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I work in a small office on an HR team and have a colleague (exempt employee) in my group who has been taking an excessive amount of time off. It's only May, and this individual has less than a handful of PTO days left for the year (and we have over 20 days, so we get a lot). There's no rhyme or reason, no pattern to the days. Sometimes it's a day here, a day there. Sometimes it's multiple days in a row. People are starting to notice, so much so that another colleague, who reports into a different supervisor, has been complaining to their boss about the situation. I know it's not right or "PC" to discuss anything, but it's quickly becoming the "talk of the town."
Luckily, I don't do much work with this person even though they are on my team. I won't go into detail, but I have some information about this person through a friend who works at their old company. This information has led me to want to stay as far away as I can. So that's what I do. From my perspective, the absences are becoming problematic because they are slowing down certain projects and whatnot. I personally feel the contribution level just isn't what it should be. We need someone in that role who will be reliable and dedicated, and I'm just not seeing that even when they ARE in the office. I'm not sure how my supervisor feels about the situation, and I don't want to get involved so I don't plan on asking. Is it possible this person has some sort of serious issue? I suppose so, and if that's the case, they're doing a superb job of hiding it. Last year, this individual unexpectedly took over a week off. My supervisor said they were really sick. Upon their return, I asked them if they were feeling better, and I was told there was no sickness after all, just "personal stuff going on." Everyone has some level of personal stuff going on - doesn't mean you always get to or should take a day off for it.
Even though I work in HR, I don't know a ton about the rules surrounding PTO and exempt employees. If my coworker ends up going in the red with PTO time, what can happen? Would "taking too much time" be grounds for dismissal? If there is some serious issue that this individual is keeping under wraps (understandably so...), would they then be forced to go on an LOA or FMLA since they have no PTO left to take? How far can this person really go with taking time off beyond what's been allotted to them? I suppose I'm curious to see how this might shake out. I'd hate to see someone potentially lose their job, but there comes a time when it's difficult to not view this as taking advantage of your employer!
If your colleague still has PTO time left for this year, then he is not taking too much time off. Some people take a lot off early in the year and some take it late. Others balance it out. I used to take most of mine in the summer.
There is no right or wrong way to take PTO, just as long as you have the time available and your absence is approved. If your colleague runs out of PTO time and then tries to take some, your management will simply tell him that he has no PTO left for the year and that he cannot take time off.
If your colleague still has PTO time left for this year, then he is not taking too much time off. Some people take a lot off early in the year and some take it late. Others balance it out. I used to take most of mine in the summer.
There is no right or wrong way to take PTO, just as long as you have the time available and your absence is approved. If your colleague runs out of PTO time and then tries to take some, your management will simply tell him that he has no PTO left for the year and that he cannot take time off.
Or, he has the option to take time off, without pay, provided management approves.
As an HR Manager and experienced (aka "getting older") professional my first advice is to stay out of it and don't involve yourself in any office chatter or gossip relating to this employee. It is managements responsibility to handle this whichever way they choose.
That said, federal law does not address PTO accrual or usage, some states do to varying levels.
If FMLA would apply than it's not a case of being "forced" it's required. FMLA simply protects the employee's position with the company if leave is taken for medically protected reason. FMLA time off does not need to be paid whether the employee is exempt or not.
If her PTO balance goes negative company could elect to continue to pay for it, allow her to make up for it by not using PTO in the future, or if it's clear she is taking FULL days off for personal reasons (not medical) and there is no PTO balance to cover it, it can go unpaid.
She can be terminated if the absences are not for reasons protected by FMLA or ADA.
If your colleague still has PTO time left for this year, then he is not taking too much time off. Some people take a lot off early in the year and some take it late. Others balance it out. I used to take most of mine in the summer.
There is no right or wrong way to take PTO, just as long as you have the time available and your absence is approved. If your colleague runs out of PTO time and then tries to take some, your management will simply tell him that he has no PTO left for the year and that he cannot take time off.
I disagree there is no right or wrong way to take PTO.
There should be flexibility for unexpected reasons resulting from things like illness and catastrophes but most PTO should be scheduled. Random and frequent unscheduled absences is disruptive to both work flow and office environment.
I work in a small office on an HR team and have a colleague (exempt employee) in my group who has been taking an excessive amount of time off. It's only May, and this individual has less than a handful of PTO days left for the year (and we have over 20 days, so we get a lot). There's no rhyme or reason, no pattern to the days. Sometimes it's a day here, a day there. Sometimes it's multiple days in a row. People are starting to notice, so much so that another colleague, who reports into a different supervisor, has been complaining to their boss about the situation. I know it's not right or "PC" to discuss anything, but it's quickly becoming the "talk of the town."
Luckily, I don't do much work with this person even though they are on my team. I won't go into detail, but I have some information about this person through a friend who works at their old company. This information has led me to want to stay as far away as I can. So that's what I do. From my perspective, the absences are becoming problematic because they are slowing down certain projects and whatnot. I personally feel the contribution level just isn't what it should be. We need someone in that role who will be reliable and dedicated, and I'm just not seeing that even when they ARE in the office. I'm not sure how my supervisor feels about the situation, and I don't want to get involved so I don't plan on asking. Is it possible this person has some sort of serious issue? I suppose so, and if that's the case, they're doing a superb job of hiding it. Last year, this individual unexpectedly took over a week off. My supervisor said they were really sick. Upon their return, I asked them if they were feeling better, and I was told there was no sickness after all, just "personal stuff going on." Everyone has some level of personal stuff going on - doesn't mean you always get to or should take a day off for it.
Even though I work in HR, I don't know a ton about the rules surrounding PTO and exempt employees. If my coworker ends up going in the red with PTO time, what can happen? Would "taking too much time" be grounds for dismissal? If there is some serious issue that this individual is keeping under wraps (understandably so...), would they then be forced to go on an LOA or FMLA since they have no PTO left to take? How far can this person really go with taking time off beyond what's been allotted to them? I suppose I'm curious to see how this might shake out. I'd hate to see someone potentially lose their job, but there comes a time when it's difficult to not view this as taking advantage of your employer!
I know HR is more than just employee policies - but how in the world does someone who works in HR not know an HR policy? Or at the very least, know how to find this out?
Most of this information should be in that policy that your department manages - the Employee Handbook. Otherwise, talk to your manager. I'm sure he/she can tell you. Basically - it's company specific. Some will let you go into the red/negative. Others will force you to take unpaid leave. FMLA has strict rules on how they are used.
As for the reasoning for taking it. I'm not sure why that is an issue unless it's impacting their performance or the team. I know folks the used to take every Friday off during the summer months so they can spend time with their kids. You don't really need to give a reason (and really - does it matter?). But most will plan accordingly and provide advanced notice to make sure it doesn't impact those they work with.
In the end, you can fire someone for just about any reason. But most companies will protect themselves from lawsuits by using common sense.
Luckily, I don't do much work with this person even though they are on my team.
This phrase is one of the most important and telling ones in the post. Unless you manage this person or their absences are negatively affecting your work or putting a significant burden on you (which your post does not indicate), then I wouldn't worry about it as it's not your responsibility.
It's very likely that at some point in your career, you will have to deal with someone who is frequently absent and it does have a strong impact on your work that you will have to confront, but this doesn't look like one of those times. Be grateful that this isn't and remember to pick your battles carefully.
They still have PTO days? If so obviously they have not "taken too much off".
If there is a project/schedule that did not take into account people using PTO, then that is a whole separate issue. But I advise in the future to incorporate that yes, in fact people do take time off, into any project schedule.
I know HR is more than just employee policies - but how in the world does someone who works in HR not know an HR policy? Or at the very least, know how to find this out?
Most of this information should be in that policy that your department manages - the Employee Handbook. Otherwise, talk to your manager. I'm sure he/she can tell you. Basically - it's company specific. Some will let you go into the red/negative. Others will force you to take unpaid leave. FMLA has strict rules on how they are used.
As for the reasoning for taking it. I'm not sure why that is an issue unless it's impacting their performance or the team. I know folks the used to take every Friday off during the summer months so they can spend time with their kids. You don't really need to give a reason (and really - does it matter?). But most will plan accordingly and provide advanced notice to make sure it doesn't impact those they work with.
In the end, you can fire someone for just about any reason. But most companies will protect themselves from lawsuits by using common sense.
I work in a specialized area of HR. Wish I didn’t, but I do. So I don’t know every little thing there is to know. I do absolutely nothing with time off because it’s not part of what I do. And while my company is large overall, it’s not very sophisticated, so this kind of information is hard to come by. And, FYI, I actually have a Masters Degree in HR, but even then, it’s impossible to know every little detail.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus
They still have PTO days? If so obviously they have not "taken too much off".
If there is a project/schedule that did not take into account people using PTO, then that is a whole separate issue. But I advise in the future to incorporate that yes, in fact people do take time off, into any project schedule.
We do build in time off assumptions into project plans. And this individual has three days left for the YEAR, until January. Given all the time taken off in a matter of less than five months, do you honestly think three days is going to be enough for the rest of the YEAR?! I don’t.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sockeye66
I disagree there is no right or wrong way to take PTO.
There should be flexibility for unexpected reasons resulting from things like illness and catastrophes but most PTO should be scheduled. Random and frequent unscheduled absences is disruptive to both work flow and office environment.
I agree. There are certainly days that might be unexpected. But when it’s every day off that’s spur of the moment, that’s absolutely an issue.
I don’t feel as though reasons are necessary when taking time off. But what happens when the PTO goes negative? How many “unpaid” days could then be alllowed? Is it essentially limitless unless the company chooses to terminate because of absenteeism? I mean, if this person ends up taking unpaid day after unpaid day, let’s say 20 days unpaid on top of the 20 PTO, what’s really stopping anyone else from requesting “extra” time off? I just feel there has to be a breaking point at some point. Otherwise, it becomes an issue of special treatment/favoritism, which is quite unfair to everyone else out there who is following the rules.
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