U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Work and Employment
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-11-2019, 01:48 PM
 
12,257 posts, read 18,390,529 times
Reputation: 19079

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
This is what the "rich dad/poor dad" economics 101 types just can't get through their thick skulls.

Their theoretical banana stand model doesn't make sense in the real world, yet they think everyone else who says it is too simplistic are the stupid ones.
Even though the previous poster said absolutely nothing of substance. It's worse than theoretical, it's opinionated and biased. It's the tired old "big business is evil" story.

Who says there is not sufficient competition? There is no perfect economic model, we know that. That's why we have anti-trust and competition laws in the US, that's why we have the Federal Trade Commission, that's why we have the Sherman Act, that's why ATT was broken up into "baby bells". That's why the government is looking closly at Amazon, Google, Facebook, and Apple. Stay tuned for that. "Finance class insulated from their decisions" is a meaningless statement. What does the even mean?

Anyways it's not even associated with the topic, rest assured these large companies have vacation plans. I don't have any data but I would guess that the 10% of private companies that don't have paid vacation plans are small businesses with only a few employees. This, putting in place a law requiring paid vacation wouldn't hurt these big business, as it's already in place. You would hurt these struggling small businesses. Ironically, it would hurt competition and innovation, not help it, as these start-up small business would be discouraged from operating, or fail to operate profitably and go out of business. That's not theoretical, that's common sense. That business could very well be the next Apple.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-11-2019, 01:52 PM
 
12,257 posts, read 18,390,529 times
Reputation: 19079
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishbrains View Post
So true. Like it or not, our economy is somewhat regulated, with the requirement that companies follow environmental, taxation, safety and other regulations. Having a federally mandated leave law would ensure a level playing field for all companies, rather than a race to the bottom.

I know a segment of posters on this forum are all in favor of corporate rights, but we live in a country of people, and I think it reasonable to have laws that protect people’s rights too.
This is not about corporate rights at all. You think all companies are run by corporations? We've already established that 90% of businesses give paid vacation time. Corporations, in order to attract the best employees, have paid vacation plans. No issue there.

As I indicated in the previous post, you would be hurting small businesses. Businesses run by people - your neighbor, the guy down the street. As you said - you have to protect peoples rights as well. How is forcing your neighbor to pay it's employee for time off protecting his right?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 01:53 PM
 
172 posts, read 70,165 times
Reputation: 232
All other employers I've worked for had a so called PTO system which gets rave reviews from HR specialists nationwide and has tons of support.
I am very confused as to why and the only explanation of this phenomena that I have is that people are naive if not ...misinformed, to put it mildly.
This is how it worked everywhere I've worked.
Each 2 week pay period you get 0.8 days towards your PTO balance.
PTO included vacation, sick days and holidays.
So, of you are to multiply 26 pay periods in a year by 0.8 you get 20.8 days per year for EVERYTHING.
Let's say you got hired right before Thanksgiving. You haven't yet accumulated PTO, but this is a mandatory company holiday, as well as Christmas and New Years Day, and you have to take it. So what the company did is they allowed you to take that holiday as a "credit", which meant you had a negative PTO balance. By the time you've gained a day or two - Christmas rolled around.
And if you or your kids got sick and you needed to take a day meant you were not taking even a three day vacation in the summer because you didn't have the days! The first two years at a new company I basically worked with no vacation whatsoever. You couldn't take sick days on "credit". Only mandatory holidays.
But what gets me is that people LOVE this system. They LOVE being able to add their so called sick days (which come out of the same PTO bank as everything else) to their real vacation! HR people LOVE the system because people don't take sick days! Yeah, they come to work sick. This is a never ending vicious cycle. I hated the system, but it is gaining more ground.
It is loved by single people, those who have no kids or workaholics.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Philly
1,033 posts, read 723,783 times
Reputation: 2553
This article makes me SO glad that I work for an employer that offers unlimited PTO, paid holidays, early Fridays, and the entire last week of the year off. I'm 23 and have been working with my company for what will be 7 months next month, yet my boss has never had any qualms about approving my (three) requested days off. On top of this, I still make more in salary and benefits than your average 23 year old!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 03:15 PM
 
703 posts, read 433,826 times
Reputation: 720
I'm just going to post one of the comments from the article, as it articulates my opinion perfectly. Credit goes to Yahoo user "Calvin."


Quote:
This is not a "paid vacation" chart. It's a chart of countries where workers are too stupid/lazy to negotiate vacation days so they rely on a socialist government to tell them how many days they are "allowed" compared to a free society where workers are free to accept/reject a job offer based on how many vacation days they will earn.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 03:28 PM
 
9,519 posts, read 13,433,244 times
Reputation: 5692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lekrii View Post
So negotiate for more vacation time when applying for jobs.
And watch them then give the job to someone else …
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Australia
889 posts, read 325,888 times
Reputation: 1639
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers Girl View Post
I'm just going to post one of the comments from the article, as it articulates my opinion perfectly. Credit goes to Yahoo user "Calvin."
Is the US the only non socialist country in the world then?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 03:44 PM
 
172 posts, read 70,165 times
Reputation: 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyers Girl View Post
I'm just going to post one of the comments from the article, as it articulates my opinion perfectly. Credit goes to Yahoo user "Calvin."
Workers are not free to accept or reject or even choose anything. Good jobs are very few and far in between, and the line of those wanting them is very long. Employers know that and offer peanuts when it comes to vacation and sick time. This is also the reason why wages have been stagnant for 15 or so years now. I am not talking about minimum wage. I am talking about your average professional wage. Engineers and many other professionals make the same they did 15 years ago, on average.
No Calvin, you can't choose anything. You take what you are given. That's modern day slavery.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Central IL
15,201 posts, read 8,504,300 times
Reputation: 35567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
You see the dichotomy in statistics, you can change the rules of statistics to fit your argument. In this case - statistic includes part time workers, maybe they only work 1 day a week, maybe they only started a month ago. Not a fake statistics, it's just a misleading calculation, and portrayed in a way to create fake news.

Although not protected by law, 90% of private sector workers get paid time off in the US as you said, with the average being 16 paid days vacation and holiday a year. Not at European standards but hardly as described by the other statistic. You work for one of the few employees that don't pay for vacation? Solution is easy - find another job. As for me, I get some 5 weeks of vacation a year and an additonal 11 holidays. How did I get this? I paid my dues and made the correct life choices.
The answer of getting another job is CLEAR, it is certainly not EASY for most people. People with kids, dual income families, those in more rural areas where a major move would be necessary to find good options have a much tougher time of it. No, not impossible but glib answers such as this don't reflect reality. Are you above empathy?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2019, 05:11 PM
 
23 posts, read 5,402 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
But then the article says that 90 percent of American workers get paid vacation and holiday time. Every private company I have ever worked for, the past two decades, gave the workers paid vacation and holiday time. So what's the problem? Not guaranteeing something on paper doesn't mean it isn't going to happen.

Sure, only 40% of part timers may get such benefits, but they are part timers, not full time.

I currently get two weeks of paid time off, but that goes up after you serve a number of years, to an eventual max of five weeks. We also get paid holidays even if we don't work that day, and every year we also get the last week of December off, paid, as a company wide freebie holiday.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-pa...162316534.html
I've been puzzled by this "no vaca time for US workers" meme, too. Small businesses may be hard-pressed to provide vacation time, but I haven't run into people, who either aren't allotted time off, or feel like they have to work through the year without taking their vacation time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Work and Employment
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top