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Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Originally Posted by EastBoundandDownChick
As a Millennial I just think expectations are out-of-whack. That you should be handed a salary straight out of school that will buy a huge house with all the bells and whistles... a new mid-grade or luxury car... enough to finance a 50K wedding... etc. Maybe the Baby Boomers had it good but that was a glitch in the overall scope of history due to the success we had in WWII. My grandparents were much more realistic. They didn't work to "fulfill their passions" or find themselves... they worked at jobs because they were economically practical and put food on the table. They didn't go out to eat every meal and buy $5 Starbucks... they cooked at home and a meal out was a big treat. Clothes weren't designer, they were often made by hand. Having one t.v. in the house was a big deal. Both sides worked 12-14 hour days and didn't complain. Nor did they have a ton of money right away. It took years, DECADES of blood, sweat and tears before they saw real prosperity. If a young person has that kind of ethic and outlook in today's world they should have no issue finding success. I think employers get very frustrated with the lack of work ethic that currently exists and the entitlement mentality. I do believe the minimum wage needs to increase, but if people are too lazy to get to the polls and/or too dumb to vote for their own self interests they get what they rightfully deserve!
What's causing so much unhappiness with many people today is that they see others their age making $100k+ more right out of college, the really talented tech people. That kind of job opportunity never existed before the 1990s, and the number is now significant and very visible to those that don't have the same talent.
What's causing so much unhappiness with many people today is that they see others their age making $100k+ more right out of college, the really talented tech people. That kind of job opportunity never existed before the 1990s, and the number is now significant and very visible to those that don't have the same talent.
This.
And I'd argue that with the amount of student dept some students have, they want to get every penny possible from the employer.
Not that any of this is necessarily right, it's just the way it is sometimes. As an employer, you can always reject their counter offer.
You've got to be kidding. Every time they get a resume that does not turn into an interview with someone outside of HR, they have made a hiring decision.
How do you come to that conclusion?
HR filters applications based upon my criteria. If I want a degree, certification or experience, I tell them that and they send me everybody that meets the standards I set.
Once they send me all relevant applications, I make the determination as to how many people I will interview, and who those people will be.
HR does not make hiring decisions, they assist managers with the regulations and administrative tasks around the hiring process.
I'm talking *specifically* about highly educated/degree holder people "stuck" working low-paying jobs that are completely unrelated to their field of study. This has been a trend for a while now, although 08' obviously made it worse.
I'm noticing it is starting to happen to even the "good" degrees such as engineering, nursing, and law. Is it simply a matter of not enough good jobs to go around?
Thoughts?
I think it's more a case of everyone expecting too much; especially with regard to avoiding the negatives of a "bad" job as well as finding a "good" one. That can be linked to several factors; (1) a larger, and more diverse pool of candidates in the wake of societal changes (2) a shielding of many recent graduates from much of the downside (and occasionally, the upside) of real-world and non-traditional employment
I got my undergraduate degree in 1971. During the summers, I worked in a local factory, which was happy to find summer-vacation replacements due to the labor shortage of the Vietnam era. The plant was unionized and overtime work drew a generous increase in pay.
In contrast, when I made the first foray into the world of white-collar work, all the "unwritten rules of self-effacement" -- accepting a dress code, a strict 9-to-5 schedule with occasional unpaid extra effort (we'll remember it at salary-review time -- yeah!, and the check is in the mail, too!), and all the other subtleties of life in a corporate power structure -- made themselves immediately felt, (though not always codified in a consistent manner). In addition, the measures of productivity and personal contribution were seldom apparent; "performance" reviews seemed geared far more toward downplaying your achievements and keeping you on the bottom rung of the ladder.
I never got many chances at advancement, but in the 20/20 vision of hindsight, I can recognize now that any involvement in supervision usually led to conflicts -- because a manager's job, at any level, usually involves intensifying the work load and pressures on his/her subordinates, just as the manager's superiors are intensifying the stress upon him/her.
Or as a fraternity brother of mine so aptly put it: "The only problem with college is that it's followed by a big long first period" -- and if the accounts of some of my younger friends are to be believed, the "classroom mentality" has degenerated down toward the junior high school level.
Last edited by 2nd trick op; 03-30-2017 at 04:53 PM..
I think younger people are moving toward intolerance of poor behavior. The "old salty boss" who likes to cuss and yell or the condescending strategist are slowly not being tolerated in society and that also extends to the work place. I don't disagree with them, no one should have to tolerate a "bad" boss. If a "boss" cant get their heads out of their own rear end then the turn around is going to get high as the society shifts, eventually they will eventually be displaced or go under.
I ask this, what is the upside to tolerating clock watching, micro management, condescension, strict dress codes (outside of indecency issues like camel toes, boobs hanging out etc), strict schedules, hunger game vacation bids, etc etc. Why should we as a society tolerate this?
they need to learn that "highly" educated does not equal "highly" skilled...
for all the effort and time they spent getting that degree, why are they coming out with little to no real world applicable skills?
You can educate someone for years on how to fish, but until you give them a pole and 5 minutes of hands on experience, they will still starve
if they are coming out with no skills, they failed their education along the way
Great point. Being highly educated and having a degree is one thing, but being highly skilled in a particular field is another. A lot of "under-employed" people lack the skills that can land them higher paying or professional jobs. They may have degrees, but experience and skill set is very important in resolving in under-employment.
Wow, this made me curious...did your professor tell you? What happened to these students? Did you have to prove that you were the one of the four who actually did the work?
Oh yeah. The prof sat down with me and asked me how it worked. I explained what algorithms I was implementing and why I chose the functions I did for optimum efficiency, which data I was storing in CPU registers and which had to be written to RAM, etc. I got an A. I have no idea what happened to the other students, and never asked.
As a Millennial I just think expectations are out-of-whack. That you should be handed a salary straight out of school that will buy a huge house with all the bells and whistles... a new mid-grade or luxury car... enough to finance a 50K wedding... etc. Maybe the Baby Boomers had it good but that was a glitch in the overall scope of history due to the success we had in WWII. My grandparents were much more realistic. They didn't work to "fulfill their passions" or find themselves... they worked at jobs because they were economically practical and put food on the table. They didn't go out to eat every meal and buy $5 Starbucks... they cooked at home and a meal out was a big treat. Clothes weren't designer, they were often made by hand. Having one t.v. in the house was a big deal. Both sides worked 12-14 hour days and didn't complain. Nor did they have a ton of money right away. It took years, DECADES of blood, sweat and tears before they saw real prosperity. If a young person has that kind of ethic and outlook in today's world they should have no issue finding success. I think employers get very frustrated with the lack of work ethic that currently exists and the entitlement mentality. I do believe the minimum wage needs to increase, but if people are too lazy to get to the polls and/or too dumb to vote for their own self interests they get what they rightfully deserve!
The thing I notice most is that young people have horrible money management skills. When I graduated from college there was no such thing as a credit card. If you wanted to buy something you wrote a check, and if you bounced a check you got hit with an overdraft fee. Major purchases required weeks, months, or even years of planning. Banks sold "Christmas Club" accounts where they would transfer a small amount from your checking account each month so you would have enough money saved to buy Christmas presents. You paid your bills on the first of the month, and what was left over was what you lived on for the rest of the month. Going into debt for car repairs or buying something was not even a possibility. Life was cash and carry unless the business wanted to extend credit.
Nowadays graduates have such massive debt from school that they think a few grand on the plastic is no big deal. They have no concept of what that does to their cash flow.
Yeah, we shared rent and expenses with roommates, but that was the fun part. It was a rolling party. A gallon of Gallo and a couple guitars and we were good for a weekend. I didn't even own my first TV set until I was 30 years old.
Because society isnt footing the bill for bad bosses... be your own boss or find a new one
That's exactly what society is doing and because it is now prolific the bad bosses and crappy companies are crying about it and have labeled it as "entitlement" because people are not just bending to their will.
Before it was prolific the crumby bosses could simply throw you out and have someone who would tow the line the next day, now its getting harder to find good little peasents who are willing to let the company run their entire lives (cant smoke weed, be in at this EXACT time for no particular reason other than I said so, dress this way not because your provocative but because I said so, etc etc).
Now there is a mad scramble effort for bosses to find refugees and H1B's because these people will tow the line and allow themselves to be abused. As the people of the USA fight H1B and want tarrifs companies are freaking out because there will be no out for companies as the society continues to shift and these condesnding evil people are feeling trapped so they are lashing out. The companies don't like the shift and so they are developing intellectually dishonest strategys to pitch to the govt so they can keep their gravy train going (ie the anecdotal lazy entitled millennial).
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