We're moving into a jobless economy (unemployment, middle class, job, companies)

[Serious Conversation]

Originally Posted by RipCityBassWorks

Oh, but you forget the economy will collapse into itself when the jobless + underemployment rate is so high that there aren't enough active consumers to drive the economy. Consumer spending makes up around 65% - 70% of GDP, and that won't change anytime soon, especially if the Trans Pacific trade deal is approved.....

No one ever thinks that far ahead sadly.

[oldtrader]

50 years ago, it took 33% of all working Americans to produce the food to feed the nation. Today we produce way more food, and it takes 1 1/2% of the population to produce it. That is one of the best examples of the changes that have taken place. And that is a good thing, as most of those now missing farming and ranching jobs are not on the young peoples list of jobs they want to persue.

The biggest thing is, jobs are changing. It is predicted and it certainly looks like the prediction is going to happen, that 10 years from now over half the jobs people will be working at have not even been invented yet. For the young people working today, a large percentage will have to be working at an altogether different job and/or field than they are working at today.

There will be jobs, but they may not be anything like the job you work at today.

[NJBest]

Oh please. When the cotton gin was invented, did it destroy America? no. Technological advancement has been a thing for much longer than modern civilization has existed. Jobs haven't disappeared. Just changed.

[Larry Caldwell]

Originally Posted by evilcart

I find it interesting that so many of these posts are missing the basic point.

Human beings have an average IQ 100 (by definition). Most of the valued new jobs being created require an IQ Much HIGHER than 100, thus the average person is no longer suited to many of the new jobs.


Now, what do you do when educated middle class voters can no longer find meaningful work that provides a brighter future.

If you can explain what we can do to keep the MAJORITY of averagely educated voters invested as stake holders in our community; you may well have solved the problem.



about 10-20 years ago we (big tech) were hiring people with above average IQs and they performed well enough to keep and promote. Today we no longer hire people with IQ of 110 -120. At least not very many. Now we hire only the cream of the crop because the rest simply cant do the work or are so unproductive they get in the way.

Please someone explain how we are going to train up the average guy? Because as of yet no amount of training is bring them up to speed. We have spent millions , nope hundreds of millions trying to retain workers who can no longer meet the rising standard, these are people we were happy to hire 10 or more years ago. But over the last 5 years we have actually been letting these once good hires go..... and that is after throwing many dollars into mid career training!

In short the % of people on the planet that we can consider hiring continues to get smaller each and every year. at the current rate I will be firing myself in another 5 to 10 years.....

sorry for the unedited thought stream...

Just so. The average man on the street has no concept of the intellectual excellence it requires to be productive in 21st century jobs. Here is an example of what the people who actually develop the technology do. They have to be true polymath experts in many fields. This is a chatty little video that came from an industry conference. The contents would earn about 3 PhDs in highly technical fields. It gives a glimpse into how smart you have to be to build the future that everyone will use.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txk-VO1hzBY

[DonJuanQuixote]

Originally Posted by oldtrader

50 years ago, it took 33% of all working Americans to produce the food to feed the nation. Today we produce way more food, and it takes 1 1/2% of the population to produce it. That is one of the best examples of the changes that have taken place. And that is a good thing,

1 1/2% of huge corporations producing genetically modified grain and hormone-pumped meats? I don't think that's a good thing.

Check it out in the news. European countries are scared to import our food.

[mitsguy2001]

Some of the posts in this thread are truly scary. And it is even scarier that many of the "employer" type people on this board think that this is a good outcome. And the fact that nobody has even attempted to answer either of the questions I asked earlier in the thread indicates that nobody has an answer.

[Teckeeee]

Mits, sadly we agree and I don't see much to be done.

[mdovell]

But...do you need a job to make income? The stock market is still close to all time highs.

heck I recently went to Albany and the mall was packed. I don't think I saw anymore then one vacancy. Loaded with shoppers even without sales.

The fact of the matter is we cannot simply defend manual labor when it is unskilled. We could try to excavate for construction projects by using teaspoons if we wanted to in order to save jobs.

How many people work at hat factories? Before JFK was president pretty much all men had a hat. Consumption is nice as a concept but frankly it is marginal. The idea that everyone needs something new all the time AND the price will be high for it frankly doesn't work. A computer can last for years just as cars can. There's nothing wrong with a sharing economy and organizations like Uber. Just as facebook doesn't really produce content it's users do, youtube doesn't make movies but it's users do. We have less mail then in the past. Should we ban email to save the post office?

Meanwhile I know plenty of places begging for people for work. Come to the northeast things are just better here.As for "peak office" well there's complete offices that are telecommutted now. Toffler wrote that the idea of place being a factor is gone and he was right.

There was a time when a fixed location meant everything. Mail was received only at one place, packages at one place, a telephone number was to be at one place only. Now with email and cellphones that all changed.

Getting rid of jobs? Hardly. We have 3d printing that is gradually being brought to the masses. We have crowdfunding as alterantives to funding and crowdsourcing to collaborate across countries. When cost structures drop it creates incentives to innovate. 15 years ago Microsoft ruled computing to the point where the DOJ was going to go after them, Apple was as good as dead. Now it's the opposite.

It reminds me of how some argued that people cannot afford new cars..they've been saying that for 20 years now and yet the companies are doing fine. Every day 10,000 people retire in the USA. As the jobs open up those that go to them open up other positions. Ask some companies, small businesses, non profits and governments if they have succession planning. Chances are they don't. Am I saying each one will be an opening? No but even if it is half it adds up.
5,000 a day at 365 days is 1,825,000 jobs a year. It is argued the country has to create 200k jobs a month to keep up with population growth. That's nine months right there. Then there is the international aspect and the spill over from that and actual "new" jobs added to that so yes there are openings out there. I know places begging for work. If you want a manufacturing job there's plenty of places but you have to be willing to accept training and probably have an associates.

In terms of average we have to consider that average is just that...an average. Does the average person have a degree? Not even close
Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not ok
Even in Mass only 36% have a bachelors and that's the highest for a state. So if you have a degree that's above average.

Can you read? Well that's better then the 14% that is unable to in the USA.
The U.S. Illiteracy Rate Hasn't Changed In 10 Years

So while it is true that standards have gone up like Larry said there are ample amounts that frankly aren't even nudging up. How can anyone in 2015 drop out of high school? The rate has dropped dramatically but that does not change the fact that two million people this year will drop out..what jobs are for drop outs? I get what some might argue about those being left behind but when million drop out and millions cannot read how much more really can be done? If someone cannot understand a contract or a bill or a trade publication or academic journal then who is at fault?

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by dog8food

1 1/2% of huge corporations producing genetically modified grain and hormone-pumped meats? I don't think that's a good thing.

Check it out in the news. European countries are scared to import our food.

This has been going on since the 1990s. The general US public didn't have much of a clue at the time.

Eating in the Dark: America's Experiment with Genetically Engineered Food by Kathleen Hart

That book came out in 2003.

[hotzcatz]

Actually, considering how much output can be accomplished with robots, the role of humans in the upcoming economy may be as consumers. The government or whoever controls the monetary fund can disburse a certain amount to each individual per month and then they can go spend it so the government can collect taxes on everything spent and then hand it back out again.

Due to lack of available workforce in Japan, they are using a lot of robots to take care of seniors. I've heard pretty soon it may be a robotic voice asking "do you want fries with that?" Once robots are able to do pretty much everything humans can do, then what do you do with all the humans?

Another side to it is how can you get money into the hands of consumers so they can consume. Robotic output won't do anyone any good if nobody is consuming it.