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Though I don't agree with OP's methods, job hopping is most certainly fine. It's not "the way things used to be", but 2-4 years at a job is a pretty reasonable expectation these days. These days, nothing is certain. There is no stability in the employment market. People need to take control over their career trajectory. The days where you'd stick around in one job for 20-30 years and collect a pension are long gone. Loyalty doesn't exist on either side. Promotions and significant raises are very seldom. If you want to advance in your career, earn more money, etc., your best chances often come from jumping ship every year.
Don't believe me? I have the paychecks to prove it. I make over 130% of what I made 10 years ago because I've jumped around every 2-3 years, and I don't regret it one iota. It has allowed me to pay my student loans, buy two homes, etc. Sorry, Bob, but from my experience, you're not going to convince me that being loyal and sticking it out long term pays off. In most cases, it just doesn't. Loyalty costs money; either pay up or shut up.
Now, OP's situation is quite different, because he has hardly stuck it out longer than 2 years anywhere and has long stints of unemployment. I think the next place he chooses to work needs to be a longer term situation, such as 3-5 years. There is no black and white solution, but that is what I'd suggest.
You're correct in that it isn't black and white, and also contingent upon your industry and location.
Like I posted back in the thread, I started out at a Fortune 500's IT call center after college. I worked there for two years. There's no upward mobility in that office - all the managers have been there since the site opened. Today, there's nothing done at this site but inbound call handling. It's in a town of 3,000 in the middle of nowhere in southwest Virginia - the nearest town of 20,000 is a half hour away. The economy in that area is a joke.
A few people stayed for a few years and found jobs at other sites in Richmond and northern Virginia, but you have to work like hell to get out of southwest Virginia. Nothing is going to be handed to you, and it's damn sure not going to come easier because you've been loyal.
Depending on the job, loyalty and staying in the same position for too long is a drawback. At one of the tech companies I worked for, the manager of the systems analysts that handled client application support would always say he didn't want people who had been in the same place for more than five years because they would be "set in their ways."
I'm not an accountant, but was an economics major in college, and I support the tax team and other staff in a corporate finance department of a large from an IT perspective. That department likely has a few people like Nep. There's been one person I know leave the department over the past six months, and this was a clerk. The staff level and above have basically no turnover. Many of those folks have been there for years.
Given what is common among their team, I doubt there is any way they'd give Nep the time of day. With that said, the standard in that field is not the standard across all fields, or in all geographic areas.
I'm not an accountant, but was an economics major in college, and I support the tax team and other staff in a corporate finance department of a large from an IT perspective. That department likely has a few people like Nep. There's been one person I know leave the department over the past six months, and this was a clerk. The staff level and above have basically no turnover. Many of those folks have been there for years.
Given what is common among their team, I doubt there is any way they'd give Nep the time of day. With that said, the standard in that field is not the standard across all fields, or in all geographic areas.
Correct. Accounting departments have multi-year to decades long tenure, regularly.
At my last 3 corps, all in accounting are there, at minimum, 4 years.
It may be useful in alerting others, in advance, to the perils of job-hopping.
What OP is doing is not job hopping. As someone else labeled it, it's more like job quitting. Jumping around from job to job with no focus, and having long stints of unemployment in between is not the same thing. Learn the difference. Job hopping in a conventional sense is more widely accepted today than ever before. Making broad declarations on a forum does not make you right or your way the right way. There is no rule book to how to live your life or how to conduct your professional life. There are only people's opinions, and there are billions of different versions of it.
Last edited by Left-handed; 09-01-2017 at 06:39 PM..
What OP is doing is not job hopping. As someone else labeled it, it's more like job quitting. Jumping around from job to job with no focus, and having long stints of unemployment in between is not the same thing. Learn the difference. Job hopping in a conventional sense is more widely accepted today than ever before. Making broad declarations on a forum does not make you right or your way the right way. There is no rule book to how to live your life or how to conduct your professional life. There are only people's opinions, and there are billions of different versions of it.
In general, in many fields, there is an unwritten rule book, which is what will disqualify a candidate from consideration by most major employers. It's not any individual's book-it's not written down, but most intelligent people know when they jumped the shark, as they get few real chances at tremendous quantities of quality employment opportunities.
Few employers will tell anyone when these lines are crossed. They simply toss the resume in the circular file.
In general, in many fields, there is an unwritten rule book, which is what will disqualify a candidate from consideration by most major employers. It's not any individual's book-it's not written down, but most intelligent people know when they jumped the shark, as they get few real chances at tremendous quantities of quality employment opportunities.
Few employers will tell anyone when these lines are crossed. They simply toss the resume in the circular file.
You're wrong. The times have changed. Most professionals I know successfully switch jobs every 2-4 years. Not many people stay in the same job at the same company for over that time. I can look at several different LinkedIn profiles and observe this. You're spouting off some bygone era philosophy that is no longer the prevailing school of thought on job tenure. Nobody stays in the same job for decades anymore. Sorry, that's very misguided info.
And keep in mind, that is not what OP's post is about. OP is not job hopping. He is job quitting with no end in mind. Not the same thing I'm talking about.
Last edited by Left-handed; 09-01-2017 at 09:15 PM..
You're wrong. The times have changed. Most professionals I know successfully switch jobs every 2-4 years. Not many people stay in the same job at the same company for over that time. I can look at several different LinkedIn profiles and observe this. You're spouting off some bygone era philosophy that is no longer the prevailing school of thought on job tenure.
And keep in mind, that is not what OP's post is about. OP is not job hopping. He is job quitting with no end in mind. Not the same thing I'm talking about.
A few times early in career is not unusual, and is acceptable as long as there is career progression.
But it is ignored if there was progression and strictly early in career. If it persists, and employee keeps hopping ship every 2 years, very soon, he/she gets circular file treatment.
Stability is hardly bygone. My ex corps median tenure, nationally at dozens of facilities, exceeded a decade.
A few times early in career is not unusual, and is acceptable as long as there is career progression.
But it is ignored if there was progression and strictly early in career. If it persists, and employee keeps hopping ship every 2 years, very soon, he/she gets circular file treatment.
Stability is hardly bygone. My ex corps median tenure, nationally at dozens of facilities, exceeded a decade.
That's great. But this is not the norm. I just looked at about 10 of my LinkedIn network connections, all of varying ages, and the typical tenure at their jobs was between 2-5 years. There were a few 5+ year tenures, but this was very rare.
I don't know what industry you used to work in, and however long ago that was, but it does not represent the norm today in the industries I've worked in (which varies from IT, telecom, and health care). In fact, the BLS actually does a very nice summary of it. See the link below.
The median number of years that wage and salary workers had been with their current employer
was 4.2 years in January 2016, down from 4.6 years in January 2014, the U.S. Bureau of Labor
Statistics reported today.
Obviously, it varies by different age groups. But the data ultimately supports what I've said.
To your point, however:
Quote:
Median employee tenure was generally higher among older workers than younger ones. For example,
the median tenure of workers ages 55 to 64 (10.1 years) was more than three times that of workers
ages 25 to 34 years (2.8 years). Also, a larger proportion of older workers than younger workers
had 10 years or more of tenure. Among workers ages 60 to 64, 55 percent were employed for at least
10 years with their current employer in January 2016, compared with only 13 percent of those ages
30 to 34. (See tables 1 and 2.)
But I believe OP is in his early 30s?, so it shows a median 2.8 year tenure in that age range.
You're wrong. The times have changed. Most professionals I know successfully switch jobs every 2-4 years. Not many people stay in the same job at the same company for over that time. I can look at several different LinkedIn profiles and observe this. You're spouting off some bygone era philosophy that is no longer the prevailing school of thought on job tenure. Nobody stays in the same job for decades anymore. Sorry, that's very misguided info.
And keep in mind, that is not what OP's post is about. OP is not job hopping. He is job quitting with no end in mind. Not the same thing I'm talking about.
Job changes, whether frequent or infrequent, need to make sense. My personal goal is usually to put in at least 5 years at each job whenever possible. The reason is that in case an involuntary departure (layoff, reorganization, company closure or very bad work environment) becomes a necessity, everything will balance out on the resume. The OP has a work history demonstrating that he runs away whenever his life becomes just a bit uncomfortable. His work history is just a string of jobs separated by stints of unemployment. I am sure potential employers read his resume and conclude he has no real career goals.
That's great. But this is not the norm. I just looked at about 10 of my LinkedIn network connections, all of varying ages, and the typical tenure at their jobs was between 2-5 years. There were a few 5+ year tenures, but this was very rare.
I don't know what industry you used to work in, and however long ago that was, but it does not represent the norm today in the industries I've worked in (which varies from IT, telecom, and health care). In fact, the BLS actually does a very nice summary of it. See the link below.
it is really the change in worker demographics being reflected in that stat. since the past few years, millennials are making up a bigger portion of the labor force so the tenure years drop as the ones with longer tenures leave the work force
same thing happens when you look at the salary data, it isnt that the companies pay less than they did 20 years ago but the higher paid people are retiring and the younger work force has yet to make it up to the higher levels so the salary averages are dropping nationally.
people are job hopping less among millennials than the past generations of the same age, so tenure length hasnt changed if you control it by age groups of each generation
for whatever reason, 08-09 scarred young people into thinking job stability is the best thing ever, so when they get a job, they try to stick as long as they can, which means less job hopping compared to past generations, flip side is that the yearly raises are lower than in past so... they are behind on salary curve and add in the debt they picked up
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