Seniority and Vacation Scheduling (employees, temporary, employer, work)

[ShanIAmVA]

To keep this as succinct as possible, I’ll give you all a few bullet points.

• I have worked for the same financial institution for 18 years; no break in service.
• I took another position in a new department 1 year ago December. I moved from another department/ position I had been in for 12 years as there was no opportunity for advancement or skill growth in the foreseeable future.
• There is no clear definition of “seniority” on the company’s HR website but when the term seniority is used it is in the context of years of service with the company.
• I have a coworker who backs me up when I am out of office for more than 1 day. It is a task that requires certain service levels to be met.
• My back-up has been with this company for 4 years and has been in our department for 3 of them.
• We report to the same manager and we were told yesterday in a staff meeting that vacation will be approved based on seniority.


What is your company’s definition of seniority? Time within department or time at company? And what is your personal opinion?

I am bracing myself for my manager coming up with her own definition of seniority, which would be one that does not work in my favor. In my opinion I believe that vacation should be handled very much like child custody and holiday’s. The every other year scenario. This year he gets Thanksgiving and I get Christmas. Next year will be the opposite.

I don’t want my years of service to trump ALL vacation and I’m not looking to play that card. I’m just asking for what is fair because what is not fair is my backup being able to take vacation over both major holiday’s year over year if he wants to. BTW, he and I both have families out of state.

My company promotes upward mobility but family and vacation time is important to a lot of people. Had I known I’d have to “pay my dues” again because I wanted to do better for myself in a new area of the bank, I’d have stayed in my old position.

I do plan on having a non-combative conversation with my manager but before I go in there I want to know -- Am I justified to be upset if her definition of seniority is time within department based? There is a 95% chance of it going that way. Are there any key words or phrases I should use that don’t come across as “crying foul” and “poor me”? I’m a 40+ year old woman who doesn’t want to have a temper tantrum. Although I do do that in my private "me time".

I’ve never been in a position at this company that required me to have a backup until I came here. This is all new to me.

Thanks for any insight or similar stories you can share!

[fishbrains]

I think that a manager who lets a dispute over vacation time between two employees explode has mis-handled the situation. It should be simple to come to a working arrangement that satisfies everybody.

Personally, I would try not to define seniority at all, but sit down with both of you and see if we can come to an agreement that everybody finds fair. If my reports were adamant about doing it in order of seniority, I would pick time with company, and that person gets first pick, but second pick goes to the other. This way, if two people are always fighting over Xmas and Thanksgiving, senior person gets the one they want, other person gets the other one.

[jribe]

my company is the same way -there is no formal definition of "seniority" and PTO days are taken based off of manager approval. It is up to the manager and or department to make any determinations or guidelines on how PTO is approved. I think the best suggestion is for any major holidays (like Christmas/Thanksgiving) are to be "one year on one year off" between the two of you.. But that is, of course if this other person even wants those days off? Personally, i never took those days off since i wasn't normally traveling for the holidays and let co-workers who needed them do so (even those i had technically more years in than others). My suggestion would be to talk with your boss and let him/her know your concerns - but realize they may already have come to this conclusion, so don't make them feel dumb. Go into as a concern, that you want to be able to take one of the holidays and offer your suggestion if it wasn't already considered. best of luck

[HokieFan]

It could be that your back-up is having the same concerns since you've been with the bank longer than him.

I think you did very well with explaining your concern of your back-up getting vacation time over both major holidays, and you could express this to your manager exactly as you did with us. I'm not a fan of basing vacation approval on seniority. My employer pretty much bases approval on first come, first serve and even if there's overlap, we work together to either have sufficient coverage or make adjustments (but of course, you have to work with people who are willing to be flexible which is not always the case).

[North Beach Person]

When I worked in industry it was defined as "time with the company in that division". I found that out when I transferred to a different facility in a different division.

As a teacher we had two types of seniority. For RIFs it was time with the school system it was time employed. For certain things within the building heirarchy it was time at the individual school.

My last couple years I had a couple less years system time than one other teacher but more in building time by 10 or 12 years. As such, when no administrators were in the building (which was every day until at least 9 or 10, classes started at 7:45) I was Senior Teacher In Charge of the building. Which often meant I was putting out fires and teaching a class at the same time.

[Hemlock140]

When I worked at a place that required a full staff, and we brought in temporary people for vacation relief, the vacation schedule was passed around based on company seniority. Each person signed up for one vacation, then it went around again for a second choice. The entire schedule was complete by February 1, and the form limited how many could be off at one time. Here, the department I manage is only 6 people, and I will allow 2-3 to be gone at the same time. It's first come, and requests are made in Sharepoint so they are dated and time stamped. People can request vacation, a day off, or even an hour or two any time of the year, even the day before or same day if something comes up.

[ShanIAmVA]

Thank you all. Your responses so far have made me feel better from the perspective that my worry and concern over this is just.

Despite the fact that I started working for this company before my coworker even entered middle school and even though my officer title is higher, I see him as an equal. And I want equal treatment.

( OK, I just had a vision of myself walking outside my manager's office window holding up a sign and chanting )

The thing is, I really like this coworker. He is probably one of the best coworkers I have ever had and I know this is as much out of his control as it is mine. I can't begrudge him wanting to fly to see his family over the holiday's or his wife wanting him to join her when she sees hers. But whatever family he goes to see, it will be somewhere -- out of state. So it's not a situation for either of us where we can just drive on home after Christmas dinner.

In my head I know it's not his decision or fault but I can't help but be worried that I'll feel resentful of him if I'm the one always holding the short straw.

Thanks again for your replies!

[Mr_Geek]

Seniority at my company is time at company.

[AlaskaErik]

I was in a public sector union position and every person within the Department had a seniority number that determined everything. And that number was based on hire date into the Department. It didn't matter where you worked, or if you transferred to another location. Your seniority date never changed as long as you were continuously employed with the Department.

[SportyandMisty]

Is it possible you are seeing a conflict that doesn't exist in the real world? That is, you see a hypothetical issue rather than a real issue?

If it were me, I would assume I have the seniority so to speak, but not rely upon it. I would make my vacation requests a long time in advance and then be flexible if there is a conflict. Try to come up with a solution that works for everyone. I suspect your manager will appreciate it.