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Unread 02-21-2012, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Santa Ana
1,198 posts, read 938,237 times
Reputation: 433
Default Why does it matter to entry-level job positions, that you have a college degree? why does it matter? how come?

I'm talking about entry-level jobs, retail, customer-service jobs, fast-food, jobs, that do not require a college-degree, but yet the people with a college degree are always going to stand out, get hired over the people who don't have a college-degree, and especially these people don't even have a college degree that is relevant to the entry-level job they are getting hired at. You all know we discussed this in my last thread, yes I made mistakes, big mistakes in the past, because for these reasons
"I don't think a bad reference from Target is hurting you. You're in your mid-twenties(24 to be exact) and your longest job lasted three months and you can't put it on applications because you were fired, that could be what is hurting you."

"Even if the job market were strong, your complete lack of experience (one job lasting two months in four plus years) hardly makes you stand out and particularly not now when degreed applicants are fighting for even entry level positions. Four years at a community college and you didn't even come out with a degree of any kind at all? Do you seriously think that this sort of record makes you a viable candidate?"

"You had four years to accomplish something. What did you do at community college? How did you manage to come out of four years of community college with nothing to show for it?"

"OK, lets hire this 20 something kid that went to community college for 4 years without anything to show for it and has extremely limited work history! Well skip over everyone else that actually applied themselves in both work and school, maybe have their 4 year degree and most likely worked full time while getting it."

"Or it could be because he spent four years in junior college without earning a degree"

"first time for everything" opportunity comes when you're in your teens, not your twenties"


Yes these are an example of what people have said in my previous thread, but they never bother to explain why a College Degree matters so much to an Entry-Level Job, Minimum-Wage Job, Menial Job, etc. Overall, why does experience matter so much even to entry-level jobs? why are employers, as in entry-level jobs, so relucant to give inexperienced applicants a chance?

Why are you expected to have experience by a certain age? Why does life, society, culture, put time limits on things like this?

 
Unread 02-21-2012, 06:55 PM
 
72 posts, read 137,148 times
Reputation: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ihatespoiledbrattypeople View Post
I'm talking about entry-level jobs, retail, customer-service jobs, fast-food, jobs, that do not require a college-degree, but yet the people with a college degree are always going to stand out, get hired over the people who don't have a college-degree, and especially these people don't even have a college degree that is relevant to the entry-level job they are getting hired at. You all know we discussed this in my last thread, yes I made mistakes, big mistakes in the past, because for these reasons
"I don't think a bad reference from Target is hurting you. You're in your mid-twenties(24 to be exact) and your longest job lasted three months and you can't put it on applications because you were fired, that could be what is hurting you."

"Even if the job market were strong, your complete lack of experience (one job lasting two months in four plus years) hardly makes you stand out and particularly not now when degreed applicants are fighting for even entry level positions. Four years at a community college and you didn't even come out with a degree of any kind at all? Do you seriously think that this sort of record makes you a viable candidate?"

"You had four years to accomplish something. What did you do at community college? How did you manage to come out of four years of community college with nothing to show for it?"

"OK, lets hire this 20 something kid that went to community college for 4 years without anything to show for it and has extremely limited work history! Well skip over everyone else that actually applied themselves in both work and school, maybe have their 4 year degree and most likely worked full time while getting it."

"Or it could be because he spent four years in junior college without earning a degree"

"first time for everything" opportunity comes when you're in your teens, not your twenties"


Yes these are an example of what people have said in my previous thread, but they never bother to explain why a College Degree matters so much to an Entry-Level Job, Minimum-Wage Job, Menial Job, etc. Overall, why does experience matter so much even to entry-level jobs? why are employers, as in entry-level jobs, so relucant to give inexperienced applicants a chance?

Why are you expected to have experience by a certain age? Why does life, society, culture, put time limits on things like this?
I think it works both ways. I have plenty of work experience and a piece of paper from an accredited higher institution. There are plenty of times when I handed my resume to a recruiter at a job fair only to have him hand it back to me because he thought I was over qualified. This job market sucks and everything is biased towards the employers. If they dont like how you look, how you dress, how you talk or act, it wont matter even if you graduated from Harvard.....
 
Unread 02-21-2012, 07:37 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle, originally from SF Bay Area
11,112 posts, read 11,847,877 times
Reputation: 7036
I remember back when I was trying to hire people in the mid-1990s and had to compete with Wendy's and McDonalds paying $11/hour because they couldn't find anyone to work there. Times change. Now it's the opposite.
We get over 100 applicants for every job, and what we consider entry level
at my current place of work requires 3 years experience. We are getting people with 15-30 years, advanced degrees, even MBAs and lawyers applying for jobs that pay $20-$25/hour.

Hopefully things change again eventually, but in the meanwhile people unfortunate enough to be out of work now are going to have a much more difficult time.
 
Unread 02-21-2012, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Santa Ana
1,198 posts, read 938,237 times
Reputation: 433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
I remember back when I was trying to hire people in the mid-1990s and had to compete with Wendy's and McDonalds paying $11/hour because they couldn't find anyone to work there. Times change. Now it's the opposite.
We get over 100 applicants for every job, and what we consider entry level
at my current place of work requires 3 years experience. We are getting people with 15-30 years, advanced degrees, even MBAs and lawyers applying for jobs that pay $20-$25/hour.

Hopefully things change again eventually, but in the meanwhile people unfortunate enough to be out of work now are going to have a much more difficult time.
yeah, i started this thread, using quotes from my previous thread that other users have specifically told me what is really hurting my chances of landing a job, getting hired, yes I do regret, i will admit i make big mistakes in the past but a person's past should not dictate, control their future, people deserve second chances when it comes to employment since we as humans all have to work for a living, pay the bills, it's not like i'm a criminal or anything
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 05:33 AM
 
366 posts, read 307,079 times
Reputation: 718
Especially in a tough employment market like we have, employers can be very picky. They ask for a college degree because they can get it. Because someone who has that degree has shown that they:
1. Have a higher level of knowledge
2. Have the self-discipline and drive needed to complete a college education
3. Take themselves and the world around them more seriously than those who don't finish college.

These points may not be true in all cases, but those are the implications. The best indicator of future performance is past performance. A newly hired person takes time to train, to get familiar with the duties and expectations of the job, and to learn how to mesh with and work with the existing team. It's expensive for a company to invest that time (and money) into a new hire to have him/her leave in a couple of months.

If you can, take on some volunteer work. Rarely will any agency turn down a volunteer, and that's a great way to build up your resume, get the job skills you need to help you get the job you want.
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Santa Ana
1,198 posts, read 938,237 times
Reputation: 433
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarrieM View Post
Especially in a tough employment market like we have, employers can be very picky. They ask for a college degree because they can get it. Because someone who has that degree has shown that they:
1. Have a higher level of knowledge
2. Have the self-discipline and drive needed to complete a college education
3. Take themselves and the world around them more seriously than those who don't finish college.

These points may not be true in all cases, but those are the implications. The best indicator of future performance is past performance. A newly hired person takes time to train, to get familiar with the duties and expectations of the job, and to learn how to mesh with and work with the existing team. It's expensive for a company to invest that time (and money) into a new hire to have him/her leave in a couple of months.

If you can, take on some volunteer work. Rarely will any agency turn down a volunteer, and that's a great way to build up your resume, get the job skills you need to help you get the job you want.
I have not tried this approach yet but one middle-aged adult told me this in person when giving me advice, that i should say this to a hiring manager "how about for a month or 2 you can train me without having to pay me, can i work for a month without getting paid just show I can prove myself and see what you think of me"?
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Wallis and Futuna
10,497 posts, read 12,627,731 times
Reputation: 15137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ihatespoiledbrattypeople View Post
yeah, i started this thread, using quotes from my previous thread that other users have specifically told me what is really hurting my chances of landing a job, getting hired, yes I do regret, i will admit i make big mistakes in the past but a person's past should not dictate, control their future, people deserve second chances when it comes to employment since we as humans all have to work for a living, pay the bills, it's not like i'm a criminal or anything
Past behavior can predict future behavior, unless there is a lengthy window of time between then and now where you can prove otherwise.

If you attended 4 years of college and didn't get a degree, AND you haven't been able to hold a job longer than a few months since you were 16...then all you have proven to anyone:

You are not able to follow through on things.

No one wants to hire someone who can't commit and complete a long-term task, other than temp agencies. And even THEY want to know that you can commit to them.
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 06:04 PM
 
Location: Santa Ana
1,198 posts, read 938,237 times
Reputation: 433
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post
Past behavior can predict future behavior, unless there is a lengthy window of time between then and now where you can prove otherwise.

If you attended 4 years of college and didn't get a degree, AND you haven't been able to hold a job longer than a few months since you were 16...then all you have proven to anyone:

You are not able to follow through on things.

No one wants to hire someone who can't commit and complete a long-term task, other than temp agencies. And even THEY want to know that you can commit to them.
the past is the past, yes i am completely aware, know that the past shows up on a resume, application, but i just hate how employers judge an applicant based on their past so much, they assume, feel that the way an employee, person was back then, they will continue to be the way they are now, how is that accurate? people can change you know
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 06:25 PM
 
10,213 posts, read 7,073,341 times
Reputation: 11092
Forty years ago, I knew someone who offered to work for free for a few months -- and he got both the opportunity and the job. He did such good work that the company even paid him retroactive to his first day.

Today, however, employers would be very reluctant to let someone work for free because of liability and legal issues. It might be a good idea to make that offer, though, just to show a prospective employer that you're serious about wanting to work there.
 
Unread 02-22-2012, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Wallis and Futuna
10,497 posts, read 12,627,731 times
Reputation: 15137
Everyone who judges, does so based on past behavior. What do they know about you? The only thing they CAN know - is what you have done up to this moment. They have no way of knowing what you will be like tomorrow. And so, they base their decision on whatever you have done previously.

"Oh he has a poor job history, can't hold one down. He can't even manage to get a degree after 4 years of college, which is all you need for a degree - and in fact he could've gotten an Associates after two. Has he participated in any long-term sports activities? Was he in Varsity for more than a single semester in High School? Has he been a member of the same band for a few years? Is there any redeeming value to this person, based on what he's done in his life so far, that we can predict with at least SOME accuracy, will indicate success for him, and profitability for us, in the future?"

You have done nothing to prove that you're worth hiring. Volunteer somewhere, and stick with it. Finish your education and get the degree. Get some menial job at minimum wage and prove to THAT boss that you're worth promoting, or at -least- stick around long enough to earn a yearly raise in pay.

Prove to a future employer, that you are worth hiring. And then maybe you'll get someone to believe it. Companies don't profit based on promises. They profit based on productivity. You have to produce.

There is no "past history" with you, because you're only 24. Only 2 years out of college. If you had this spotty history 20 years ago, and was successful for the past 5 years, I'd say yeah you're right, employers are being harsh on you for what happened 20 years ago. You were 16 only 8 years ago. Out of the last 8 years, which is when you'd be eligible to work in the USA regardless of state - you have proven that 8 of those years, were unsuccessful. That's a lousy track record. You have a 100% failure rate over the only 8 years you have to offer.
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