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Location: In a city within a state where politicians come to get their PHDs in Corruption
2,907 posts, read 2,068,788 times
Reputation: 4478
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Left-handed
We put a lot of pressure on young people to have their entire lives figured out by the ages of 18-22. Anyone who didn't already have their life mapped out by their elders understands that it can take time figuring out what you want to do with your life.
When my father was college age, he worked some odd jobs until he became a truck driver (not long haul). He's been doing that work over 30 years, since before I was born, at the same company. My mom has never really had a career. She's just worked randomly in retail, education, and manufacturing. They never had the same expectations set on them that were set on me or the rest of my generation. They just sort of did life. But we're expected to be masters of our destiny before 25.
I don't have a problem with young people not having everything figured out. I think it's healthy to try many different things, even quit, and then start all over. I'm even OK with young people taking out ton of debt to experiment. They have 30-40 years of working to pay that debt off.
What I have a problem with, is these very same people having an attitude of entitlement. Your parents didn't have that. Mine, didn't either. They can't have it both ways. You can't be what amounts to be an over educated vagabond and demand concessions.
Some. Others have no problem, others are recruited, and there are some with companies begging them to work there.
This is not high school. College is a tool that requires precision planning for implementation.
Going to college without a concrete plan is like buying random real estate for whatever the seller asks. Ok. Now you owe money for a piece of land. What are you going to do with it now? Is it going to appreciate? Depreciate? Is it on top of toxic waste? Next to a dump?
You'd be considered a fool to do this. But kids blame the schools for selling them worthless diplomas.
Oh, brother. Some of the comments here are amazing. So, if you are a Retail Manager, you are a loser? Do you know how much money some of these grocery store managers make? Then, they work their way up to District Manager or Regional Manager and the pay is outstanding. For example, Aldi's pays damn good money and I don't even know if they need a degree if they start off as a cashier and work their way up.
I remember when I was 16 and my dad told me to become a bagger at one of the major grocery chains in our area. He said, "You can still go to school and get a degree, but do this because you can work your way up there when you are young and who knows where it can lead." Unfortunately, I didn't listen to him. Wish I had.
And to those saying the gal with a women's study degree will be working at Starbucks or as an admin assistant. Do you folks realize how much some of these people can make? Starbucks is really an excellent company in which to work from what I understand. Executive Administrative Assistants can make damn good money depending on what company and for whom they work. Ya think the EA to the CEO at Boeing is making chump change? She's probably making more than some of you who have Master's degrees and act like elitists!
I have a Master's degree and I work at Boeing lol. And guess what. You're probably right in that the EA to Dennis Muilenburg or Kevin McAllister makes more than I do. But that's just one job. Getting one of those jobs is like winning the lottery. Odds are extremely slim. And to be able to handle the workload of the executives of elite companies is not something most people can just do. Becoming regional director or whatever starting from being a bag boy is an extremely slim possibility as well. Doesn't mean it can't happen, but is it likely to happen? Probably not.
Last edited by fluffypoopoo; 02-28-2018 at 01:24 PM..
I don't have a problem with young people not having everything figured out. I think it's healthy to try many different things, even quit, and then start all over. I'm even OK with young people taking out ton of debt to experiment. They have 30-40 years of working to pay that debt off.
What I have a problem with, is these very same people having an attitude of entitlement. Your parents didn't have that. Mine, didn't either. They can't have it both ways. You can't be what amounts to be an over educated vagabond and demand concessions.
I don't think that anyone can reasonably make the declaration that they know who is entitled and who isn't.
All young people aren't the same.
All old people aren't the same.
Some young people act entitled.
Some old people act entitled.
Maybe my parents didn't act entitled (I don't know, and neither do you). But they did make a lot of poor decisions in life and their kids paid for it. I don't have any hard feelings about it though. Difference between me and them is that my dad could raise a small family on his truck driving job that his company paid for him to be. They literally paid for his training to be a driver, and continue to do so. How many companies are willing to pay for their employees' training or college education today? How many 30-somethings do you see on these forums bragging about how their employer paid for their Master's or MBAs? Yet, I see 50+ year olds bragging about it all the time.
Call it entitlement or what have you. I think a lot of us are just PO'd that the expectations on us are so high, and yet, all the perks (pensions, paid-for college, etc.) have been stripped away once it became our time. My parents didn't even do half the crap that I've had to do in order to live a similar lifestyle as them. But then their generation calls us entitled. Huh? I graduated near the top of my HS class, I went to a top uni, moved across country to get work, and had to switch jobs every few years to get to this point where I could finally buy a (town) home. My father is a high school graduate, lives in the same city he grew up in, and has had the same job for 35+ years and has a 5BR/3BA house with two garages on a double lot. He'll be retiring at 65, while I'll likely be working until I'm 80. He's only minimally funded a 401k and will rely on SSI, while I'm max-funding 3-4 different retirement and savings accounts because SSI likely won't be around when I get there.
Do more with less...that's the direction that we've been heading for the past 40 years or so.
Last edited by Left-handed; 02-28-2018 at 02:04 PM..
Location: In a city within a state where politicians come to get their PHDs in Corruption
2,907 posts, read 2,068,788 times
Reputation: 4478
Quote:
Originally Posted by Left-handed
I don't think that anyone can reasonably make the declaration that they know who is entitled and who isn't.
All young people aren't the same.
All old people aren't the same.
Some young people act entitled.
Some old people act entitled.
Maybe my parents didn't act entitled (I don't know, and neither do you). But they did make a lot of poor decisions in life and their kids paid for it. I don't have any hard feelings about it though. Difference between me and them is that my dad could raise a small family on his truck driving job that his company paid for him to be. They literally paid for his training to be a driver, and continue to do so. How many companies are willing to pay for their employees' training or college education today? How many 30-somethings do you see on these forums bragging about how their employer paid for their Master's or MBAs? Yet, I see 50+ year olds bragging about it all the time.
Call it entitlement or what have you. I think a lot of us are just PO'd that the expectations on us are so high, and yet, all the perks (pensions, paid-for college, etc.) have been stripped away once it became our time.
Do more with less...that's the direction that we've been heading for the past 40 years or so.
Your parents and my parents grew up in a time where there was little, if any global competition. Now, there is. Adapt, or die. Lamenting the loss of perks once enjoyed by previous generations is useless. Economic cycles are shorter, and uncertainty is through the roof. People that learn how to profit from such uncertainty will do well, others won't. I'd rather put my and my family's livelihood in my own hands, rather than the hands of government, or corporate bureaucracy.
Your parents and my parents grew up in a time where there was little, if any global competition. Now, there is. Adapt, or die. Lamenting the loss of perks once enjoyed by previous generations is useless. Economic cycles are shorter, and uncertainty is through the roof. People that learn how to profit from such uncertainty will do well, others won't. I'd rather put my and my family's livelihood in my own hands, rather than the hands of government, or corporate bureaucracy.
Tell us how you profit from uncertainty. All I do is invest and save and keep debt to a minimum (outside of mortgage payment). I basically live my entire life as if I'm saving for a rainy day. Yay!!!
Basically you're telling people to find the magic unicorn. The world is extremely uncertain...profit from it!
HOW?!?! How do you even plan when you don't know what three years from now looks like? I sure as heck can't do it, and I'm not convinced you can do it.
I have several people in my life who are graduating college this year or last year. All of them have been completely overwhelmed by how difficult it is to find a job these days.
One of my cousins graduated Saturday with a women's studies major. She's only got a part-time job for now, no internships to my knowledge, and the economy is not good in that area. She's been applying, but hasn't gotten many call backs. She's about two hours to Atlanta but doesn't want to move.
Girlfriend is graduating in December. No permanent job offers, economy is even worse here. She doesn't want to move either.
I graduated in 2010 as an economics major. The business school printed out job postings periodically, and it looked like tons of jobs were available. In hindsight, it was probably some dump out of Indeed. Misleading, at best.
Career placement/advisement services were useless for me. Many of the people in those offices have never been in the private sector, hired anyone, or worked in HR. Worse yet, many have been there for ages and are out of touch with current labor market trends. They're ill-equipped to prepare new graduates for labor market hurdles.
I've never seen colleges offer any sort of prep or overview of major job application systems like Taleo. Many new graduates have no idea how to use the systems or how to properly navigate the software. Another stumbling block.
Behavioral assessments are now common on job applications. I've never heard of a college giving people advice on how to navigate this kind of thing either.
I found my professors to be downright deceptive about the health of the local labor market. Degrees that have no local viability are available, and no one ever advises that if you major in X, it's likely you'll have to move to a major metro. Providing accurate labor market context really doesn't happen. There also isn't sufficient emphasis about how important the first job is for setting the stage for the rest of your career.
I was overwhelmed when I first stepped out into the real world from college, and I think I was more worldly than most of my peers. Do you think new grads are overwhelmed? Is college preparing students for the challenges of a dynamic labor market?
I don't think they are deceptive. I think they are just not living in the same reality as the rest of the world.
For instance, I always find newly grads putting their achievements, awards, honors, strengths, etc. at the very bottom of their resume because their professors and counselors told them to. Why? I, as an engineer, when reviewing resumes for potentials don't really care all that much about their job at McDonalds 3 years ago or Walmart last summer. I want to see what kinds of projects they worked on, what kinds of competitions and awards they got related to engineering. And yet, every year I see the same format over and over. And the answer is always the same: their counselors and professors told them to put their jobs at McDonalds on top and their achievements, projects, awards, everything important that's related to engineering at the very bottom of the resume.
I give professors a lot of respect. But I'm sorry, please seek out a real professional in the real world for advice on how to find a job. Not academics.
I don't think they are deceptive. I think they are just not living in the same reality as the rest of the world.
For instance, I always find newly grads putting their achievements, awards, honors, strengths, etc. at the very bottom of their resume because their professors and counselors told them to. Why? I, as an engineer, when reviewing resumes for potentials don't really care all that much about their job at McDonalds 3 years ago or Walmart last summer. I want to see what kinds of projects they worked on, what kinds of competitions and awards they got related to engineering. And yet, every year I see the same format over and over. And the answer is always the same: their counselors and professors told them to put their jobs at McDonalds on top and their achievements, projects, awards, everything important that's related to engineering at the very bottom of the resume.
I give professors a lot of respect. But I'm sorry, please seek out a real professional in the real world for advice on how to find a job. Not academics.
What school did you go to where professors were lecturing on how to create a resume? All of the knowledge I've ever acquired is from the Internet, professional mentors, or recruiters.
Employers are always looking for bigger, better, CHEAPER. (Though generally without the bigger and better part since most don't have the experience). Which means, "Fresh college graduates" they can lowball. The easiest time for Job searching is being fresh out of college. Once you gain a 5-10 years of institutional knowledge, get ready for the axe for the back. You're gonna be deemed "too expensive" or "overqualified" yada yada.
Employers are always looking for bigger, better, CHEAPER. (Though generally without the bigger and better part since most don't have the experience). Which means, "Fresh college graduates" they can lowball. The easiest time for Job searching is being fresh out of college. Once you gain a 5-10 years of institutional knowledge, get ready for the axe for the back. You're gonna be deemed "too expensive" or "overqualified" yada yada.
I personally think the key is not to sit at the top of your pay scale too long. If you've topped out in your position, you need to look for another role where you're either at the lower end or midpoint of the pay scale. In my experience, it's almost always those who are sitting at the high end of their position's pay scale that get chopped when it's that time.
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