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Old 05-05-2019, 10:33 PM
 
44 posts, read 7,902 times
Reputation: 38

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
Actuarial science? Geezus...if an employer sees fit to hire someone they should not be able to choose to not provide insurance to that person because of a pre-existing condition or some risk to the insurer. If they don't want to pay for their insurance then they can hire someone else.
They often do. But it puts older people at a disadvantage. Separate employers and the medical insurance industry completely and then people who are the best fit based on the ability to get the job done will be hired.
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Old 05-06-2019, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Washington state
5,440 posts, read 2,772,101 times
Reputation: 16378
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
Where I live, it's people in their 30s and 40s working in fast food jobs. Sometimes older. They often work two jobs and try to support families on the wages. But it's not something to make a career out of it. The jobs are being automated anyway.
They were saying court reporting was going to be automated back in the early 90s when I was taking classes. Hasn't happened yet.

But saying these jobs are nothing to make a career out of belittles the people working there. You have no idea why people work those jobs. Maybe it's to go back to college, maybe the job is a stepping stone to a higher position. Just maybe those people don't buy into the corporate 80 hr work week that everyone admires so much because it earns people so much money. Maybe some people are working lower paid jobs because they don't want the high blood pressure and the stress a higher paid job brings. Maybe these people want to go home to their families at night instead of bringing the job home with them. Just maybe they have a life outside of work, unlike the way we're all raised to believe in this country.

Not speaking directly to Priscilla, but to the general group right now:

When you belittle the job and you belittle the people who work that job, you're telling everyone those people are unimportant in our society. And because they're unimportant, that makes it easy to put them down and treat them as subhuman, so when someone goes into these places in a bad mood, the workers are seen as justifiable targets for their rage and contempt.

In this country, our contempt for those doesn't end with people who aren't working a job anymore, our contempt is earned even when those people are working but don't make what we consider to be a "successful" salary. That's not good for the people who work low wage jobs, and it certainly isn't good for the mindset of this country. Thinking others are subhuman have had a lot of nasty consequences lately, usually involving hate groups and weapons.
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Old 05-06-2019, 12:49 PM
 
11,160 posts, read 8,567,464 times
Reputation: 28161
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobsell View Post
Premiums for health insurance easily run 10K-20K a year for them. Thanks to the Affordable Care Act (ACA) the "Cadillac tax" hits at 40% of premiums on top of that.

So employers are told by the ACA that they should not hire older workers because they'll be punished by higher taxes.

ACA = legalized age discrimination.
Makes no sense. Are you saying an insurer like United Health is charging an employer like Microsoft different rates based on the age of the employees? How would they do that when they don't know who will sign up for coverage?
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Old 05-06-2019, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
8,717 posts, read 3,091,453 times
Reputation: 13089
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
Makes no sense. Are you saying an insurer like United Health is charging an employer like Microsoft different rates based on the age of the employees? How would they do that when they don't know who will sign up for coverage?
Your repeated ignorance on this point is astonishing.

No employer plan I've ever seen or heard of has some sort of blanket cost or unit rate basis. It always varies with age and gender. You make it sound like that's some impossibly complicated system.
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Old 05-06-2019, 03:22 PM
 
2,078 posts, read 606,160 times
Reputation: 2961
How do they have 250k jobs with the automated kiosks?
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Old 05-06-2019, 04:21 PM
 
780 posts, read 205,442 times
Reputation: 1134
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
Makes no sense. Are you saying an insurer like United Health is charging an employer like Microsoft different rates based on the age of the employees? How would they do that when they don't know who will sign up for coverage?
To some extent, yes. This is how insurance works. If you have a riskier insurance pool, meaning you have certain demographics that traditionally cost more (seniors, females under 40, the chronically ill, etc.) then your carrier will ensure that that risk is covered. And by that, I mean that the employer will usually pay a higher premium. The CFOs and HR directors who are involved in these talks with their insurance carriers are generally well aware of what types of things impact their premiums.
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Old 05-06-2019, 04:22 PM
 
780 posts, read 205,442 times
Reputation: 1134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quietude View Post
Your repeated ignorance on this point is astonishing.

No employer plan I've ever seen or heard of has some sort of blanket cost or unit rate basis. It always varies with age and gender. You make it sound like that's some impossibly complicated system.
Insurance is rather complicated, and you'd be surprised by how many CFOs and HR directors are ignorant as to how it works and what things impact their premiums.
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Old 05-06-2019, 06:00 PM
 
104 posts, read 36,808 times
Reputation: 251
I am a stay at home, middle aged 40 something year old mother of 2 teenagers. To get out of the house a few days a week I got a job at a big box corporate petstore. I was surprised they hired me because everyone else was around 18-30 years old. I was one of their best workers and was constantly offered assistant management positions because they liked my work ethics, reliability and dedication. I always turned down those promotions because I did not want to take on that much responsibility for a lousy $14 an hour. It was not worth it to me and I was happy with my little part time stint just the way it was.

The company got a brand new CEO and one day the older store manager and all the middle aged assistant managers that I worked with for 6 years all got fired one by one. Apparently corporate started firing all the older, middle aged store managers at all the branches near me over even the slightest little infraction. They then started hiring young 18-25 year old store managers so they could pay them much lower starting salaries. They saved millions of dollars doing this but all the branches ended up losing much more money than that by losing a reliable, experienced and responsible team members.

I'll never forget what the new 24 year old store manager said to me one day. She was one of those types that protested in the streets for equal rights for everyone and was a self proclaimed "human rights activist". We needed to hire more people because we were seriously understaffed. One day out of the blue she told me, "I don't mean to sound ageist, but I would never hire anyone over 25". "Older people are too stubborn and set in their ways so I will never hire them". "You are lucky you were already here before I got here even though you are an awesome worker". "I like younger people who never had a job before so I can mold their fresh, young minds into my little prodigies who will do all of my bidding and do all of my work for me so I don't have to do it". I was floored by that and was so disgusted that I quit a week later.

Shortly after that she had a staff of young kids who were always stoned out of their minds on pot, called out sick every other day and were too bothered to look up from their cell phones to even work. I heard almost 7 months later the store is doing so bad that they don't even have enough staff to put stock on the shelves and the place is filthy because the newer, younger staff she hired is too lazy to work. I guess that manager needs to take a hint from McDonalds and hire a bunch of old farts like me again
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Old 05-06-2019, 07:24 PM
 
1,871 posts, read 723,005 times
Reputation: 3994
Quote:
Originally Posted by dk1111 View Post
I am a stay at home, middle aged 40 something year old mother of 2 teenagers. To get out of the house a few days a week I got a job at a big box corporate petstore. I was surprised they hired me because everyone else was around 18-30 years old. I was one of their best workers and was constantly offered assistant management positions because they liked my work ethics, reliability and dedication. I always turned down those promotions because I did not want to take on that much responsibility for a lousy $14 an hour. It was not worth it to me and I was happy with my little part time stint just the way it was.

The company got a brand new CEO and one day the older store manager and all the middle aged assistant managers that I worked with for 6 years all got fired one by one. Apparently corporate started firing all the older, middle aged store managers at all the branches near me over even the slightest little infraction. They then started hiring young 18-25 year old store managers so they could pay them much lower starting salaries. They saved millions of dollars doing this but all the branches ended up losing much more money than that by losing a reliable, experienced and responsible team members.

I'll never forget what the new 24 year old store manager said to me one day. She was one of those types that protested in the streets for equal rights for everyone and was a self proclaimed "human rights activist". We needed to hire more people because we were seriously understaffed. One day out of the blue she told me, "I don't mean to sound ageist, but I would never hire anyone over 25". "Older people are too stubborn and set in their ways so I will never hire them". "You are lucky you were already here before I got here even though you are an awesome worker". "I like younger people who never had a job before so I can mold their fresh, young minds into my little prodigies who will do all of my bidding and do all of my work for me so I don't have to do it". I was floored by that and was so disgusted that I quit a week later.

Shortly after that she had a staff of young kids who were always stoned out of their minds on pot, called out sick every other day and were too bothered to look up from their cell phones to even work. I heard almost 7 months later the store is doing so bad that they don't even have enough staff to put stock on the shelves and the place is filthy because the newer, younger staff she hired is too lazy to work. I guess that manager needs to take a hint from McDonalds and hire a bunch of old farts like me again
Yup, short term labor cost savings that provided for long term problems down the road. Yes, fresh, cheaply paid minds that can be molded and exploited - but whenever those minds bother to come in to work, and when they do whenever you can get them off their phones to mold them. Absolutely laughable. Almost good enough for a Three Stooges episode.
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Old 05-07-2019, 08:04 AM
 
Location: USA
6,226 posts, read 5,370,690 times
Reputation: 10643
Quote:
Originally Posted by dk1111 View Post
I am a stay at home, middle aged 40 something year old mother of 2 teenagers. To get out of the house a few days a week I got a job at a big box corporate petstore. I was surprised they hired me because everyone else was around 18-30 years old. I was one of their best workers and was constantly offered assistant management positions because they liked my work ethics, reliability and dedication. I always turned down those promotions because I did not want to take on that much responsibility for a lousy $14 an hour. It was not worth it to me and I was happy with my little part time stint just the way it was.

The company got a brand new CEO and one day the older store manager and all the middle aged assistant managers that I worked with for 6 years all got fired one by one. Apparently corporate started firing all the older, middle aged store managers at all the branches near me over even the slightest little infraction. They then started hiring young 18-25 year old store managers so they could pay them much lower starting salaries. They saved millions of dollars doing this but all the branches ended up losing much more money than that by losing a reliable, experienced and responsible team members.

I'll never forget what the new 24 year old store manager said to me one day. She was one of those types that protested in the streets for equal rights for everyone and was a self proclaimed "human rights activist". We needed to hire more people because we were seriously understaffed. One day out of the blue she told me, "I don't mean to sound ageist, but I would never hire anyone over 25". "Older people are too stubborn and set in their ways so I will never hire them". "You are lucky you were already here before I got here even though you are an awesome worker". "I like younger people who never had a job before so I can mold their fresh, young minds into my little prodigies who will do all of my bidding and do all of my work for me so I don't have to do it". I was floored by that and was so disgusted that I quit a week later.

Shortly after that she had a staff of young kids who were always stoned out of their minds on pot, called out sick every other day and were too bothered to look up from their cell phones to even work. I heard almost 7 months later the store is doing so bad that they don't even have enough staff to put stock on the shelves and the place is filthy because the newer, younger staff she hired is too lazy to work. I guess that manager needs to take a hint from McDonalds and hire a bunch of old farts like me again
Super common, at least in the non-union supermarkets I worked in. The trend was to fire all the career full time employees and replace them with a revolving door of part timers. The managers became much younger, were paid a lower salary than their predecessors, and began requiring a college degree. The managers were also a revolving door, although a bit less than the hourly employees.


It became apparent to me the company would rather have lousy employees who call out and no show, rather than a full timer with benefits.
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