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Old 10-19-2016, 07:16 PM
 
10,075 posts, read 7,503,683 times
Reputation: 15500

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf39us View Post
This is misleading at best. While it is true that most joints are forced to pay you the rest if for some reason you make less in tips than what would calculate to be the federal minimum wage, you still need to subsidize your tips before YOU start to earn more than minimum wage.

So if you bust your ass for 10 hours at the current minimum tipped wage (which is $2.13/hr) you would get a whopping $22.13 in tipped wages and then the employer would need to pay you the rest to make up for it which is $50.37 (($7.25*10)-$22.13).

What this effectively means is that in order for you to make MORE than the federal minimum wage, that $50.37 needs to come out of the tips that you accrue over the course of 10 hours. You're effectively paying for the privilege of making more than the minimum wage.
But you are claiming that waiting ISN'T a minimum wage job... how is this different than any other minimum wage job? They all work 10 hours and make $72.50. The only thing tipping does is that it moves the cost from the employer to the customer in a more direct way. Instead of saying X% of menu goes to labor cost, the customer just pays them directly. And does not pay payroll/fica tax in the process. It means the waitress gets less social security and govt gets less tax money for other things.

The employer paying the taxes doesn't even hurt their profits to a great deal because those can be deducted anyhow.
Quote:
Wrong. In many states, there is a lower wage for waitresses allowed, as they are expected to get tips that will put them over the minimum wage total, and that is legal under federal law.
No, they still get the same minimum wage as everyone else. The "lower" rate is not the final pay. The employer is required to make sure that they are paid $7.25/hour, where the money comes from (tips) is why they can "deduct" away from this number and make their own expenses lower
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Old 10-19-2016, 07:52 PM
 
Location: Seymour, CT
3,639 posts, read 3,326,082 times
Reputation: 3089
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLSFan View Post
But you are claiming that waiting ISN'T a minimum wage job... how is this different than any other minimum wage job? They all work 10 hours and make $72.50. The only thing tipping does is that it moves the cost from the employer to the customer in a more direct way. Instead of saying X% of menu goes to labor cost, the customer just pays them directly. And does not pay payroll/fica tax in the process. It means the waitress gets less social security and govt gets less tax money for other things.

The employer paying the taxes doesn't even hurt their profits to a great deal because those can be deducted anyhow.
No, they still get the same minimum wage as everyone else. The "lower" rate is not the final pay. The employer is required to make sure that they are paid $7.25/hour, where the money comes from (tips) is why they can "deduct" away from this number and make their own expenses lower
Which effectively means that they make less money as a result. It also relieves a tax burden off the employer significantly.

Think of it this way, You don't make more money UNTIL you reach $7.25/hr by putting the money in your pocket into that pot.

Here's another way to think about it. I'm an employer and I'm going to pay you the Federal Minimum wage of $7.25/hr, but that money you just made through tips from that customer? I'll take that first $5.12/hr -- here's the rest of your money!
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Log "cabin" west of Bangor
7,058 posts, read 9,045,369 times
Reputation: 15633
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLSFan View Post
...the customer just pays them directly. And does not pay payroll/fica tax in the process. It means the waitress gets less social security and govt gets less tax money for other things.
Only if the employee fails to abide by the law, declare the tips as income and pay the taxes.

Quote:
The employer paying the taxes doesn't even hurt their profits to a great deal because those can be deducted anyhow.
You don't know much about running a business, do you? Regardless of whether an expense, including taxes paid, is 'deducted', it is still money paid out that reduces the bottom line.
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Old 10-19-2016, 09:34 PM
 
4,901 posts, read 8,720,363 times
Reputation: 7117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
Several places have tried this, and in most.. it failed.

Joe's Crab Shack ends no-tipping policy - May. 12, 2016

Are their reasonings the real, correct reasonings behind why it failed? I don't know for sure.. I do think there's validity to the notion that customers feel that they should be able to affect a server in some way for either exceptionally good or poor service.
I don't think they should end tipping....I think they should end paying 3.50 an hour for waitstaff jobs. If anyone wants to give a tip to the waitress, more power to 'em.
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Old 10-19-2016, 09:41 PM
 
13,274 posts, read 8,387,833 times
Reputation: 31473
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zymer View Post
it is still money paid out that reduces the bottom line.
Correct ! So pardon if I don't tip as it reduces MY bottom line.see how that works? A Mexican standoff...waitress misdirects her anger at the "consumer", while Mr money bags gets to hide behind a labor loophole.

I worked waitressing...any tip left at the table went to the bus boy and the dish staff..my pleasant service never needed a tip..Wasn't there to treat a customer shoddy or kiss up to them for a groveling tip. They got great service because it's what a service position entails.

My dad said.. don't go into a job wanting to negotiate wage after being hired... that holds true for the add on of tipping...you have a say in what your skills are worth.
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Old 10-20-2016, 12:46 AM
 
6,977 posts, read 5,689,313 times
Reputation: 5176
Great responses guys, thank you.

Can someone tell me how its legal for certain businesses to pay under minimum wage?
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Old 10-20-2016, 04:49 AM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
5,040 posts, read 6,328,191 times
Reputation: 7197
Quote:
Originally Posted by wall st kid View Post
Great responses guys, thank you.

Can someone tell me how its legal for certain businesses to pay under minimum wage?
'Tipped minimum wage'. If you make above a certain amount in tips to take you to the equivalent of minimum, the basic minimum amount is lower. The idea is that together, the wage and the expected tips are equivalent to minimum wage only. I think States can change it but that's the Federal policy.
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Old 10-20-2016, 08:08 AM
 
Location: City Data Land
17,156 posts, read 12,908,180 times
Reputation: 33164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mnseca View Post
There is really not that much of a relationship between working hard and getting tips. Most people leave a certain percentage unless the service is either horrific or unbelievable, and it usually isn't either one of those things, even if you work hard or don't work hard. So tip sharing or pooling is fair because it removes the vagaries of who got assigned what table, which is just chance and not really fair.
I don't think so. I tip relative to the service. If it's fantastic, I tip more. I don't believe in shared tips; it rewards not only those who are lazy, but those who didn't give me any service at all. Hence, the Starbucks jar never receives any money from me.
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Old 10-20-2016, 09:57 AM
 
Location: Saint John, IN
11,583 posts, read 6,699,896 times
Reputation: 14786
I live in Illinois and I have never waitressed, but my mom has along with hosting her whole life. MINIMUM wage IS less for waitresses/waiters then the actual minimum wage in our state. They state that they can do this due to the fact that they are making tips. With that said.....most GOOD waiters/waitresses can make way more than minimum wage depending how good they are and where they work. My mother works at a country club, works 30-34 hours a week and makes $50k a year. No benefits though, but I think it's decent money; however, it's very hard work!


IMHO....I think tips should only be pulled when there are big events, such as a wedding, etc.
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Old 10-20-2016, 12:46 PM
 
6,680 posts, read 8,206,721 times
Reputation: 4871
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe View Post
I think it depends. I thought it was a good thing when I worked as a slot machine cashier at a casino. Some shifts or areas of the casino are better for tips. With the tip pooling, there wasn't the animosity or fighting over different areas or shifts, etc. All tips were collected until payday, then calculated at a per hour amount, with that amount added to our hourly wages for that pay period.

I ended up transferring to a different department where we kept our own tips, and it was frustrating. This was the "cage" or the bank where people would cash checks, and also cash out large amounts of chips, etc. It was weird how some people got more tips for doing the same exact job, whether they were friendlier or not.

For instance, if a teller was Chinese, the Chinese patrons would wait to go to him and tip him really well. Same with Filipinos. Or if a teller was a young, pretty woman, etc. There was no special service being given to customers. We were just lined up at windows doing the same job. For some reason this department let the cashiers keep their own tips, where the slot department pooled theirs.

In my experience, there were a lot more hard feelings between employees in the "cage," than in slots, where the tips were pooled. In that department, when your fellow slot cashier got a huge tip, we'd all celebrate, because we all got to share them.

I don't think it's always fair, but overall, I think it works out better to pool the tips.
People tip at the window where you exchange your chips for money?
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