancestry.

At least that's what I've come to know through study. I myself am of actual Scottish/Irish and English ancestry. I don't know if that counts as Scots-ire or not due to what I read in this very thread.

I think that is basically accurate. South of Clarksburg the ancestry starts turning into predominantly Scots Irish. From Nutter Fort north it is other groups with German being most usual.

[Smash XY]

Originally Posted by CTMountaineer

You have to include German descendants in that early group as well. Many Hessians who were the primary British military contingent stayed after the
Revolutionary War and established homes here. Those mercenaries didn't really owe allegiance to Britain, and many fell in love with our country just from being here. Also the group of German Catholics who settled in Maryland in those early times have descendents who are alive and well in these parts today. Most of those have blended in with other groups over time, but the
German last names persist. They are as American National as anyone else
in origin. Some of my ancestors are in that group.

Yeah, Germans were there too, I don't know why but I always think of the British ethnic group and forget Germans when I speak of the South in general, but it's true that there were some Germans at the time.