Southerner needs advice on moving to Wisconsin... (Milwaukee, Madison: section 8, rent)

[ro_vaughan]

My husband and I are strongly considering moving to Wisconsin in the near future. I was born in Greenbay and lived, up to the age of 6 or 7, in the Neenah/Appleton area. I don't recall much beyond the white winters! I have lived in Texas most of my life and my husband was born and raised there. We have recently moved to Louisiana but really dislike it here and are looking for a change.

We could easily move back to Texas (we love Texas, OF COURSE) but after some wistful reminiscing on my part, are now considering Wisconsin. I recall the beautiful country (the husband is an avid hunter) and the distinct and seperate four seasons (other than really hot, sorta hot and drowning in hot). We have done a bit of research and are pleased with the rave reviews of the education system in general. Anything is better than Louisiana...seriously, I am terrified of educating my daughter (3 years) here. Although we both grew up in small towns, we have lived most of our married lives in larger cities like Dallas, and currently, Shreveport (which is about the size of Madison or so I am told). We would prefer a more urban atmosphere but would strongly consider a small town withing 20-30 minutes of a large one. I'm not a suburb-y type gal so when I say small town, I mean lil speck on a map.

So, Wisconsinites...what is your advice for some Texans looking to move in? How bad are the winters? Will we survive? Do I need to trade in my luxury sedan for a snow plow? How about the summers...does it ever get into the triple digits? Can the mosquitos be any worse than the giant, gator-sized ones we have here year round? What are the people like? Friendly? Reserved? Pale? How is the cost of living? Affordable or outrageous? Job outlook? What does a decent 3 or 4 bedroom home go for? Do they have basements (my husband thinks basements are "cool")? Will people make fun of the way we talk? Will they forgive us for being Cowboys fans? What about the food...got any Tex-mex or Cajun food up there?

Our initial inquiries led us to the Madison area. My husband is the artsy-fartsy type and is interested in Madison's culture and education scene where as I was interested in the good school ratings and variety of job possibilities for me. He teaches high school biology and I am a Registered Nurse...I don't know that we could even afford to live in Madison proper but are willing to commute. Down here in Shreveport (horrible city...don't ever come) we live in a solid middle to upper-middle class neighborhood. We make just over six figures and don't have much overhead.

Would you suggest renting first? When is a good time of year to visit (so I can dupe my husband into not worrying about the white winters)? What other cities would you suggest? I've also heard good reviews of Milwaukee (it can't been any grittier than down here...I'm talking shanties on the bayou, y'all).

Would appreciate any advice! Thanks y'all!

[Drover]

Wow, lots of questions.

1) How bad are the winters? Well, in wintertime, some college students take a shortcut to campus by walking across Lake Mendota. Some years it's cold enough to put a fleet of trucks and ice-fishing shacks out there. 10 below doesn't even slow the place down. Either you can tolerate it or you can't.

2) The last time the temperature in Madison officially reached 100 degrees was 1988.

3) What kind of luxury sedan do you drive?

4) Mosquitoes can be bad depending on how much spring rain there is. At any rate they're not as bad in the southern half of the state as the northern half, but just about anywhere in the state if there was enough rain in the spring, then there will be enough mosquitoes in the summer that they'll carry your daughter off in the evening if you're not careful.

5) Reviews on people are mixed. Upper Midwesterners tend to be a bit introverted for lack of a better term. Madison may be a little different due to its transient nature, but you probably shouldn't expect a welcome wagon just the same. You'll likely have to approach your neighbors before they approach you. And yes, we're generally a pale lot up here.

6) Cost of living -- compared to what? Compared to Shreveport and probably even most of Texas, I think you may be in for some sticker shock. People who don't know better expect Madison to be cheap because it's a small city in the middle of a giant cornfield. Brace yourself, because it's not cheap. And you know those great schools everyone raves about? You'll know why they're so great when you get your first property tax bill. You get what you pay for, and boy do you pay for it.

7) Basements are definitely more common here than in Texas/Louisiana. You shouldn't have a hard time finding a house with one if you really want one.

8) Job outlook: sucks, just like anywhere else right now. But when the economy picks back up, Madison tends to have one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country. Lots of government jobs between being the state capital and home to a state university of 40,000-plus students.

9) Rent first. Always seems like a good thing to do no matter where you move if you're not familiar with the area.

10) Visit at the end of January. I'm not kidding. Duping your husband isn't a good idea, because winter up here really has to be experienced to be believed and it's a deal-breaker for many people. Don't move up here only to think to yourselves (or have your husband think to himself), "Jesus king Christ how do people live in this frozen king tundra all winter without wanting to commit ritual suicide???" So my advice is to find out straight away whether both of you really can tolerate living up here in winter, because it would be a waste to commit so much time, energy and resources to moving only to discover a few months later that the answer is "no."

11) Milwaukee Proper is nice in some areas, distressed and decayed in others, but schools are a definite issue overall. If you're considering Milwaukee, you may want to strongly consider the suburbs due to schools. Milwaukee has a school choice voucher program, but I've heard mixed reviews about it. Some claim it has become the educational equivalent of Section 8, where vouchers have dragged the quality of previously acceptable schools downward. I don't know how accurate that is but it's worth looking into.

[yo vanilla]

I concur with everything Drover says.

Snow tires for your car are a very good idea. I actually don't like real, honest to goodness snow tires for a variety of reasons so I like to buy a great all-season that can tackle the snow (most can't do snow so well so you must be choosy). Try Nokian WRG2 for an excellent all-season with great snow ability or Continental Contiextremecontact, both of which my cars wear in winter.

What else can I say that Drover hasn't... Madison has a great variety of restaurants. I'm not sure if I've ever seen a house without a basement, actually.

Wisconsin in general is as affordable as it gets but Madison is about the most expensive area of the state. If you think it's too pricey for you, take a look at Appleton as well. In Appleton, $150-200K can get you a 50 year old or newer 3-4 bedroom house in the city in a nice neighborhood. That same place might go for $250K-$300K in Madison or some of its surrounding towns like say Middleton. Go to coldwellhomes.com and browse around to see what's available for what. I have an older but kept-up home in a quiet neighborhood, 3 bedrooms, 1600sq feet worth about $120K

I don't know much about Madison schools but I do know that Appleton has open enrollment - you can apply to send your kids to a school outside your district if there is openings. We also have some charter schools.

Good call on visiting in late January, or early February. But keep in mind that that's the worst it will get, and you'll spend a good amount of time inside anyway. Still, winter wears me out.

[dreamhunter65]

He likes hunting.. Bow season opens in mid Sept. - first part of January..Deer gun November for 9 days, muzzle loader season after plus t zone hunt. Coyote year round except deer gun in most places. Bear season longer but must apply for preference points. Serious hunter will want to buy acreage so knows has place to hunt that i not public land as harder to get on private lands. Turkey spring and fall. small game in Sept-Jan. Maybe he would try the ice fishing or snowmobiling. Winter can be fun in Wisconsin. So many people scared of winter as so not want to get cold but many things enjoyable in winter also.

Being in Wisconsin can always travel to Iowa/Illinois for more deer hunts.

[Chelito23]

One thing I will point out is your husband is a teacher, and teaching jobs are few and far between in Madison. Many local school districts have stagnant or declining enrollments, so they are laying off teachers in some cases, or just not hiring in others.

I think nursing jobs are still high in demand here as everywhere...but teaching set of an alarm to me. I think is you all are willing to take a teaching job in pretty much any district, and from there you find a nursing job, it might work out...but just picking Madison would be like putting all your eggs in one basket. Remember, this isn't the sunbelt, so growth here is slow and constant at best (in Madison) and stable or declining in rural areas. New schools are not overly common either, so available jobs would probably be in less desireable districts or schools (very tiny, rural areas, or troubled, inncer city schools).

In the Madison forum there is currently a poster lamenting moving to Madison and not being able to find teaching work despite her degrees...so keep that in mind with Madison. Surrounding suburban distrcits don't seem to be hiring much either at this time.

If he your hubby can find a job teaching first in a district where there is also several hospitals (where you could work), I would say go for it, but remember how difficult these times are and how expensive Wisconsin is in general, plus all the months of high energy bills to heat your home.

[yo vanilla]

Originally Posted by Chelito23

If he your hubby can find a job teaching first in a district where there is also several hospitals (where you could work), I would say go for it, but remember how difficult these times are and how expensive Wisconsin is in general, plus all the months of high energy bills to heat your home.

Expensive? WI is anything but expensive. Food is cheap, insurance is cheap, houses are cheap, water isn't bad at all and actually while I wouldn't call my energy bills cheap, I certainly wouldn't call them fall over dead expensive compared to some. We've got an older 1600sq foot home, we budget about $250/month for heat (natural gas) and power. I've heard of some areas pushing double that in coldest months

[Wellstone]

maybe take a look at places like cottage grove, mount horeb, or lake mills. all are within commuting distance of madison but much of the teaching jobs are in those outlying districts. i'm not a huge fan of little towns out in the sticks but these are all within 1/2 hr drive of madison and those are not bad for small towns. i'd avoid portage, that is a wretched town.

baraboo might be worth looking at also, it's a town over 10,000 and isn't completely terrible. it's a little further away though.

[Wellstone]

Don't listen to people who try to frighten you with the winters. The last couple have been a little harsh and were record snowfall years. Temps were not that frigid though. Be prepared for 20 degree temperatures on average with the occasional spell (maybe a week) of subzero temps. Madison is not known as an icebox, that would be northern minnesota. They had a season of 100 inches of snow a couple years ago but that is not the norm. they tend to get a lot of mixed precip, rain mix with snow and just sloppy driving. usually it's not a big deal since most people know how to deal with it, they take care of the main highways well and driving in it isn't that common of an occurance. there have been years where people have golfed in december and january too. This forum is notorious for trying to frighten outsiders of the weather but most of it is exaggerated. A good winter coat, gloves, and heated seats make it pretty tolerable. I hate the cold too, so I just dont spend any more time outside in teh winter than i have to.

[yo vanilla]

I don't think anyone is trying to frighten people with the weather, just prepare them. For someone who's lived in the south most of their lives, winter is absolutely going have a major impact. And for the record, we normally get a cold snap for a few weeks straight, not just one, where it'll stay about 10F at the highest. But then we've had those one or two freak days every January where it hits 45F and all the snow melts in a day.

[Drover]

I'm not trying to "frighten" anybody, I'm just trying to give them a dose of reality. Personally I like the weather up here and I don't ever want to live in the south, at least not year-round. But when millions of people have headed in the precise opposite direction as the OP often citing weather as a deciding factor, that's your clue that it's an issue that needs to be taken seriously. Maybe the OP and her husband can handle it, maybe not. But it would be wise to not be as nonchalant about it as she appears to be.