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Old 06-21-2019, 11:06 AM
 
11,118 posts, read 8,523,617 times
Reputation: 28059

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gus2 View Post
tnff, thanks for your response. I do not doubt that there are people who pass the first go-round and still don't have the required qualifications. However, and maybe I'm just kidding myself, is that still the case if I get this response?
Why do you believe this? Are the qualifications so unique that only you and a handful of people are truly qualified?

Can you post the requested qualifications?
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Old 06-21-2019, 11:17 AM
 
600 posts, read 200,314 times
Reputation: 1823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Navyshow View Post
Why don't you apply as a Federal Contractor for the agencies and locations you are interested in. Go to Indeed or Clearance Jobs and plug in the agency, location and job type. Once you gain the experience in the agency and build a reputation as a contractor, you can use that experience to apply for the federal openings as they become available in that agency.
I've been a fed contractor for 17 years. But I can still only apply to the jobs that are open to the public, which drastically reduce the number of opportunities while increasing the competition. It's tough to get a foot in the door, especially for mid-level folks.

MLSfan, you're right, I should have been more intentional with my vocabulary when I used the word "qualified." That said, I think we're also talking about 2 different things. If they deem you unqualified for the position, they will tell you:
Quote:
Application disqualified for lack of experience
If they deem you qualified but not one of the MOST qualified, they will tell you:
Quote:
Sorry, you were not among the best qualified candidates and have not been referred for consideration.
So... there's something other than qualifications going on here. Could be in large part just a numbers game, maybe.
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Old 06-21-2019, 11:30 AM
 
600 posts, read 200,314 times
Reputation: 1823
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
Why do you believe this? Are the qualifications so unique that only you and a handful of people are truly qualified?

Can you post the requested qualifications?
I think you misunderstood. I was agreeing that someone may check the initial boxes but not be a great fit for the position during the later culling phases, myself included.

Again, I could post the qualifications, but it's too easy to google for my comfort level. No, I am not a special unicorn, but I am a medium fish in a teeny tiny pond. But say, for instance, you had supported a project since its inception, presented and published work on it on behalf of the client for more than a dozen years, and also have a particular skill set that they have relied upon you in the past and now would like to have in-house. I know the data, the players, and the history better than the client, and they would be the first to tell you that. So, yeah, I was pretty disappointed not to make the cut on that one.

Another question for those in-the-know: How much does the "who you know" thing factor in to federal jobs? I am positive I could get great recommendations from the feds I would be working with, but maybe the federal system is so automated and stringent that it wouldn't matter? I can't say anything anyway (Hi client! I want to stop working on your project here so that I can work on it there! Awkward!), but I'm curious.
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Old 06-21-2019, 11:41 AM
 
Location: on the wind
7,072 posts, read 2,899,892 times
Reputation: 23939
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLSFan View Post

plus realistically, about 30% of feds are vets, that means 7 out of 10 aren't vets. but every time a fed hiring post comes up, you'd think 100% of the jobs are filled by vets because everyone claims they lost the job due to vet points.
This. It is one of those convenient, nebulous, I'm-the-victim excuses for not getting hired. I've worked for civilian federal agencies for over 35 years and met few people who's vet status made the difference in landing their jobs. They qualified without it. I hired seasonal, term, and a couple of permanent employees. None of them were knocked off an eligible's list by vets with preference. Of course, the nature of the work plays into that. For just about all of the vacancy job descriptions I dealt with there were few if any vets who met the basic KSAs, or who could walk in and perform the work. If one could, fantastic. I'd have no problem hiring them. I think it happened once.
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Old 06-21-2019, 11:54 AM
 
Location: on the wind
7,072 posts, read 2,899,892 times
Reputation: 23939
Quote:
Originally Posted by gus2 View Post
So... there's something other than qualifications going on here. Could be in large part just a numbers game, maybe.
Yes, sorry to say this is it. I don't think people realize just how much competition exists out there. Especially when you consider the job's other aspects like location. For places people want to or decide they can afford to live competition will be that much more of a factor. Whenever I scan through C-D's relocation forums or job seeker classifieds you'd be amazed at what people insist they can't manage without.
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Old 06-21-2019, 12:19 PM
 
600 posts, read 200,314 times
Reputation: 1823
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnassia View Post
This. It is one of those convenient, nebulous, I'm-the-victim excuses for not getting hired. I've worked for civilian federal agencies for over 35 years and met few people who's vet status made the difference in landing their jobs. They qualified without it. I hired seasonal, term, and a couple of permanent employees. None of them were knocked off an eligible's list by vets with preference. Of course, the nature of the work plays into that. For just about all of the vacancy job descriptions I dealt with there were few if any vets who met the basic KSAs, or who could walk in and perform the work. If one could, fantastic. I'd have no problem hiring them. I think it happened once.
I agree... it's not just the vets. Nor is it any other group that has special hiring preferences. We're not all job-blocked by some massive American Indian population or tons of disabled people applying to all of these jobs. And heck, honestly, I support preferential hiring. My guess is that most of these slots are just picked up by folks who currently or previously were federal employees, but I could be totally wrong.

Quote:
Not Referred- You are not within reach for consideration due to a qualified preference or priority eligible being referred.
Yeah, I am using that as my victim excuse. Well, for not getting an interview... I still could have totally tanked that on my own!

I'm just butthurt that I didn't get my dream job. And I worry that if I can't manage to snag a job that was basically custom-made for me, I have zero chance of getting anything. But if it's a numbers game, maybe our number will come up if we play long enough?
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Old 06-21-2019, 12:30 PM
 
10,058 posts, read 4,648,803 times
Reputation: 15280
Quote:
Originally Posted by gus2 View Post
I'm just butthurt that I didn't get my dream job. And I worry that if I can't manage to snag a job that was basically custom-made for me, I have zero chance of getting anything. But if it's a numbers game, maybe our number will come up if we play long enough?
That isn't how job searching works. There is no queue that you wait in for your turn at the job. Fed jobs don't work that way either

What happens is people eventually get smart and seek out advice then adjust their application to get further until they get the job. Or they keep doing the same thing then blame something for not getting the job.

Your custom made job wasn't for you :/
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Old 06-21-2019, 12:58 PM
 
600 posts, read 200,314 times
Reputation: 1823
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLSFan View Post
That isn't how job searching works. There is no queue that you wait in for your turn at the job. Fed jobs don't work that way either

What happens is people eventually get smart and seek out advice then adjust their application to get further until they get the job. Or they keep doing the same thing then blame something for not getting the job.

Your custom made job wasn't for you :/
I'm clinging to the last tiniest bit of optimism here!! Stop inserting real life!!

Plus, I'm unclear how to adjust my application to become part of a preferred/priority class?
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Old 06-21-2019, 01:56 PM
 
1,410 posts, read 794,770 times
Reputation: 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Navyshow View Post
Why don't you apply as a Federal Contractor for the agencies and locations you are interested in. Go to Indeed or Clearance Jobs and plug in the agency, location and job type. Once you gain the experience in the agency and build a reputation as a contractor, you can use that experience to apply for the federal openings as they become available in that agency.

Not sure who you're talking to. I've been a federal contractor for many years but it doesn't help you get a federal job. (any more than other work experience).
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Old 06-21-2019, 02:08 PM
 
Location: Eureka CA
8,239 posts, read 11,102,038 times
Reputation: 12552
As sluggish as the Trump administration has been about filling jobs, you should probably not expect any improvement until 2021. That doesn't mean you shouldn't continue trying to get on lists. Good luck.
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