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Old 05-23-2019, 08:46 AM
 
689 posts, read 249,768 times
Reputation: 1815

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Quote:
Originally Posted by DorianRo View Post
yea but theres no point in hoping for company to change. Once the rot sets in, that is it. Ive seen good companies turn poor but never seen the opposite happen.

Once the rot sets in, you may as well sell the company. As far as job hopping goes to escape rotten work cultures, meh. It may pay off and youíll luck out. You may just end up in another dysfunctional mismanaged hole. And there are farrr more of those than quality employers now

Itís also foolish IMO to job hop for equal or lesser pay. Money needs to be a factor when making a decisions as well and employers have become cheaper and greedier with each year that passes.
So true. Totally agreed.
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Old 05-23-2019, 10:19 AM
 
3,943 posts, read 3,259,672 times
Reputation: 11298
I once worked with a guy who had a great sense of humor when it came to the job--and all the BS that jobs are so well known for. We worked together at a few different places, none were efficient, nor were they owned by people who could change even if they wanted to. We would talk about the daily crap that usually forced us out of previous jobs, he would say, in a most naive voice, "man we should just quit and find a GOOD JOB." Then we'd laugh and go about the day.

There are very few places to work that offer decent money AND a decent environment. Trying to job hop your way into that imaginary world of job satisfaction can become an exhausting process, but, one which ultimately thickens one's hide to the extent that you no longer suffer from that delusional notion of finding, "the right place." We primarily go to work in order to make money, and we become troubled when we try to squeeze our notions of job satisfaction in between that need for money and the prevailing reality of most companies.
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Old 05-23-2019, 10:34 AM
 
1,547 posts, read 400,415 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopelesscause View Post
Iíve worked for a large insurance company as a sales manager for a little over 2 years now. Iíve stayed busy and have done my best to do a good job. But lately, Iíve begun to feel much malaise and frustration with the companyís incompetence. This has showed itself in terms of proposing over the top member benefits to horrible software programs that repeat themselves year after year. Iíve invested much time in trying to build new relationships with agents to sell our products, but seem to always lose them when the companyís benefits/services blow up in their face of their customers. I now have a ďF*ck itĒ attitude that I will fail or not be my BEST in my customerís eyes-depressing thought. Anyone else feel this way?
Update your resume, gather your best references (NOT your supervisor) and find a better job with their competition. Hopefully you are bring your clients with you.

If it is as bad as you say, and there is nothing you can do to change it, which sounds like the case with it being so widespread you don't have any choice than to find a job elsewhere.
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Old 05-23-2019, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Washington state
5,436 posts, read 2,759,563 times
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Nothing like working for a great, well established business that deliberately makes some policy changes and starts sliding downhill.

I worked for two of those: Kinko's and Bank of America. Both great places to work for in the beginning and then turning into places where you wonder why anyone would want to work for them today.

Very few businesses will try to change back around when they start going downhill. If you're working for a business that's making stupid decisions and policy changes that upset the employees and customers, bring in nitwit management, and cause long time employees to hit the road, it's time to bail. Those companies might stabilize eventually, but they'll be companies whose bottom line is the almighty dollar and they'll be a pain in the patootie to work for in the future.
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Old 05-23-2019, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
8,591 posts, read 3,019,935 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser View Post
Nothing like working for a great, well established business that deliberately makes some policy changes and starts sliding downhill.

I worked for two of those: Kinko's and Bank of America. Both great places to work for in the beginning and then turning into places where you wonder why anyone would want to work for them today.
Hmm. Worked for BofA in the pre-national days and can't say it was a great place to work. Nice enough, yes, and even some status in those days, and very highly developed branch and HR policies... but perfused with that kind of grim flag-waving substitute for any real concern for its employees. Endless morale and reward programs with posters and prizes and doo-dads, but delivered like prison lectures. And the pay was about 20% below other, smaller banks.

I've heard it maintained that until it merged/was acquired by NationsBank and went national, and that working there after that truly sucked big wet rocks.


Never worked for Kinko's, but as a creative/production/publication type, I spent way too much time watching three or four employees rush around looking busy, without seeming to do very much and studiously ignoring any customers at the counter. Rush over here: pick up a paper and look at it. Rush back over here: carefully check a machine setting. Zip over there: restack three boxes. Zoom to a far corner: count a shelf of supplies. I called it "the Kinko Shuffle."
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Old 05-23-2019, 01:18 PM
 
1,678 posts, read 550,083 times
Reputation: 3560
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnOrdinaryCitizen View Post
You have some valid points. I agree with you on the second paragraph.

However, when a company becomes bad, with so many incompetent employees, it is because of the management. People in the management manage, lead and create the culture of the company. The employees follow. When they lead with bullying attitude and play favoritism, the employees will learn that attitude from them, the good ones will be upset and hate the management, and lots of employees will hate each other. The favorite ones don't have to work so hard. The good ones will withdraw.

About jumping job, if the job market were good, and if it were so easy to find job somewhere else, nobody would need to be told to jump job. Everybody would quit anytime. When the job market is not good, and the way most of the management running the corporate world now, if you want to jump job, you may as well as jump from the frying pan to the burning stove. Yes there are small percentages of good companies out there, and there are small percentages of people who are capable or are lucky to get a better job with higher pay and/or to find a better work environment than their current workplace.

When you are in your 20s, 30s, it's much easier to jump job. When you are 50 and up, it's not so easy.

Anyway, there are good and bad, competent and incompetent old and young, long time and new employees in every company.

The point is when employers hire leaders, managers and employees, they need to know how to hire the good ones, especially the ones in the management who know how to lead employees with example in a good way to build the teams to be good, to bring the company up, not to tear the teams and bring the company down.
I agree that companies become bad because of poor leadership (and I'd argue it's due to poor leadership, not necessarily poor management), but again, only the bad employees stay on and put up with that, in my opinion.

There are a lot of good companies, and there are a lot of really good bosses within companies. You find that out by networking and getting to know the people you'd work for before even applying. The best employees have fairly easy times moving, which is why they are intolerant of BS. I struggle to see high quality employees who put up with BS for longer than 2-3 years.

It's obviously not easy to find a new job, but the better employees are looking, and looking how to improve themselves so that they are more attractive to that next job. The amount of people who complain about their jobs, but take no steps to improve, change, or find something new is surprising. No one will ever find a better job by not looking.
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Old 05-23-2019, 10:01 PM
 
Location: Washington state
5,436 posts, read 2,759,563 times
Reputation: 16345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quietude View Post
Hmm. Worked for BofA in the pre-national days and can't say it was a great place to work. Nice enough, yes, and even some status in those days, and very highly developed branch and HR policies... but perfused with that kind of grim flag-waving substitute for any real concern for its employees. Endless morale and reward programs with posters and prizes and doo-dads, but delivered like prison lectures. And the pay was about 20% below other, smaller banks.

I've heard it maintained that until it merged/was acquired by NationsBank and went national, and that working there after that truly sucked big wet rocks.


Never worked for Kinko's, but as a creative/production/publication type, I spent way too much time watching three or four employees rush around looking busy, without seeming to do very much and studiously ignoring any customers at the counter. Rush over here: pick up a paper and look at it. Rush back over here: carefully check a machine setting. Zip over there: restack three boxes. Zoom to a far corner: count a shelf of supplies. I called it "the Kinko Shuffle."
I worked for BofA in the 70s and 80s. This was prior to having to upsell umpteen dollars worth of useless services no customer ever wanted and just before finding out tellers were being cut in hours and pay so the CEO could have his million dollar salary and bonuses.

Kinko's was fine until they changed gears around 2004 or so and the founder decided he didn't like the direction the company was going in (neither did anyone else) and bailed with his stock. I wouldn't care to work for them today.
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