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Location: Stuck on the East Coast, hoping to head West
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I've had both over the past 20 + years and worked in predominantly male-dominated industries. Some were great and some were horrible--entirely independent of gender. You want to talk about horrible bosses? Try working for India-based managers who see their American counter-parts as their enemies.
Of course there are as many different personalities as there are managers...
Never given it much thought till this thread.
One company where I worked scheduled a 3 day retreat for all upper level managers... it was in Carmel with one or two guest speakers and was legit business with some extra perks thrown in.
The problem...
The CEO, Administrator and all but one Department Head were female.
The single male Department Head was asked to report to the CEO the day the Memo went out and was told it would be awkward to have one male attend with 12 females... also the spa treatment and room accommodations would present a problem...
Another example is more of a grey area...
Each year for seven years the managers and staff would plan a Vegas Weekend... the company did not sponsor the event. Including management, the roster worked out to be 1 male every 20 females... several of the married women said they could only go if it was an all girl weekend with none of the men... reasons cited were husbands and boyfriends... so the men were not invited.
The trips stopped in 2007 with the bad economy.
Last edited by Ultrarunner; 03-07-2013 at 12:48 PM..
I work in an environment where there are many members of management I come in contact with daily. Over the years, I've only had 1 female manager that I felt was competent and didn't play games or had an attitude or was in my opinion not qualified for her position.
Every other female manager I've ever worked with, and there have been many, shouldn't have been managing, in my opinion. Trying to prove something to the men in the building, trying to be the alpha female, being catty or backstabbing to the other female managers, dealing with more mood swings and being more cliquish are only part of the problems.
Guys are more hit and miss, and in my experiences are more conserned about just getting stuff done and downplay all the drama that comes with most female bosses-again, in my experiences. That doesn't mean that there haven't been male bosses that were atrocious or moody or proving whatever to whoever and just a pain to deal with, but it's been overwhelmingly not so great working for female bosses.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,852 posts, read 10,454,406 times
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BTW, I do some volunteer work for a local county-wide social services organization, which is headed by an older lesbian woman, of the sorta "butch", tough-talking "phys-ed/camp counselor" demeanor and personality. And a fairly well-known source of discord within the organization is her apparent tendency to "stack the ranks" with lotsa other obviously lesbian women... which naturally creates a culture which also comes with certain attitudes towards males. Although as a state-run organization, I can't see upper management bureaucrats ever touching that issue with a 10 foot pole (...LOL)!
Of course there are as many different personalities as there are managers...
Never given it much thought till this thread.
One company where I worked scheduled a 3 day retreat for all upper level managers... it was in Carmel with one or two guest speakers and was legit business with some extra perks thrown in.
The problem...
The CEO, Administrator and all but one Department Head were female.
The single male Department Head was asked to report to the CEO the day the Memo went out and was told it would be awkward to have one male attend with 12 females... also the spa treatment and room accommodations would present a problem...
And that is exactly the type of double standards that I am talking about! If the situation was reversed, and there were 12 males and 1 female, and they excluded the one female from the retreat, the company would get into serious trouble for discrimination, rightfully so. So why is it any different when it's a male employee being excluded? A better idea would be, rather than spa treatments, to plan activities that both genders would enjoy.
Quote:
Another example is more of a grey area...
Each year for seven years the managers and staff would plan a Vegas Weekend... the company did not sponsor the event. Including management, the roster worked out to be 1 male every 20 females... several of the married women said they could only go if it was an all girl weekend with none of the men... reasons cited were husbands and boyfriends... so the men were not invited.
That too was wrong. Rather than not inviting the men, the women whose husbands / boyfriends had a problem with them attending the event if it wasn't women-only should have either stayed home or worked things out with their husband / boyfriend. Why should the men be punished when it's the women and their boyfriends / husbands with the issues? Better yet, allow everyone to invite a significant other to the event, that way there would be a roughly equal number of men and women.
I honestly thought you'd go in another direction with this altogether. I don't view women as pushovers at all. I have a female manager now and I'd say her thing is about proving herself to the rest of us. That said, she can be quite relentless. She has no qualms about throwing you under the bus. She is the epitome of cut throat.
All in all, I think a lot of people tend to agree, both men and women alike, that working with women can be quite a chore. Among each other, they are catty and extremely competitive. With men, they seem to always be attempting to prove their worth by acting macho and cut throat. And don't get me started on passive aggressive tendencies.
This sounds more like female roommates than bosses, but I digress.
Yes, and women actually prefer to work under a male Boss over a female boss. Statistic.
I had never given this much thought until recently. In each of my past 2 jobs, I have had female managers, and they reported to male directors. In both of these jobs, the male directors loved my work and my ideas, would give me public kudos, but my female managers grew to despise me, to the point of fabricating reasons to try to fire me. I eventually decided it may have just been cattiness and jealousy, but I chose to resign rather than work in such a hostile environment.
I've had both male & female and I tend to agree that the female bosses were the worst. Too many decisions & opinions are based on their own personal biases and experiences. My all time best was the pres & CEO of my last department, which was a female. She was unique in that she had an open mind and left all that "female stuff" at home, if she had it at all. I admired her very much, but she was an exception. We had a "clique" of females in positions of authority and she was able to keep them in line. The day she moved on to another job all he$$ broke loose - even the men commented. Very unprofessional environment.
BTW - I was one of those female bosses and I always tried to be very aware of these very issues
BTW, I do some volunteer work for a local county-wide social services organization, which is headed by an older lesbian woman, of the sorta "butch", tough-talking "phys-ed/camp counselor" demeanor and personality. And a fairly well-known source of discord within the organization is her apparent tendency to "stack the ranks" with lotsa other obviously lesbian women... which naturally creates a culture which also comes with certain attitudes towards males. Although as a state-run organization, I can't see upper management bureaucrats ever touching that issue with a 10 foot pole (...LOL)!
LOL....this sounds like its in Portlandia. I live in a very liberal town and noticed that lesbian couples with kids are some of the nicest and most polite people I meet on a day to day basis. I feel like one of those lesbians would be the perfect mix of drama-free butch and socially-sensitive manager type.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Umbria
I've had both male & female and I tend to agree that the female bosses were the worst. Too many decisions & opinions are based on their own personal biases and experiences. My all time best was the pres & CEO of my last department, which was a female. She was unique in that she had an open mind and left all that "female stuff" at home, if she had it at all. I admired her very much, but she was an exception. We had a "clique" of females in positions of authority and she was able to keep them in line. The day she moved on to another job all he$$ broke loose - even the men commented. Very unprofessional environment.
BTW - I was one of those female bosses and I always tried to be very aware of these very issues
I will say I had one professor who worked full-time at a big F100 company in management and everything about her seemed amazing. The way she spoke to us students like equals and not rodents, she made eye-contact, and was always cool under pressure. I would LOVE to work for a female boss like her. I hope one day to be an aware female boss myself.
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