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Old 04-18-2019, 05:12 PM
 
1,704 posts, read 558,708 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusinessManIT View Post
Certainly management communicates as to when employees can take vacations, no matter what type of policy they have. But the "unlimited" remains deceptive. Perhaps that is the moniker that bothers me and other posters the most.

I have never worked anywhere where this "unlimited" vacation policy was in effect. My colleagues and I were always allocated a certain amount of vacation time every year based on seniority. I have worked for challenging companies but was always able to take vacations, sometimes having to fight for them.

However, at my last company where I worked at for 28 years, one of the few good things was the ability to take vacations without any problems as long as they were scheduled at least a couple of months in advance. And it didn't matter what your workload was or how many active projects that you had. It was not possible to predict that months in advance. And my colleagues and I always had too much work all the time anyway so it was never a good time to take a vacation. But the company was accommodating in that way. And we knew that we had a set amount to use every year and planned for it.

But with this "unlimited" vacation policy it is not clear how much you could take. If I suddenly found myself working for a company that had that policy and didn't care much about my credibility or career at that company, I would sit down with my boss and say that I am planning my vacation for the year and since you have an unlimited vacation policy, I'm taking the whole year off. The boss would then say that is ridiculous and I would agree. I would then say ok how about half the year. The boss would say that is also ridiculous and I would agree again. I would then keep reducing the vacation amount until the boss would agree. Thus, I would have an answer from my boss as to the real amount of vacation time I could take per year, despite the "unlimited" label. Then I would schedule that time for the whole year if that was possible based on staffing and workloads. So the boss would look like an idiot for having to come up with a maximum amount on a supposed "unlimited" vacation policy. If he or she was evasive in discussing vacation time, then I would know it was a scam. A real manager could easily give a ballpark estimate of how many days a month you could take as vacation time on the average.

So the bottom line is I don't care how companies design their vacation policies. However, putting a label of "unlimited" communicates false information to the employee. Simply putting a more appropriate name such as "responsible" rather than "unlimited" would help to clear up any confusion and help employees to understand and use this newfangled system.
You're focusing very narrowly on the semantics, not the policy. As has been said, "unlimited vacation" is a policy where your exact days aren't tracked, and where the employer trusts their employees to not abuse anything. It's also where the employee trusts their employer won't abuse them by denying vacation.

Focus on the actual policy itself, instead of getting so hung up on a single word in the title of what it's called. You're just being ridiculous by claiming you should be able to take a full year.

Even that you say you had to schedule vacations months in advance is crazy. If I find out I'll have a slow day tomorrow, a day's notice can be fine. If you worked somewhere that you had too much work all the time, for 28 years, you simply worked for a bad company, where a policy like 'unlimited vacation' wouldn't work. My boss(s) will actively stop me from taking on more if I get too much work. Keeping your employees happy is a big part of management, and the trust that comes with giving 'unlimited vacation' policies is part of that. If you went into a workplace like that and tried to take a year off, then six months, etc., you'd just look foolish. If you did that to me, I'd stop you without giving a hard answer and ask you what the point of the 'unlimited vacation' policy was. If you needed your hand held and couldn't be trusted to use that policy responsibly (as is evident by asking for a year off), you're probably not a good fit for the company.

Unlimited vacation won't work with the kind of toxic workplaces that try to just squeeze work out of people, but those are the kind of places you look to quit ASAP anyway. There is no confusion about what an 'unlimited' vacation policy means, outside of people who are intentionally trying to create problems.

Last edited by Lekrii; 04-18-2019 at 05:23 PM..
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Old 04-18-2019, 05:15 PM
 
1,866 posts, read 720,300 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm2k View Post
You'd never think that you'd have to worry about using "all" your unlimited vacation in a given year.

It even sounds incorrect to say.

But having a finite amount of vacation means SOMETHING has to be done with that balance. You use it, and if it's not used, you're cut a check. It must be accounted for in some way.

Unlimited vacation cannot be determined good or bad on those two words alone. This is a very pigeonholed example, but: AT&T Is Screwing Its Most Senior Employees Out of Sick Pay | City Pages

There is nothing preventing a company from doing the same with vacation. Point is, dates can be blacked out at any time, and the employee has no recourse, and cannot collect anything for being denied.

You may be TOLD that an employer has an unlimited vacation policy, but you will likely NOT be allowed to see the stipulations attached before you are hired.
Interesting article.
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Old 04-18-2019, 06:27 PM
 
9,519 posts, read 13,461,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert20170 View Post
He lost me at "discuss"...when and why did that become popular?
Lol its a good thing im a she then
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Old 04-18-2019, 06:48 PM
 
780 posts, read 204,781 times
Reputation: 1134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lekrii View Post
Unlimited vacation won't work with the kind of toxic workplaces that try to just squeeze work out of people, but those are the kind of places you look to quit ASAP anyway. There is no confusion about what an 'unlimited' vacation policy means, outside of people who are intentionally trying to create problems.
Yeah, I don't understand why there'd be any question over this. Seems like an open and shut case to me.
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Old 04-18-2019, 06:59 PM
 
1,866 posts, read 720,300 times
Reputation: 3983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lekrii View Post
You're focusing very narrowly on the semantics, not the policy. As has been said, "unlimited vacation" is a policy where your exact days aren't tracked, and where the employer trusts their employees to not abuse anything. It's also where the employee trusts their employer won't abuse them by denying vacation.

Focus on the actual policy itself, instead of getting so hung up on a single word in the title of what it's called. You're just being ridiculous by claiming you should be able to take a full year.

Even that you say you had to schedule vacations months in advance is crazy. If I find out I'll have a slow day tomorrow, a day's notice can be fine. If you worked somewhere that you had too much work all the time, for 28 years, you simply worked for a bad company, where a policy like 'unlimited vacation' wouldn't work. My boss(s) will actively stop me from taking on more if I get too much work. Keeping your employees happy is a big part of management, and the trust that comes with giving 'unlimited vacation' policies is part of that. If you went into a workplace like that and tried to take a year off, then six months, etc., you'd just look foolish. If you did that to me, I'd stop you without giving a hard answer and ask you what the point of the 'unlimited vacation' policy was. If you needed your hand held and couldn't be trusted to use that policy responsibly (as is evident by asking for a year off), you're probably not a good fit for the company.

Unlimited vacation won't work with the kind of toxic workplaces that try to just squeeze work out of people, but those are the kind of places you look to quit ASAP anyway. There is no confusion about what an 'unlimited' vacation policy means, outside of people who are intentionally trying to create problems.
I am focusing on the single word and not the policy. The policy is fine, but the single word doesn't accurately define it. The word makes it seem like the vacation policy allows for an infinite number of vacation days to be taken. Many people who discuss this are confused by it on this site and other sites where there is discussion about it. A lot of the confusion could be eliminated by changing the name to something more appropriate. There are many people who are confused by this, not just troublemakers.

In answer to questions that employees ask to take a year off, that management is forced to say that "Our policy name of "unlimited vacation" is not really unlimited so you can't take a year off, sorry. Then why call it unlimited? It makes the company look stupid.

I am not trying to create problems and I agree with a lot of what you are saying, however I still disagree with companies that use the "unlimited" in their vacation policy. Again, it is an inappropriate term to use and creates confusion with many people. In my opinion this is a deliberate marketing gimmick to sell something that doesn't exist. Simply using clear business language like "responsible" rather than "unlimited" would solve this problem. If companies still want to use "unlimited" that is their problem. They can take the credibility hit.

As for me, I like straight and direct answers to straight and direct questions. Others may like a nebulous "unlimited" vacation policy. That is their business and everyone chooses to work for who they want to.
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Old 04-19-2019, 04:33 AM
 
Location: Earth, a nice neighborhood in the Milky Way
2,542 posts, read 1,608,860 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusinessManIT View Post
It is a scam. A marketing gimmick with a pretty "unlimited" name to help attract potential employees. It is a wonder that companies don't lose more credibility by having such a misleading and dishonest vacation policy.
It's interesting you say that. A recruiter from a company with an unlimited vacation policy contacted me for an interview. I was pretty doubtful about any company that had such a policy. Couple that with their dogs at work policy, and I politely declined.
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Old 04-19-2019, 07:19 AM
 
2,454 posts, read 699,218 times
Reputation: 3433
Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
I hope this is intended to be sarcasm and not an actual belief that unlimited vacation is supposed to mean getting paid to never work at all.

Inigo Montoya says "you keep using that word, I don't think it means what you think it means"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTRKCXC0JFg

Unlimited means no limits. The minute there are any limits on so-called "unlimited vacation", it is no longer unlimited and thus false advertising. Another word for this is scam.
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Old 04-19-2019, 07:21 AM
 
2,454 posts, read 699,218 times
Reputation: 3433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lekrii View Post
a "unlimited vacation" policy means they treat you like adults and don't need to track your vacation.
So here we have another person who does not know what "unlimited" means. Perhaps an English dictionary is a good investment for you?

Quote:
They expect you to act like adults and not take an inordinate amount while getting your work done. If you're the kind of person who would try to take advantage of it, then you are proving you can't be trusted.
I think someone who lies should not be trusted. When someone says vacation is unlimited and they place limits on it, that's called LYING.

I know, that's hard to understand.

I guess honesty and ethics mean nothing to you.
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Old 04-19-2019, 07:25 AM
 
2,454 posts, read 699,218 times
Reputation: 3433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Quotes A Lot View Post
At my employer, they call it Responsible Time Off. We don't have a limit, but you're supposed to use it in a fashion that doesn't leave the team or clients hanging. That said, I've never had an issue taking time off.
Calling it responsible time off is one way to get around the issue - but how is the policy worded? In addition, how are departing employees treated in terms of vacation payout?
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Old 04-19-2019, 07:26 AM
 
2,454 posts, read 699,218 times
Reputation: 3433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oasiscakes View Post
I currently have unlimited vacation and it's great.. but I agree, depends on the company. I think the average employee takes about 4-5 weeks off at my company.
You don't have unlimited vacation. Are you on your 40 year vacation?
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