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I'm new to the labor force. I'm 28 and finished my bachelors degree just 3 years ago. I knew a pretty important guy and was able to luck out and get a chance to show off my abilities with a temporary position and land a full time job in the mining industry. After 3 years I've begun looking around just to see what was available and what I'm finding is... not much...
There are a lots of jobs that would be an upgrade from my current one, but they are so specialized that I'm certain when my resume is looked at the HR official is not very excited and these jobs are likely open for years. I know my own company has a page on their website seeking candiadates for a few positions that are so specialized maybe a handful of people in the world would fit it. As far as I've seen nobody has been hired for them.
There are a few lateral career moves I could make, but these jobs show up on job boards for a day or two and are gone. The number of applicants is likely very high and I'm not really interested in a lateral career move. As for moving from entry level to entry-mid or mid career level, hah, good luck.
So it got me thinking. Is this normal? I know everyone has been griping about the economy since 2007 and how rough it is to find a job and get paid what you're worth, but did people do this in 2002? How about 1995? I didn't really care about the economy back then and don't know much about it. I guess unemployment was lower, but did people apply for 3 or 4 jobs and get one? Or was it like today where you send out 50 resumes, get a few interviews and MAYBE one offer, if you're lucky.
Were job boards in decades passed showing a dichotomy of positions so specialized then that few in the entire world could fill them and entry level positions that just about every college graduate from any university could technically fill the minimum requirements? Were these skilled entry level positions paying just enough to get you by comfortably, but not enough for you to feel like you'd made it? (I realize there is a sense of entitlement to that last sentence, don't assume I think I am worth 6 figures already because I have a degree, I'm not, but I'm asking - did people in the past feel like they were more than comfortable early in their careers?)
What about just the general success of your average social group? It seems that most of my friends are so inundated with student loan debt that they can't buy cars or a house even when they do get a job making 35k a year, our 65 year old parents are still working because they don't have the funds to comfortably retire, our older siblings are receiving some sort of government benefit to be able to feed their family and uncle so and so has been out of steady work for x months, but able to make things work with temporary work here and there, but his credit card debt is blah blah, you know the story.
I'm new to the labor force. I'm 28 and finished my bachelors degree just 3 years ago. I knew a pretty important guy and was able to luck out and get a chance to show off my abilities with a temporary position and land a full time job in the mining industry. After 3 years I've begun looking around just to see what was available and what I'm finding is... not much...
There are a lots of jobs that would be an upgrade from my current one, but they are so specialized that I'm certain when my resume is looked at the HR official is not very excited and these jobs are likely open for years. I know my own company has a page on their website seeking candiadates for a few positions that are so specialized maybe a handful of people in the world would fit it. As far as I've seen nobody has been hired for them.
There are a few lateral career moves I could make, but these jobs show up on job boards for a day or two and are gone. The number of applicants is likely very high and I'm not really interested in a lateral career move. As for moving from entry level to entry-mid or mid career level, hah, good luck.
So it got me thinking. Is this normal? I know everyone has been griping about the economy since 2007 and how rough it is to find a job and get paid what you're worth, but did people do this in 2002? How about 1995? I didn't really care about the economy back then and don't know much about it. I guess unemployment was lower, but did people apply for 3 or 4 jobs and get one? Or was it like today where you send out 50 resumes, get a few interviews and MAYBE one offer, if you're lucky.
Were job boards in decades passed showing a dichotomy of positions so specialized then that few in the entire world could fill them and entry level positions that just about every college graduate from any university could technically fill the minimum requirements? Were these skilled entry level positions paying just enough to get you by comfortably, but not enough for you to feel like you'd made it? (I realize there is a sense of entitlement to that last sentence, don't assume I think I am worth 6 figures already because I have a degree, I'm not, but I'm asking - did people in the past feel like they were more than comfortable early in their careers?)
What about just the general success of your average social group? It seems that most of my friends are so inundated with student loan debt that they can't buy cars or a house even when they do get a job making 35k a year, our 65 year old parents are still working because they don't have the funds to comfortably retire, our older siblings are receiving some sort of government benefit to be able to feed their family and uncle so and so has been out of steady work for x months, but able to make things work with temporary work here and there, but his credit card debt is blah blah, you know the story.
Was it this way in the past?
It was hard to find meaningful work in 2001-2003, especially for those of us in CS/SE/IT.
I would argue that it was much easier 40 years ago.
The economy has been running on fumes since about 2000 or so - basically, when the Tech Bubble popped.
Oh, sure - there were years of job growth after that point, but it was almost entirely driven by bad debt via the Housing Bubble, and thus not sustainable. As people flipped houses and got HELOC's, all that money was being used to paper over the fact that good jobs were bleeding out of the nation.
Finally, when the Bubble popped and we ended up with a decade of about zero net job growth - despite the usual population increase - we were left with the horrid reality which we face today. A staggering lack of jobs, and an even more painful lack of GOOD jobs - real jobs - vs. part-time, poverty wage drek that people can barely use to survive.
This disaster has been a long-time in the making. I'd say that NAFTA and granting most favorable nation trade status to China - basically opening the doors to send so much there - were the big pushes that got things rolling off a cliff, but the problems probably go back further than that. Several Bubbles - the Tech Bubble and the huge Housing Bubble - were used to hide the problems for years, but now we've run out of Bubbles to provide quick, fake wealth, and are now left with the reality of a nation with a gutted economy.
The economy has been running on fumes since about 2000 or so - basically, when the Tech Bubble popped.
Oh, sure - there were years of job growth after that point, but it was almost entirely driven by bad debt via the Housing Bubble, and thus not sustainable. As people flipped houses and got HELOC's, all that money was being used to paper over the fact that good jobs were bleeding out of the nation.
Finally, when the Bubble popped and we ended up with a decade of about zero net job growth - despite the usual population increase - we were left with the horrid reality which we face today. A staggering lack of jobs, and an even more painful lack of GOOD jobs - real jobs - vs. part-time, poverty wage drek that people can barely use to survive.
This disaster has been a long-time in the making. I'd say that NAFTA and granting most favorable nation trade status to China - basically opening the doors to send so much there - were the big pushes that got things rolling off a cliff, but the problems probably go back further than that. Several Bubbles - the Tech Bubble and the huge Housing Bubble - were used to hide the problems for years, but now we've run out of Bubbles to provide quick, fake wealth, and are now left with the reality of a nation with a gutted economy.
Back in the day, if college wasn't in the cards for someone, they could go down to the local factory and be hired on the spot the day after they graduated high school.
And if you went to college, and did your work, it was gold. Most corporations would hire reasonably intelligent people right out of college.
Back in the day, if college wasn't in the cards for someone, they could go down to the local factory and be hired on the spot the day after they graduated high school.
And if you went to college, and did your work, it was gold. Most corporations would hire reasonably intelligent people right out of college.
Isn't that the truth. Now you see retailers asking for a college degree for a low level manager role in retail. It's ridiculous to think that you need a 4 year degree, spend thousands for that degree, to work in a $10 an hour job.
Isn't that the truth. Now you see retailers asking for a college degree for a low level manager role in retail. It's ridiculous to think that you need a 4 year degree, spend thousands for that degree, to work in a $10 an hour job.
And I fear that college loans may lead to the next crash because of this...
You have $1 Trillion in outstanding college loans.
People graduate and meaningful work won't be available to them. So, they have a choice between Food/Clothing/Shelter and paying their loans. Many will take the default in order to eat.
Secondly, people won't go to colleges if they do not see the point. I.e. you can work that crappy job or you can work that crappy job with $70k in debt. So, they won't go which will hurt colleges
I think, generally, things have gotten worse for most people since my grandfather's heyday. For my family and area, it's gone like this and I think this is pretty standard for most of the country. I'm 28.
My grandfather served in the Korean War and worked as a butcher for around a decade. When my grandparents had my mom and my aunt, my grandfather took a job at the local chemical factory in the 1960s, from which he retired with a company pension, his own personal investments, and medical insurance for himself and my grandmother in 1993. He had excellent job security and lived in the home he purchased in 1967 until he died in 2009. He had a stable life, lived debt-free for years, and had far less disruption than subsequent generations. My grandmother, who dropped out of HS to work the family farm, worked in the high school as a cook and draws a pension from the government. They're not well off, but were always middle class with no special skills and no education beyond HS.
My parents graduated into the late 70s/early 80s recession as teachers. They weren't able to find teaching jobs in the area and bounced around several extremely impoverished areas. Dad took a job at the same factory my grandfather worked at, but was laid off. He had a low paying job or two before getting on at another factory in 1994. He stayed there until 2007 when the plant closed. He's worked in a call center since 2008. Many of his former coworkers and peers who were downsized are stuck in low wage employment and won't recover. Some people of that generation were able to ride it out as well as my grandparents did.
You are in that unlucky spot where you have enough experience to not be a campus hire and not enough to really move up if you are switching companies. You generally need at least 5 years before most companies would consider you much more than a new hire. Thanks to those dynamics, people in your shoes - wanting a change but without a lot of experience - apply in droves to the few jobs that look promising.
Back in the day, if college wasn't in the cards for someone, they could go down to the local factory and be hired on the spot the day after they graduated high school.
And if you went to college, and did your work, it was gold. Most corporations would hire reasonably intelligent people right out of college.
Wow, is that real? Sounds almost too good to be true. That level of security isn't something I've ever experienced. I do well but it's been a struggle to get here. And I am saddened and concerned about the younger generations.
Seems to me that it's becomng a much more global world and people in the US need to expand their thinking...a lot. Where in the past one was able to find work locally, then had to look regionally, now people are hearing suggestions of looking nationally. I personally think we are headed towards people having to go international and be willing to make multiple moves for decent jobs. I know it's hard for Americans to think about but it's a reality we may need to deal with - China and other nations' standard of living is growing...America's? Not so much. For me personally, I know someone in my field that went to Dubai. He's making huge $ doing similar work as I am (I should say "similar work that I was" because he's been promoted, thanks to more opportunity there --- yes, I am a bit jealous and bitter) and tells me that they are actively recruiting. He's living well, but moving my family to Dubai? Wouldn't work for me. If I were single, a definite maybe.
And I fear that college loans may lead to the next crash because of this...
You have $1 Trillion in outstanding college loans.
People graduate and meaningful work won't be available to them. So, they have a choice between Food/Clothing/Shelter and paying their loans. Many will take the default in order to eat.
Secondly, people won't go to colleges if they do not see the point. I.e. you can work that crappy job or you can work that crappy job with $70k in debt. So, they won't go which will hurt colleges
The student debt cant crash because you cant get out of it. So instead of bursting like a bubble, it will be more like a long drawn out wound that keeps the economy down.
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