leaving wisconsin survey (Milwaukee, Madison, Appleton: appointed, fit in, violent crime)

[KateDaum]

Wow Phil, we enjoy many festivals and we don't drink. We have hosted many high school parties and have never allowed drinking alcohol.
We have lived in a number of places and actually found more binge drinking out north east. I worked for a DR. back there and people would never ever admit they drank. Dying of liver disease having the DT's and they would deny,deny. I went to many conferences on this. It has something to do with their reserved culture and how they can't let on that they are less then perfect.
We like football and have gone to Packer and Viking games but it is not our life and we have many things to discuss.
Sorry you are so unhappy but for us this is paradise. I have moved around and know this is where we will be for many years.

[susancruzs]

The people I've been around, go out to lunch or dinner with discuss lots of topics, sports sometimes but that is not the center of their universe. Of course, being 61, I'm not around the younger set, friends I've made are in their 50s, 60s or 70s. At a few outdoor parties, there were some younger people and none of them drank more than I thought they should.

I've been to quite a few town scheduled events where they were serving beer and I didn't see any problems, anyone acting stupid, not saying it doesn't happen I just haven't seen it. I do read things in the paper though that say 4th or 5th offense and that is wrong, they need to get tougher on drunk driving.

[ekg56]

I almost find it comical the stereo types that people use when talking about WI. We also attend a lot of fairs and festivals. We don't drink either. I did go to a party last weekend and tried a sip of wine. Oh no! At our local fair you can only drink in the beer garden. There are some people in their. But I see more out with their kids enjoying other things.
We our season Packer ticket holders. We can talk about a lot more then football. I belong to a book club, run my own business. I talk to the people who walk through our doors about a lot of different things. I don't remember the last time we talked about football.
Kate, I agree that Packer fans have moved beyond Favre. It is funny to look at old posts and seeing people saying that Favre is all WI people talk about. Not really, they seem to like Aaron as qb just fine.

[PhilJohnson]

Hey I have lived here all my life, so I think I would know something about my home state. Sure there are events that are more family orientated. But in my experience (small towns in central Wisconsin) 80 percent of the time anytime you here whateverfest the usual result is a bunch of drunks. Wisconsin is known to be a hard drinking state, and I have heard more than a couple people remark at the amount of drinking that goes on in this state. What most (notice I don't say all) people here think is normal consumption is anything but. To each their own I say, but to think that Wisconsin is on par with other states as far as amount of alcohol consumed is a fallicy that only exist in the minds of fellow Wisconsinites.

[MidwestHiker]

I spent 30 years of my life in WI. I love northern WI and wish I could live there again. After living in Northwestern WI (Menomonie), we moved to Eastern WI (Appleton). I did notice a difference, but overall everyone was the same - very nice and easy to get to know.

People are all different and one area is not going to please everyone. I am saddened that some of you posting on here never took the time to find out what a great state WI is. Go to Door County, the people that live there are so nice (if you are nice to them) and it is a beautiful area. I have never had anyone be rude to me in little towns around WI unless you count someone with MN or IL plates on their cars.

I relocated for work to MN and hate it here. Even though it is only an hour back to WI, this place sucks. People are rude and hard to get to know. The roads are always congested, and even up north it is full of rude people from the Twin Cities. I can't wait for our next move to get the heck outta here!

[karfar]

Originally Posted by PhilJohnson

I am considering leaving Wisconsin. As others have pointed out there are a lot of people in Wisconsin nuts over football, I could care less. Trying to talk to someone about something other than football or alcohol is greeted with blank stares. Also the drinking culture is ridiculous. It seems that any sort of event is used as an excuse to get wasted. The less you remember the more fun you must have had, or so I have heard. I don't drink so I have no idea. Parents think nothing of letting their kids have parties and get plastered. Heck most of the time the parents are as wasted as the kids. My opinion of those "great" fest things is that they pretty much are full of drunken idiots who think nothing of driving home after a day's worth of 'festing er drinking.

Taxes are retarded high, but at least they are cutting school funding and services to make up for it. Milwaukee is pretty much the armpit of the state, high crime, no jobs, and plenty of drunks. The rural areas (for the most part, there are exceptions of coarse) are full of a bunch of almost snobby rednecks (oxymoron?) who make it their duty to make sure "outsiders" know they can never be fully accepted into the community. Sure they are nice to your face, for a while. But trying to get to know someone, heh, forgettaboutit. I am a local, been accepted as such, so I don't have this issue. But I know it is a problem for many new people that move to the area. I have experienced it in other small towns so I have and idea of what I am talking about it.

Now that meth has appeared on the rural scene there is plenty of crime to go around as if alcohol wasn't a big enough vice for people to have. Also in my area there are plenty of very aggressive people who think it is their duty to chase you down and start berating you because you forgot to use a turn signal (this has happened to me, my family, and friends). They also think your business is theirs and if there is anything I know about rural Wisconsinites they love hearsay. One day you'll hear a rumor about yourself being a drug dealer, the next your a deranged nut.

I think rural Wisconsin especially has experienced a bit of "brain" drain and all the smart people left leaving the lowest on the rung to repopulate the state with alcoholic wannabe gansta/cowboy retards whose definition of culture is a 12 pack of beer and football. I love the scenery, the four seasons, but the binge drinking Wisconsin culture is chasing me out.

Pretty negative post. Drinking: Yep, we drink here, or at least some of us do. I drink but I'm not a drunk. I like going out or staying in w/friends & having drinks, watch movies, whatever. This in no way makes us drunks, lazy, losers, retarded, stupid, uncultural, or any of the other negative connotations you may connect w/people who drink. I love taking drives, going to the zoo, the museum, going up north is my favorite thing to do, it gives me peace & gets me out of Milwaukee sometimes. I hope to eventually move up there. Problems w/drugs are in every state in every area of a state, this is not unique to Wisconsin. Same goes for crime, yes Milwaukee has crime, just like every other area. You stay smart & keep your wits about you & you'll be fine. Yes, there are people here who are pretty close-minded about things & don't care to change. It's not up to me to try to change them, I just discuss normal subjects w/them & we get along just fine. I've never lived anywhere else but I would eventually like to, probably abroad. I'm obsessed w/traveling & hearing about other people's travels. I love talking to people who have been to different places & lived in different states or countries, I don't look at them weird or judge them, I actually welcome it. I think Wisconsin is a great state, it's got its problems & its got its share of good things. As for people in small towns? I guess I haven't totally come across the close-mindedness. Yeah, I've had times where people haven't warmed up at first, but once you either just leave them alone or engage in conversation w/you, they'll be jabbering away. It is what you make of it, no matter where you live. You could live in paradise & have a ****ty time because you have a ****ty attitude.

[dreamingmark]

"

Originally Posted by PhilJohnson

I am considering leaving Wisconsin. As others have pointed out there are a lot of people in Wisconsin nuts over football, I could care less."

Phil, the Green Bay Packers express our love for family and friends and our pride of place. They're one of the few things we're known for nationally or internationally.. if you don't rep the Packers, you aren't repping Wisconsin.





"Trying to talk to someone about something other than football or alcohol is greeted with blank stares"

Erm excuse me. Which planet are you on? I go to Lawrence University in Appleton and it's a great place to be. Our events are usually free or low-price and open to the public I can go to any kind of music or concert that I want, any night of the week, for FREE. I can watch French films.. any night of the week.. for FREE! And yes, I can have intelligent conversations with people. About BOOKS! A week ago or so, we had a band from Inner Mongolia come in and play their morrin khur and do throat singing.. I have friends from Ghana, Sri Lanka, India, Iceland, China, Indonesia, Italy, Germany, France.... who are actually quite nice people. So don't give me the "Wisconsin has no culture" B.S.



"Also the drinking culture is ridiculous."

Umm.. Phil.. yes. The drinking culture or permissiveness of drinking.. that's a problem. But again, whether or not you want to participate in it is your choice. Stay in, read some Camus, what do I care?

OK, I don't know much about taxes or Milwaukee, so I'll skip those parts.

"The rural areas (for the most part, there are exceptions of coarse) are full of a bunch of almost snobby rednecks (oxymoron?) who make it their duty to make sure "outsiders" know they can never be fully accepted into the community. Sure they are nice to your face, for a while. But trying to get to know someone, heh, forgettaboutit. I am a local, been accepted as such, so I don't have this issue. But I know it is a problem for many new people that move to the area. I have experienced it in other small towns so I have and idea of what I am talking about it."

Um again, excuse me, I have to ask what planet you're from. If you ever bothered being nice to these people, instead of being fixated on calling them "rednecks" or folks who are "quaint", they'd be nice back. I have never met a more caring, warm-hearted, genuinely nice group of people than Wisconsinites, ESPECIALLY rural Wisconsinites. Yes, what you mention is a problem. I have "local" status as well because even though I am not one, my dad was. But if a new person makes an effort to be NICE and to act like a local.. and to be courteous.. it's not a problem. But when you try to impose fancy attitudes from Chicago or the Twin Cities on us, that's what we resent. Get that bug out of your bum Phil.. it's obviously jammed pretty far up there! LOL. Nobody cares where anybody's from or what you do as long as you're a good person.. one of my best friends, who now owns a business in Appleton, is an illegal immigrant. He's a great guy. Everyone loves him, we could care less that he came over in a truck from Mexico.

And er, crime's everywhere. It's the result of the 21st century, modernization, globalization. Again, whether you involve yourself in getting exposed to that is a choice.

"Also in my area there are plenty of very aggressive people who think it is their duty to chase you down and start berating you because you forgot to use a turn signal (this has happened to me, my family, and friends)."

Well der.. not using a TURN SIGNAL is impolite, rude and shows lack of common sense. I think you are impolite and have serious attitude problems.. that's why you don't like Wisconsin because Wisconsin couldn't handle you.


"They also think your business is theirs and if there is anything I know about rural Wisconsinites they love hearsay. One day you'll hear a rumor about yourself being a drug dealer, the next your a deranged nut."


Rural Wisconsin thrives on rumors.. gossip.. and talk. It's the price to pay for living in a small town. There are two responses to this. Response #1 is to refute the rumors yourself by acting nice, saying nice things to your neighbors, and making funny jokes about the rumors. The other is just to be so outrageous that you become known affectionately as "THAT" dude... again your statement begs the question.. were you ACTING like a deranged nut? I think perhaps you were..

"I think rural Wisconsin especially has experienced a bit of "brain" drain and all the smart people left leaving the lowest on the rung to repopulate the state with alcoholic wannabe gansta/cowboy retards whose definition of culture is a 12 pack of beer and football."

Brain drain is a problem because people like you move out and the negative attitudes influence politics, so that no one wants to come in and invest in the state for anything besides tourism, and.... Claiming that Wisconsin has no culture is a bunch of B.S. and hooey. Again, come down to Appleton! We have a South American string instrument band playing next week, two French films showing, a concert, and any number of recitals for oboe, viola, etc. Also, Sai Ram in Appleton is one of the best Indian restaurants.. EVER.. and I've been to a lot of Indian restaurants in my life.

I love the scenery, the four seasons, but the binge drinking Wisconsin culture is chasing me out.

I think what is actually chasing you out.. is your HUGE attitude problem, negative complex of emotions, and general dislike of the place. If you made an effort, you'd see the good things about living here, but you're so caught up in your own definition of how much the state sucks that you won't even try to find things you like!

Have a nice day

[Dolly]

#1. Because even though we have lived in four different states, never have I been treated with so much prejudice and general disdain because we came from another state, namely Illinois. I got so tired of everyone assuming that being from Illinois meant we were from Chicago. There is a whole state below Chicago. Wisconsin schools need to teach a little better geography because people don't seem to understand that there is a southern part to Illinois that is nothing like Chicago.
#2. Drinking and getting drunk seemed to be an acceptable part of every day in Wisconsin. Just about every week there was some sort of tragic accident in the paper due to drinking and getting drunk. No way would I continue to raise a child in this environment.
#3. We came to Wisconsin because we thought the job situation would be better. Instead we found ourselves competing with lots more people for the same handful of jobs in addition to having the handicap of not being "from there". We moved back to southern Illinois where the unemployment rate is 10 percent and yet my husband found a job there within 2 months, I found a job within three months and they are both GOOD jobs! I wish we had never moved to Wisconsin in the first place. Home is where you are loved and we knew that the prejudice and ignorance we found in Wisconsin was so ingrained in people there that we would never feel loved there. I tell all our friends to never travel in Wisconsin with Illinois license plates because, although they like the money we spend there, they don't like us. NO thanks, we will take our money elsewhere. Wisconsin needs to grow up!

[JoshB]

Dreamingmark, What you just said to Phil is head on. I remember being in High School and wanting out of my town so bad because I had a bad attituide towards and sorta do at the present moment. Ever since I started traveling the state and taking pictures I grew to love what was in my own backyard. I will admit in H.S. many kids drank on the weekends. I never did, just never appealed to me. I was always hiking and biking. Call me a nerd if you want I don't care. There are plenty of people in Wisconsin who live normal and don't drink and act as you call "retarded."


Dolly, Your attituide is that because you couldn't get a job you shoot down the whole state. I do realize that because some of the chicagoans who are doing 75 on the interstate p*ss people off creates a sort of negative image for WI folks. Honestly I see nothing wrong with Illinois residents. We actually have some friends in Davis, IL. Great folks! We also have a handful of family in Illinois as well. Nothing real different down there, just more job opps in the Chicago area if your qaulified.


You say Wisconsin needs to grow up, that seems to be a snide remark for someone to say who lived here temporarily. How can you judge the whole state off of your bad experience with not being able to obtain a job. You know how foolish you probably sound when you tell your friends not to visit Wisconsin? You don't realize this but you judgements are hurting yourself and probably others who thought of you differently.

I don't feel like going all Dr. Phil but I had to defend.

[KateDaum]

We have 2 families that live near us and they are both from Chicago. They love it here. One of them has served on our town council for over 12 years. We aren't from here and both my hubby and I lived near Champaign IL for a while. I tell people where I have lived and no one has ever treated us differently. Maybe because we are so willing to join and try things. We haven't even been here for a year and I have found clubs to join. Gone to lectures,cook demos etc.
Drinking is a problem in many places in the US. I worked in an emergency room for years in both upstate NY and NH. We had many accidents involving underagers and drinking.
I have lived in a lot of places but we plan to call WI home. People have been wonderful to us and our kids.
I love Door County. We have gone a few times and plan to go back in a few weeks.
I still say attitude and a willing to explore and try things makes all the difference.