Why do people think they are worth $15 an hour? (lender, Navy, loan)
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@BornintheSprings then stop expecting people to hand you things if you don't like what they are handing you
it isn't starvation, learn to cook your own meals instead of buying it
learn to make what you need instead of paying someone for it
learn to make your own business if you don't like how other people run theirs
The point is you are pretending like people have a choice to work a job they don't like the fact is they don't most of the time hence the starvation or wage slavery comment. Essentially your post is a useless platitude for someone who is being exploited in the working environment the advice you gave is tantamount to telling a homeless person to just buy a house!
The point is you are pretending like people have a choice to work a job they don't like the fact is they don't most of the time hence the starvation or wage slavery comment. Essentially your post is a useless platitude for someone who is being exploited in the working environment the advice you gave is tantamount to telling a homeless person to just buy a house!
Actually, everyone has a choice and not everyone likes their job every day.
If you work for someone and they are exploiting you, then talk to them or change jobs. You have a choice.
When you have no choice is when you have exhausted all other means available.
If you tell a homeless person to buy a house is like telling someone to climb a ladder without using any rungs. You simply show them the first step/rung, and let them climb.
The point is you are pretending like people have a choice to work a job they don't like
They don't have a choice? They're chained to their desks and under armed guard? Of course not... they could choose to not go any more, or they can choose to keep going.
I know... "But there's nowhere else for them to go!" So shouldn't they quit whining and get to work? Or move? Or learn how to do something else? If I run a business, and you work there, and there's "nowhere else for you to go", what obligation does that place on me? What if there are no other potential employees for me to hire? Does that mean you have to stay, not quit, not cause trouble, etc?
if they aren't capable of anything beyond being mundane, then why do they expect a life that isn't mundane in return?
it isn't all that hard to live a mundane life, but none of them want to do that, so they rely on welfare to make up the short coming...
why do you think that they deserve better than what they can do if they worked "harder'? even if they can't go above the mundane work?
it doesn't matter how hard you dig a ditch, you are still digging a hole that you aren't filling
I don't mind govt helping people live better, but they are not entitled to living better for being alive
Just to be clear, I'm talking about not being able to afford rent. In lousy places. Not the Ritz, or some high CoL area. Nor am I talking about being able to afford the newest iPhone every year. A basic, no frills cell phone for $20, and the cheapest plan should be possible though.
I don't know if we're talking past each other, but I was never advocating everyone gets a free update to the middle class.
Kind;50741902]Good point. Then start your own company. Very simple.[/quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble and Kind
BTW, the money you make is made by the company you work for, so you are getting a percentage of the profits. Also, your assets aren't on the line if the company doesn't make money. You can take another job tomorrow, not so with a company.
Perfect example is stores closing down, those assets are lost by the company.
. So which is it? Either people are well enough that they can just start their own businesses with a snap of the proverbial fingers, or it truly is quite the obstacle to do just that.
.
True, my assets aren't on the line if a company goes under. OTOH, I'm at the whim of a boss' decision to more or less unilaterally lay off the whole team. Management gets final say in all decisions. If the company does well, my pay is still only my salary or hourly rate, whereas YOU would reap all the rest of the benefits. 'Flip the switch'... if this is such a bad proposition, then consider working for "the man" again so you won't need to deal with all that, and have that tradeoff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humble and Kind
I've found that many people like the mundane/mediocre, no responsibilities, no stress, just go to work and go home.
Problem is, they want more pay for less productivity. Raise MW, and I'll do what I must to keep my business going. I don't pay MW, but if MW was 15 then others would want an increase also...for the same productivity? I can't do that. Then I resort to more automation and seasonal work/part time.
There are also those that work harder knowing they're more motivated with better pay.
.
And "others wanting more" is relative. How many folks buy a $5 smoothie, shake, latte, when if they paid $10, they'd get a decent meal that's nutritionally a superior value? Yet, the $5 drink is still doing fairly well. If the folks who were making only a few notches above the previous MW are now offended by this change, then let's use the old C-D mantra to address their concerns....
1) "life's not fair"
2) "if you didn't want to be in this situation, you should've 'bettered' yourself"
They don't have a choice? They're chained to their desks and under armed guard? Of course not... they could choose to not go any more, or they can choose to keep going.
I know... "But there's nowhere else for them to go!" So shouldn't they quit whining and get to work? Or move? Or learn how to do something else? If I run a business, and you work there, and there's "nowhere else for you to go", what obligation does that place on me? What if there are no other potential employees for me to hire? Does that mean you have to stay, not quit, not cause trouble, etc?
Back in the day they would have a shoot out to deal with such tenuous antagonistic situations. now days the police state protects people from that outcome.
Back in the day you either had a symbiotic relationship ... or someone got shot to death. When that option is on the table it makes people (other than arrogant gun slingers) consider other people a little bit more.
But really this is not the fault of employers it is the fault of big banks giving out free money and running up the costs of everything. If a bank is allowing some schmuk to enter into a bid war with me who does not actually have money (but rather is borrowing the money) they can run up the cost of say a house.
Fast forward 30-40 years and suddently an asset worth 20-30k is now "worth" 320k. But wages have gone up scant. Guess what people still have to live somewhere. This situation was also perpetrated by mega corps as well.
So really it is up to individual people and small buisness to help either other. Dont be a sociopath small buisness owner and dont be a worthless know nothing employee. Because if we are all fighting each other the mega corps and banks win, its that simple.
If I only had to pay 100k for a house I would not even HAVE to work right now, I could just build esoteric skill sets and when someone needed them one day I would be the weirdo that people could journey to find. I am doing that anyways but its slower going because I have to work ... for now.
Wife and I are considering van living but I cant set up a machine shop and office in a van
They don't have a choice? They're chained to their desks and under armed guard? Of course not... they could choose to not go any more, or they can choose to keep going.
I know... "But there's nowhere else for them to go!" So shouldn't they quit whining and get to work? Or move? Or learn how to do something else? If I run a business, and you work there, and there's "nowhere else for you to go", what obligation does that place on me? What if there are no other potential employees for me to hire? Does that mean you have to stay, not quit, not cause trouble, etc?
A different way of looking at this is what obligation does 90 or more percent of the population have to tolerate an economic system that funnels most of the country's wealth to a small fraction of the population? Why should you be allowed to run a business that employs people and doesn't pay them enough to survive?
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