Will we ever see an economy/job market as strong as the one we had in the 1950s? (employees, debt)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Back then you'd be recruited right out of high school into a factory job. There you would receive training and stay for 30-40 years. At the end you'd be given a pension and a golden watch thanking you for your hard work and service. Not for people of color, women, the handicapped, etc
If you went to college you'd be guaranteed a middle class job or a management job with little to no experience. Not for people of color, women, the handicapped, etc
If you got a MBA you'd basically be qualified for a middle management/senior management job and the world would be your oyster. Not for people of color, women, the handicapped, etc
Labor unions existed and job security was universal. Not for people of color, women, the handicapped, etc
People back then dreamed of a better tomorrow. Sure history books say everyone constantly freaked out about nuclear war but lets be frank in saying that was mostly BS. It was slightly worrisome but nowhere near obsessive. The opportunities were endless and no job was a dead end. Not for people of color, women, the handicapped, etc
See above ^^^. Your silly, misguided nostalgia doesn't hold up for a huge swath of the American population.
You have to have a highly specialized skillset if you want to earn a decent income today. The days of turn-a-bolt bob making a middle class wage are over.
Which is a huge problem.
Every country will have its elite. How it handles 'average' is the standard by which it will be judged.
Its easy to write it off as being overpaid for 'turning a bolt' (I'm not saying that's what you were implying but a ton of people use that euphemism to bash unions, etc) when you're one of the fortunate ones who can code in Java but it causes huge-huge problems that we're just now beginning to see when a decent standard of living is only available to a small handful of your population.
See above ^^^. Your silly, misguided nostalgia doesn't hold up for a huge swath of the American population.
Here's a vexing question.
If the functional, prosperous and unequal "White Guy Economy" of years ago didn't need women, minorities or the disabled to function, explain to me why do women, minorities and the disabled need the economic product of those same white guys to get by?
Back then you'd be recruited right out of high school into a factory job. There you would receive training and stay for 30-40 years. At the end you'd be given a pension and a golden watch thanking you for your hard work and service.
If you went to college you'd be guaranteed a middle class job or a management job with little to no experience.
If you got a MBA you'd basically be qualified for a middle management/senior management job and the world would be your oyster.
Labor unions existed and job security was universal.
People back then dreamed of a better tomorrow. Sure history books say everyone constantly freaked out about nuclear war but lets be frank in saying that was mostly BS. It was slightly worrisome but nowhere near obsessive. The opportunities were endless and no job was a dead end.
The chrome studded cars, diners, and drive in theaters that no longer exist serviced people after a rough day on the job. People there would know your name and care enough to listen to you talk about your day.
Your neighbors weren't lawsuits waiting to happen and genuinely cared. If someone messed with your house the whole neighborhood would condemn whoever did it.
I think we've come to a point in time where many young people would really not be stuck in a factory a good amount of their lifetime if they can avoid it. Even if the pay and benefits are worth it.
And plus, everything was pretty much run by middle aged white men. Whether current blacks seem lazy in general to you, or even if there are many woman who would rather be home, there's also a ton of woman and people of color who would like to be out there earning and achieving. And if you live in a world where only white men are in charge, that can make getting hired and getting promoted a bit of a rough road.
So maybe the 50's werent that great. If nothing else because you still had Jim Crow laws
No kidding - per capita GDP was $17,000 in 1955, in today's money. Now, it's $53,000
That's a big difference.
I don't have median data in front of me (and they're distorted by massive changes in the labor force - more retirees, etc.) - but the averages or means are pretty revealing. We're about 3 times as well off as in the mid-1950s.
Which is a huge problem.
Every country will have its elite. How it handles 'average' is the standard by which it will be judged.
Its easy to write it off as being overpaid for 'turning a bolt' (I'm not saying that's what you were implying but a ton of people use that euphemism to bash unions, etc) when you're one of the fortunate ones who can code in Java but it causes huge-huge problems that we're just now beginning to see when a decent standard of living is only available to a small handful of your population.
Java coding is a pretty average paid job these days and by no means are you part of the elite. IT people make about the same as 15 years ago: link.
No kidding - per capita GDP was $17,000 in 1955, in today's money. Now, it's $53,000
That's a big difference.
I don't have median data in front of me (and they're distorted by massive changes in the labor force - more retirees, etc.) - but the averages or means are pretty revealing. We're about 3 times as well off as in the mid-1950s.
Not quite as well off as per capita numbers, but median income constant dollars $39k, today $51k. About 30% better than 1955.
I recently discovered a host of old TV shows from the 50's complete with commercials. And even The Price is Right. I'd never seen any of these before because I was too young and we didn't have a TV till the 60's. Cars were a bargain, many of the compacts were less than $1500. Houses were cheap too. Technology was very expensive. Things like freezers, stereos, TVs could be very expensive. A new upright freezer was over $500. I saw one last night sponsored by Singer and a sewing machine in a walnut cabinet was $150.
People didn't use credit cards back then. They bought from the stores on 'time'. Usually so many dollars a week. I remember my Aunt and Uncle talking about going from place to place on payday to pay their bills. Housing was hard to come by and there was a shortage in the 50's.
Young men were not saddled with huge debt from education. Most had served in WWII and had the GI Bill. It was an unprecedented opportunity. I can remember my father saying if not for the GI Bill, he would have spent his entire life in the steel mills of Pittsburgh. His post-war benefits made it possible for him to get an education and leave the life he had been born into. People became mobile and traveled a lot. The Interstates were either already here or under construction.
Most women were SAHMs. Some did become educated and became mostly secretaries, nurses or teachers. Those career paths were thought to be acceptable for women. There was't much available for birth control and families were larger. The usual path for young women was High School, marriage, babies. They managed the home and took care of the family.
My mom was a nurse and some of my earliest memories were my parents arguing because she wanted to work and my father insisting she didn't need to. He was ashamed the neighbors would think he didn't make enough money to support the family. WWII changed the order of things forever. Labor shortages during the war had taught women they could make money and do the jobs men had done for generations. Rosie the Riveter had a hard time giving up her job to the returning soldiers and going back to washing diapers.
My mom drove a car. She was the only one of her 6 sisters to drive. Driving represented freedom to her. She learned to drive so she could take me to Kindergarten every day. Several of my Uncles were quite proud to say their wives would never be 'allowed' to drive.
I remember my dad saying he would know he had really made it when he took home $100 per week. They bought their first home in 1952 for 14K. All brick, 3, 2, 2, with a full basement. I look back and think about how small those rooms were and the closets were tiny! The driveway was gravel.
Any man who wanted to work could get a job and work his way up. Companies expected to train you. Many people worked at one company for their whole career. They tended to value the person more back then than the education. Probably because there were few people out there with college degrees. If you were one of those lucky few, you had it made.
It probably wasn't as easy as you think and I can remember my parents had their challenges. A white man was the best you could be and everyone else had to just do the best they could. My H was from the south and one of his earliest memories was him mom beating him for drinking out of the wrong water fountain.
Not quite as well off as per capita numbers, but median income constant dollars $39k, today $51k. About 30% better than 1955.
If those numbers are correct, they're for families - the median individual income is much lower. "Families" now usually consists of 1 or 2 people, while in 1955 I think the average was 2-1/2 kids plus 2 adults.
Let someone that married and started a family in the 1950s, tell you what you are not considering.
1: The reason the country was booming, was WWII was just over, and the U.S. was the only truly industrialized country in the world. We were making goods to help the rest of the world get back to a normal playing field. We were making huge loans t o other countries, that used the money to buy goods from us (a requirement for the loans).
2: Median household income was only $3,210, which in today's dollars would be about $23,000 with half the people earning less. Remember this is the income a family was living on. Entry level and minimum wage was 50 cents an hour. In the mid 50s, I was one of the lucky ones, making 4 times the median income selling furniture. Our close friend was the vice president of labor and labor legal counsel for labor for a large rail road company, and he and I earned within $14 of the same income.
3: That was the period of V.A. no down loans so young people could buy a house. Today the young people would want nothing to do with these 1,000 sq. ft. starter houses. They want a heck of a lot more home, and a lot fancier. Our first house was in Cupertino Ca, upper quality area of Silicon Valley and cost us $13,750. A few years ago our first home was up for resale at $850,000 and later was torn down as a tear down for the lot.
4: Movies cost 50 cents admission, to $1 at the high priced theaters. Drive in movies were a big thing, and on Saturday night many had $1 night when 2 couples or a family could go to the movies for a buck per car. Go to a good restaurant today with your date, and the tip will be more than the whole evening cost back then.
5: Companies offered training back then because when they hired someone and put up the time and money to train them, they had a long term employee. Today the young people quit and run somewhere else as soon as they can find a better in their opinion job, and the company is out the training time and expense with no possibility of recovering those costs. On top of that, most jobs will get a pile of applicants today, and some of them will have the education and experience to produce from day one. There is no need to train people and lose money today, when they can find a qualified employee and do not need to go to the expense and trouble of training someone. Back then employers were loyal to employees, and the employees were loyal to the employer. Today the young people have taught the employers the employee is not going to be a long term and loyal employee, so the employer has changed too.
6: Someone above said it is all bad today because of the jobs moving overseas. How about all the foreign companies that have moved jobs to the U.S. The easiest to show example, is the 10 foreign owned companies that have opened Auto factories in the U.S., and Obama administration sold Chrysler to a foreign auto company, with millions of direct and indirect jobs that are reliant on those 11 companies for jobs. American workers are building more foreign autos in the U.S. than they are building Fords and General Motors cars.
More than 6 million Americans now work for foreign-owned companies on U.S. Soil. Then there all the American Jobs making parts etc., for those foreign-owned companies. Back in the 50s, these jobs did not even exist in the U.S. The majority of U.S. jobs working for foreign companies, are much higher paid and better jobs, than the jobs shipped overseas. If the foreign owned companies pulled their jobs out of the U.S., it would devastate the U.S. economy.
Yes it is a different world for workers and the people, than in the 50s. I know, as I have lived in both the past and today.
Today we could have as tight a labor market as in the 1950s or tighter, if the women would quit working to take us back to those days with only the same percentage of woman working as back then.
6: Back then 30% of all American employed workers, were needed to produce the food to feed the nation. Today only 1.5% are needed to grow a whole lot more food than produced back then. Those former agriculture employees, are competing for the better and higher paying jobs today.
Times have changed, and those that cannot accept the changes like we see on these threads complaining they are being treated so unfair, have to learn to live with the changes, and we are not going back to the 50s, and we can all be thankful of that.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
