Asheville leaves a lot to be desired (Henderson, Hendersonville: apartments, car insurance)

[captainketchup]

Originally Posted by Kooter

Yes, I do have Asheville nailed. And I also have [many of] the people that live in rural areas around Asheville nailed too...as well as (I might add) many of the people that live in very close proximity of Asheville (e.g. Leicester, Woodfin, Weaverville, Marshall, Mars Hill, Flat Creek, Alexander, Barnardsville, etc., etc.).

When I speak of the MANY people that are unclean and lack proper hygiene I'm most definitely not talking about the good people that farm or work their land in some fashion. Those people work hard many, many hours each and every day and of course get dirty and they wear clothing that is appropriate when working. I have no problem with that and totally and completely understand it. Also, let me add that they are most always clean people. And they are good people... Let's get that straight!

I am talking about the far too large number of totally worthless people living in the western NC mountain areas that absolutely refuse to work and earn a living even though they are healthy enough to work. There are way too many people that live on government assistance (handouts like welfare, food stamps, food banks, etc.) when they do not deserve it. These people take advantage of the system and in my opinion are worthless. Oftentimes they are involved in illegal drugs and some are known for being theives. It is many of these people that you can usually tell right away by where they live, what they wear, how they look, how they smell, etc., etc. These are the people that have bathtubs and rusted-out cars and trucks in their yards, wear torn and soiled t-shirts out in public with their families, drive beatup old cars and trucks that shouldn't be on the roads, etc., etc. They just aren't the kind of people that one likes having near you.

How do I know this? I know it first-hand. I have many dozens of relatives that live all over Buncombe, Madison and Yancey Counties, and also in Eastern TN. Some of them are the very ones I am talking about! I've visited with them and I've seen how they live, and what they do. I've also visited with some of their neighbors. It's a way of life for them. There is no excuse for their laziness - they are worthless. And don't think for a second that you have to go deep into the mountains to find those types of people...because you don't. There are far too many...and they are everywhere!

First of all... hello! I'm new to this forum. But not to the Asheville area. I am a long time resident of western North Carolina, having lived in both Asheville and Maggie Valley, as well as in Boone in the "high country". Currently we're still in Haywood County, and loving it.

While you are correct on most of your points, I would like to point out what should be obvious to you - the stereotypes about the people of the "Appalachians" exist for a reason. There's a certain hillbilly culture that cannot be denied. It also cannot be eliminated. Living here, you either accept it or you don't. You don't. I do.

I am a professional, well-paid, well-educated, and proud of my position and of my ability to provide for my family. However, I do not look down on my neighbors because they're not as "motivated" as I am. Just because there's a culture that says "if it was good enough for my daddy, it's good enough for me", that doesn't mean the generations-deep natives of western North Carolina are scum. They are simply living within their culture. As are we.

There are many, many, many poor families in western North Carolina. Both my wife and I work in the public sector, serving children and adults from all walks of life all over our county and beyond, and we see a lot of sad - and preventable - stories. However, there are a lot of people here who are well and truly stuck. It might be lack of motivation, laziness, "we always done it this way", or whatever other cultural/personal drag... but for a lot of the poor who _are_ motivated, there's still the problem of the longstanding lack of decent industries in this part of the state.

Simply put, there aren't many decent jobs out there. There never have been. In Canton's hey-day, back when the mill was like a money mine, there was a chance for families to pull themselves up without much education or training. Now, even with education and training, there's very few opportunities to put any skills to well-paid use - and the competition is fierce to get the few jobs that do come around.

There's no denying that you look down upon your family and their friends - and all of your reasons for that are, I'm sure, not fully disclosed. Nor should they be. While you are right in a general sense, your perspective is so strongly skewed by your personal bias that I'm afraid you can't see the forest for the trees, in this case.

Just because a detestable thing exists does not intrinsically make that thing evil or wrong. The culture and the circumstances that underlie that culture are what's to blame and what's needing fixing. Will it be easy? Of course not! Will it ever be a total success? No. But can something be done? Absolutely.

It's already starting, these past 15 or so years, with people moving into the area from all over the world, bringing with them their own culture, their own motivations, their own dreams. Businesses are becoming more diversified. The economy is shifting out of the agricultural-industrial model. The Internet and television are motivating the young here to hope and reach for more than just "what daddy did".

So you're right, but I think you're sadly and willfully turning your eyes away from what's really going on with the culture that you criticize. People are choosing to remain lazy and ignorant for a lot of reasons that you appear to be unable to acknowledge or accept. You need to look deeper and farther than what you see - and what they say - on the surface.

When people are down for long enough, it's easier to simply stay down than to try and rise - even a little. Is that OK? No. Is it something that can be "fixed"? Yes, but not easily.

[Doorway]

WOW!!!!! That has got to be the best post I've ever read on this forum. There has got to be a way to reach others in your area with these words.

[Kootr]

Originally Posted by captainketchup

First of all... hello! I'm new to this forum. But not to the Asheville area. I am a long time resident of western North Carolina, having lived in both Asheville and Maggie Valley, as well as in Boone in the "high country". Currently we're still in Haywood County, and loving it.

While you are correct on most of your points, I would like to point out what should be obvious to you - the stereotypes about the people of the "Appalachians" exist for a reason. There's a certain hillbilly culture that cannot be denied. It also cannot be eliminated. Living here, you either accept it or you don't. You don't. I do.

I am a professional, well-paid, well-educated, and proud of my position and of my ability to provide for my family. However, I do not look down on my neighbors because they're not as "motivated" as I am. Just because there's a culture that says "if it was good enough for my daddy, it's good enough for me", that doesn't mean the generations-deep natives of western North Carolina are scum. They are simply living within their culture. As are we.

There are many, many, many poor families in western North Carolina. Both my wife and I work in the public sector, serving children and adults from all walks of life all over our county and beyond, and we see a lot of sad - and preventable - stories. However, there are a lot of people here who are well and truly stuck. It might be lack of motivation, laziness, "we always done it this way", or whatever other cultural/personal drag... but for a lot of the poor who _are_ motivated, there's still the problem of the longstanding lack of decent industries in this part of the state.

Simply put, there aren't many decent jobs out there. There never have been. In Canton's hey-day, back when the mill was like a money mine, there was a chance for families to pull themselves up without much education or training. Now, even with education and training, there's very few opportunities to put any skills to well-paid use - and the competition is fierce to get the few jobs that do come around.

There's no denying that you look down upon your family and their friends - and all of your reasons for that are, I'm sure, not fully disclosed. Nor should they be. While you are right in a general sense, your perspective is so strongly skewed by your personal bias that I'm afraid you can't see the forest for the trees, in this case.

Just because a detestable thing exists does not intrinsically make that thing evil or wrong. The culture and the circumstances that underlie that culture are what's to blame and what's needing fixing. Will it be easy? Of course not! Will it ever be a total success? No. But can something be done? Absolutely.

It's already starting, these past 15 or so years, with people moving into the area from all over the world, bringing with them their own culture, their own motivations, their own dreams. Businesses are becoming more diversified. The economy is shifting out of the agricultural-industrial model. The Internet and television are motivating the young here to hope and reach for more than just "what daddy did".

So you're right, but I think you're sadly and willfully turning your eyes away from what's really going on with the culture that you criticize. People are choosing to remain lazy and ignorant for a lot of reasons that you appear to be unable to acknowledge or accept. You need to look deeper and farther than what you see - and what they say - on the surface.

When people are down for long enough, it's easier to simply stay down than to try and rise - even a little. Is that OK? No. Is it something that can be "fixed"? Yes, but not easily.

Well said captainketchup...

[Kootr]

Originally Posted by Doorway

WOW!!!!! That has got to be the best post I've ever read on this forum. There has got to be a way to reach others in your area with these words.

I agree with most everything he says about the people in the area being lazy, unmotivated, etc. We happen to agree. As for what he thinks about me because he "thinks" I don't understand or refuse to accept why so many people in the Asheville area continue to do-what-they-do is not the issue here. These lazy and unmotivated people are not kept in a cell without windows and not having knowledge of the outside world. They know full-well what they "should" do to better themselves, but only a very few are even interested in bettering themselves...and most just take the easy way out and prefer to live through life preventing their own children from improving their lives. Many would rather be on-the-dole and prefer to take government handouts (a.k.a. entitlements). These people simply do not care anything about helping themselves or their children and grandchildren (their future generations). There's no excuse for that except...

I can understand how and why these people could easily get stuck in a rut doing what their parents did by working the land and working at the local mills many generations ago, but with today's television and Internet, etc. these people know they are way behind average people throughout the U.S., but elect not to care enough to do anything about it. There is no excuse in the 21st century for this mindset except for them just simply being lazy and unmotivated...and to me that's pretty dang stupid.

[Asheville Native]

Originally Posted by Kooter

I can understand how and why these people could easily get stuck in a rut doing what their parents did by working the land and working at the local mills many generations ago, but with today's television and Internet, etc. these people know they are way behind average people throughout the U.S., but elect not to care enough to do anything about it. There is no excuse in the 21st century for this mindset except for them just simply being lazy and unmotivated...and to me that's pretty dang stupid.

Well bless your little heart. Many choose a slower, peaceful, rewarding life style. If you haven't tried it, how can you knock it.

And by 'rewarding' I'm not talking about a McMansion, and a garage full of Lexus, Mercedes, and Beemers, those are just 'things'.

And television is real life? ummmmmm ok

[Kootr]

Originally Posted by Asheville Native

Well bless your little heart. Many choose a slower, peaceful, rewarding life style. If you haven't tried it, how can you knock it.

And by 'rewarding' I'm not talking about a McMansion, and a garage full of Lexus, Mercedes, and Beemers, those are just 'things'.

And television is real life? ummmmmm ok

You need to stop trying to put [your] lipstick on this pig!

I have no problem with people enjoying a slower, peaceful and rewarding lifestyle, but (as you full-well already know) many of the people living in WNC are not even close to being typical Americana. Many of these people (as captainketchup said) lack motivation and are just plain lazy. They are uneducated and many of the children don't even complete high school. And it shows! You cannot put lipstick on the situation and make it look better than it really is!

I don't know why you brought up your example (above) about "rewarding", i.e. "a McMansion, and a garage full..." I hope you don't have a problem with successful people choosing to have "things" to make life more enjoyable and rewading. I'm sure you have some "things" too that make your life more enjoyable and rewarding! You aren't showing bitterness toward people that are more well-off than you, are you? If so, then you have a problem which isn't much different from others in WNC that show bitterness toward people that are able to have such things when they cannot. The difference between these two groups are glaring - one is motivated, educated, and seeks a better life for themselves and their children and shuns handouts (entitlements)...while the other group you are trying your best to defend is lazy, unmotivated, uneducated, doesn't want to work, craves government handouts, and could care less about their children's future. It doesn't have a damn thing to do with them wanting to live a slower, peaceful and rewarding lifestyle!!! But you already knew that! You just don't want to accept it. Yes, it's ugly and your lipstick won't help make it any prettier.

As for "television" - I was referring to people watching the news networks and various special programs showing how typical Americana lives. How the typical American family seeks improvement for themselves and their children, a better education for their children so they can compete in the job market, to make a better life for themselves and their children...and to motivate their children. Yes Asheville Native, there is some good stuff on television that is very worthy of watching. Maybe you just prefer watching the junk shows if you aren't aware of what I'm talking about.

[Asheville Native]

Originally Posted by Kooter

You need to stop trying to put [your] lipstick on this pig!

I have no problem with people enjoying a slower, peaceful and rewarding lifestyle, but (as you full-well already know) many of the people living in WNC are not even close to being typical Americana. Many of these people (as captainketchup said) lack motivation and are just plain lazy. They are uneducated and many of the children don't even complete high school. And it shows! You cannot put lipstick on the situation and make it look better than it really is!

Ever hear the phrase, live and let live? Any idea what it might mean?

[Kootr]

Yes, I have heard the phrase; "Live and let live"! However, that is not what the discussion here has been about. The discussion has been about how [many of] the people around Asheville and WNC elect to live...and how drastically different many of these people are compared to the majority of Americans. These people most definitely have the right to live as they do, but by doing so they standout like a sore thumb! Trust me, it's not very becoming and I don't think anyone is attracted to this type of people and their way of life unless they themselves are also lazy and unmotivated, and don't care anything about their children having a better life...or are drug addicts, panhandlers, homeless, or looking for an area of the country that caters to such people. It's just that sad... Personally I don't like the idea that my tax dollars are going to such lazy and unmotivated people. Do you?

You may want to refresh your memory by re-reading the first post of this thread and what was said!
Click here: Asheville leaves a lot to be desired

[LumbeeNDN]

...great post Cpt K. Just wanted to add my 2 cents about jobs in the area. I'm moving to A town next month. I've been looking for work there the last 6 months. Haven't found anything, so I'm going to leave my good paying job to go be with my wife who moved there back in the summer. She has the good paying job now I work in IT/computers, and while there are a handful of jobs, I have yet to find anything. I suspect that any job that opens up is inundated with applications. To complicate matters I've been pretty unsatisfied with my line of work the last few years, I'm seeing this as an opporutunity for a career change, and going back to school.

Lazy people are everywhere...its a part of life. We can only control what we do...blaze our own trail

[jhoratio]

I am considering moving to Asheville in the Spring of 2009. I visited the city and surrounding area two years ago (I attended a weekend workshop at North Carolina University's Center for Creative Retirment) and liked what I saw. While I am of retirement age, I am not ready to "retire" from life. I am an artist and former businessman. I would like to start or purchase an existing business in Asheville (or, possibly, Hendersonville), but like just everyone else I talk to these days, am worried about the the American economy in the short run (though, not in the long run;I have faith that we will eventually recover). When I looked at Businesses for sale recently on the internet, I saw a lot of restaurants/coffee shops for sale in Asheville and the surrounding area, and that has me worried. Since I am aware that one of the mainstays of the Asheville economy is tourism, I do wonder if the sale of all these eating establishments indicates serious economic troubles for Asheville? I would appreciate hearing from any residents of Asheville who can enlighten me as to the current economic conditions in Western North Carolina.