Former Wisconsinites...where did you move to and how do you like it in comparison to WI? (Rice Lake: transfer, middle school)

[Milwaukee City]

Originally Posted by Allan Trafton

As soon as people have something of value(family, career, home, investments etc) it's amazing how conservative they become.

I keep telling my friends this, as soon as they have kids they will become conservatives. It happens all the time, I became a conservative right after highschool when I started working and started renting and I started to notice fees and taxes and my rent going up b/c of water and electricity cost and getting parking tickets(over zealous checkers) all contributed to me becoming a conservative and trying to put a stop to me getting kicked in the shorts for fees and taxes and permits.

[EastSideMKE]

Originally Posted by Allan Trafton

I don't disagree with anything here except for the final paragraph. Democrats have a slight edge and it can turn if things are going poorly. 1/3 of the voting population will vote either way and can turn an election quickly. The presidential elections of 2000 and 2004 point this out. Very close within a few percents. I realize that the Gore and Kerry won, but it was extremely close. I wouldn't take anything for granted. As far as old people die off. Many liberals became rather conservative later in life when they move to the suburbs and have children. Take a look at the hippie baby boomers from the 60's. They were going to change the world. Talk about white flight, McMansions, sprawlville, anti tax and the rest. Maybe the most conservative generation ever. As soon as people have something of value(family, career, home, investments etc) it's amazing how conservative they become.

Well in case you haven't been paying attention, more children are born to single mothers than to two-parent households, 60% of recent college grads live at home with their parents, and wages haven't kept pace with inflation in over 30 years. Urban revitalization/gentrification is taking place all over the country. In cities like Denver and Mpls, the suburbs like Green Valley Ranch and Brooklyn Center are arguably more "ghetto" than the actual cities themselves. I don't know a single person my age who's in a hurry to buy a McMansion in Waukesha County. Perhaps a condo in the yuppified Third Ward, or even a house in WFB or Shorewood, but not typical suburbia.

I don't think you guys give your fellow citizens enough credit. To make it seem like people just swing back and forth on the political spectrum is simply an inaccurate characterization. The last presidential election wasn't decided by middle-of-the-road moderates, but by hardcore liberals. Liberals who either hadn't participated in the political process for a long time (because no Democratic candidates were liberal enough) or young people who were voting for the 1st time. Bush won big in 2004 due to conservative Evangelical voters being turned out in mass numbers. McCain didn't draw nearly as many in 2008 and lost as a result. It's not that the same people are swinging back and forth with each election, it's that sometimes certain groups (such as liberals and Evangelicals for instance) decide not to participate some years.

[EastSideMKE]

Originally Posted by Drover

They tended Democrat in the last election, but that's only one election. Check out how close the previous two presidential elections were, or the voting patterns of the last few elections, or how frequently the state assembly and governor's mansion changes hands. Not to mention "Democrat" does not equal "Progressive," something else the "progressives" within the party might take notice of. The Democratic party is, of course, a broad coalition.

Wisconsin is only "progressive" if you live in one of its handful of progressive bubbles. Everyone else recognizes Wisconsin for what it is: a state that is about as closely divided politically as any state could be.

But we have so many bubbles. Milwaukee and Madison aren't the only liberal places in the state. Small cities like River Falls, Stevens Point, Superior, Whitewater, pretty much any place with a UW campus is going to be more educated and generally more liberal as a result. The Indian reservations Up North also trend heavily Democratic. Cities with high minority populations like Kenosha and Racine usually vote Democratic, while places like Green Bay and Beloit defy that trend. LaCrosse, Eau Claire, and Western Wisconsin in general seems pretty liberal. That's where all the organic farms in the state are concentrated. The Fox Valley is in a transition right now, going from conservative to more liberal as the area grows. I never thought they would ever elect a Democrat to Congress, but Steve Kagen took office back in 2007.

[EastSideMKE]

Originally Posted by Milwaukee City

I keep telling my friends this, as soon as they have kids they will become conservatives. It happens all the time, I became a conservative right after highschool when I started working and started renting and I started to notice fees and taxes and my rent going up b/c of water and electricity cost and getting parking tickets(over zealous checkers) all contributed to me becoming a conservative and trying to put a stop to me getting kicked in the shorts for fees and taxes and permits.

Why do conservatives hate taxes so much? Do you walk on the sidewalk? Do you drive on paved roads? Do you call the police when there's been a crime? Do you call the fire department when your house is on fire? Do you check out books from the library? Do you believe in having a military?

[fairandsquare]

Originally Posted by jjacobeclark

Why do conservatives hate taxes so much? Do you walk on the sidewalk? Do you drive on paved roads? Do you call the police when there's been a crime? Do you call the fire department when your house is on fire? Do you check out books from the library? Do you believe in having a military?

Thank you! Where I live the taxes are very low and the political conservatives love it. They fight and fight to keep the taxes low. But you get what you pay for and we have NO services. No water, sewer, trash. No municipal pool, no sidewalks (not even a shoulder on the roads!), no free zoo (no zoo at all, actually), no county/city fireworks display on the 4th of July, no bus service. Nothing. They don't even freakin' pick up road kill, just let dead deer rot on the edge of the road until the vultures pick them apart. I am NOT kidding. And before you think I live in a depressed area or an isolated small town, think again. I'm talking about a town that made it onto Money Magazine's Top 100 Best Places to Live list.

Another issue here is that the locals fight any kind of commercial development, so acres upon acres of abandoned farmland and overgrown swamps just rot. No commercial development = no retail income = no jobs = no tax income. Now the schools are facing massive, massive budget cuts, due to the economy, of course, but made worse by lack of tax income. Last year the schools laid off every single part-time employee (and then some), and now they're talking about cutting out whole programs (foreign language, gifted & talented).

Taxes in Wisconsin are high, but unfortunately that's what it takes to make a place livable for all. Down here people have a "me" attitude, like, "Hey, I don't need municipal trash service, I take my own trash to the dump in my pickup truck." Well, what happens to those of use who drive a Toyota Corolla? Oh, that's right, we're SOL, and have to pay some random private company to pick up our trash (and they don't take brush or leaves, and they won't take a piece of furniture...and...and).

So to answer another post, I just want to say that since I've had kids I'm actually much more liberal than I used to be. For one thing, I just hate to see nice public schools go down the crapper because a bunch of me!me!me! libertarians demand low taxes.

[ccjarider]

Moderator - ohh moderator?? Where are you? Get this back on track.

The left/right, dem/repub, conservative/liberal jabber can go to a political site.
What about the original question/inquiry?

[dcisive]

I'll keep it simple for you. It's NOT how high the taxes are, it is HOW well the tax income is distributed. Out here in Utah they are famous for putting it in many of the wrong places, and the LAST place it ends up going is into schools. Hence our school taxes have gone up steadily over the last 4 years in a row (70% this last year) and why? Because they don't funnel it in the most important places FIRST. Proper distribution would take care of most of the tax issues, without having to keep raising them. But politicians will be politicians. It never ends.

[Drover]

Originally Posted by jjacobeclark

Why do conservatives hate taxes so much? Do you walk on the sidewalk? Do you drive on paved roads? Do you call the police when there's been a crime? Do you call the fire department when your house is on fire? Do you check out books from the library? Do you believe in having a military?

Yeah, that's the problem conservatives have with taxes. Not the waste, bureaucratic bloat, featherbedding, political fiefdom-building, more opportunities for corruption, economic drag, diminishing freedom, and diminishing and individual and moral responsibility that comes with ever-higher taxes, but basic services.

[ORECoast]

I am a lifelong Oregonian and have been to Wisconsin (Appleton) a total of 4 times for a total of 50 days in the Spring, Summer, and Fall. My wife grew up in Appleton and we got married in 2007. Appleton seems like a nice place, though it can be a bit confusing to get around. Though I will admit that since I am used to being surrounded by hills and mountains I have a hard time getting a sense of direction in flat places. Although I never experienced Winter, I did get a taste of it one October when it snowed. I was told that was highly unusual. People seem nice, maybe not as outwardly friendly as Oregonians, but nowhere near as rude and uptight as Chicago and the east coast. Spring seemed cold and wet and the month we got married was apparently the wettest August in Wisconsin history. Where we live we hardly get a drop of rain from the 4th of July until Halloween. We could have gone either way as to where to live after we got married, but what ultimately made the decision for me was the ragweed. It's just awful! We don't have that in Oregon and apparently I am highly allergic to it. I don't mind cold and snow, I grew up in the cold/snow capital of the state. Now I live on the "wet" side, but it's not as wet as people make it out to be. It's not constantly gray from October to June as I have seen posted on the Oregon boards. As long as people perpetuate that myth, more room for us right? My wife loves the mountains and the beach. I never got to really explore WI outside of Appleton so I cant really comment on what the rest of the state is like. I have heard that the northwoods are beautiful and not as flat as Appleton-south. Maybe one year we'll invest in some Deet and make the trip back in the summer instead of the fall. I've always wanted to go to Madison and La Crosse sounds great too. Anyway I hope that all of you have a Merry Christmas!! Jordan

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by Milwaukee City

I keep telling my friends this, as soon as they have kids they will become conservatives. It happens all the time, I became a conservative right after highschool when I started working and started renting and I started to notice fees and taxes and my rent going up b/c of water and electricity cost and getting parking tickets(over zealous checkers) all contributed to me becoming a conservative and trying to put a stop to me getting kicked in the shorts for fees and taxes and permits.

Ironic. When my father started working and paying bills, he didn't become a conservative. It didn't even happen when he had children. He is also a home owner. He is a liberal living in a very conservative area.