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Old 08-06-2014, 06:27 AM
 
Location: Fortaleza, Brazil
2,351 posts, read 3,813,409 times
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If you want to know which countries are the happiest, there is only one methodology that makes sense: ASKING people if they are happy or not.

Happiness is SUBJECTIVE, and only people can tell if they FEEL happy about their lives or not.

So, the only way to know if a country is happy or not, is to ASK the population.

You need to ask people a very simple question: ARE YOU HAPPY ABOUT YOUR LIFE?

The countries were a higher percent of the population answer: "YES, I am happy about MY life", are the happiest ones.

Simple like that. No need for complicated methodologies.


(of course this metholodogy can not be applied for North Korea, for obvious reasons)
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Old 08-06-2014, 06:41 AM
 
Location: Iowa, Heartland of Murica
3,437 posts, read 4,894,242 times
Reputation: 3372
Quote:
Originally Posted by MalaMan View Post
If you want to know which countries are the happiest, there is only one methodology that makes sense: ASKING people if they are happy
Sorry but that is not effective. Germans have one of the best societies in the world, most Germans will say they are not happy simply because it is cultural. They always see room for improvement and they are critical and self-loathing to a certain degree.

Most people in Brazil may say they are "happy" superficially but as they say ignorance is bliss. If you dont know anything better, you probably think you are "happy"
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Old 08-06-2014, 06:45 AM
 
Location: Fortaleza, Brazil
2,351 posts, read 3,813,409 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Repubocrat View Post
Sorry but that is not effective. Germans have one of the best societies in the world, most Germans will say they are not happy simply because it is cultural. They always see room for improvement.

Most people in Brazil may say they are "happy" but as they say ignorance is bliss. If you dont know anything better, you probably think you are "happy"

It doesn't matter how you THINK that Germans SHOULD feel happy about their lives.

It REALLY doesn't matter, if they don't FEEL like that.


Brazilians are not "ignorant", Brazilians watch American movies showing the "American way of life" every day on TV, and have access to the internet and social networks. I guess you think Brazilians should not feel happy about THEIR OWN PERSONAL LIVES, right? Too bad for you that the huge majority of Brazilian DO FEEL happy about their own personal lives.

And that is ALL that matters.
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Old 08-06-2014, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,524 posts, read 1,845,458 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Repubocrat View Post
Sorry but that is not effective. Germans have one of the best societies in the world, most Germans will say they are not happy simply because it is cultural. They always see room for improvement and they are critical and self-loathing to a certain degree.
In other words they aren't happy. It's like a girl who always thinks she too fat, or not pretty enough, she isn't happy, regardless of what others think she should feel. If Germans are always self-loathing then they aren't happy. Self-loathing is the opposite of happiness. There are many happy Germans and others, but a disproportionate number people from that region, plus Scandinavia and Eastern Europe come across as quite unhappy and depressed. We really have to question what creates the "best societies". Is it guaranteed material wealth? Does it come from feeling loved? Cultural rules like the Jante Law make me sad just looking at them:

The ten rules state:
  1. You're not to think you are anything special.
  2. You're not to think you are as good as we are.
  3. You're not to think you are smarter than we are.
  4. You're not to convince yourself that you are better than we are.
  5. You're not to think you know more than we do.
  6. You're not to think you are more important than we are.
  7. You're not to think you are good at anything.
  8. You're not to laugh at us.
  9. You're not to think anyone cares about you.
  10. You're not to think you can teach us anything.

That has to be the most depressing lifestyle I've ever heard of. Perhaps it produces a robotic population that follows all the rules, but that does not equal happiness. In my honest opinion that list looks like a list of the most depressing countries. Based on suicide rates the happiest countries are places like Jamaica, Peru, Nepal, and the Bahamas. Is it possible that happiness comes from within rather than from guaranteed material things?
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Old 08-06-2014, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Finland
23,062 posts, read 13,758,014 times
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You're quoting the Jante's Law to depict the Scandinavian societies in 2014? Seriously? You got to be kidding me.
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Old 08-06-2014, 08:58 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,524 posts, read 1,845,458 times
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Funny, when I was posting that I knew "Ariete" would immediately disagree because I didn't agree with the utopian Nordic vision that sociologists are always presenting. It is undeniable that Jante Law is a pillar of Scandinavian society, just as the opposite principles work in American society, and one can easily see this at work in Scandinavian societies. However you want to frame it, a disproportionate percentage of the northern (and eastern) European populace are constantly miserable like "dunno what to put here" was saying. So many miserable people, regardless of what material items they have. People who are cold, unfriendly, and angry about life despite the fact that they live in a Nordic "utopia". Not bad people or amoral, but just disproportionately depressed and irritable.

Places like Europe and North America are filled with people who are obsessed with grabbing wealth, making new technology, and "being someone", but never achieve what they really want which is happiness. Unfortunately that does not come from having a guaranteed material wealth. People who are fabulously wealthy commit the ultimate act of unhappiness: suicide. So do famous people who are loved around the world. Regular farmers kill themselves, and regular office workers kill themselves when their wives leave them. People are unhappy over a variety of things and each case is unique. There are so many factors that go into happiness and to say that the blonde Nordic countries are the happiest in the world because CNN decided so is ridiculous. I guarantee that if CNN said the US was the happiest country in the world you and the other Europeans who are constantly posting would be up in arms. These "studies" are always Eurocentric and focusing on how Europeans or Americans or Australians are the best at everything, but never consider the different worldview that other cultures have. It is narrow minded and bigoted. Travel to the Bahamas and then go to Sweden. The Bahamians are on average happier. Less likely to hate themselves or the guy next to them, less likely to express anger over material things, and less likely to kill themselves. But of course since they don't live in a Eurocentric "utopia" they can't possibly be the happiest.
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Old 08-06-2014, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Loidis
21,753 posts, read 18,957,537 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
You're quoting the Jante's Law to depict the Scandinavian societies in 2014? Seriously? You got to be kidding me.
Well, obviously the person in question is annoyed that the US did not score as well as he would like, so must try and belittle the top countries by using something like Jante's Law.

But either way, trying to measure happiness is silly. It is not something that is objective. Doesn't mean life in any particular country is better or worse. If people in Mexico are happier than people in the UK, then it clearly has nothing to do with which countries are the safest or most developed. People here will spend their entire life complaining about their train being late or the NHS being crap, even if they have it better than most (and they would probably kill the person who privatises it ).
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Old 08-06-2014, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Oslo, NO
4,411 posts, read 4,562,567 times
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I like the Jante Law. It serves a function in our society. Only dumb and talentless people will refer to this 'law'. Talented people are always respected.
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Old 08-06-2014, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Fortaleza, Brazil
2,351 posts, read 3,813,409 times
Reputation: 1448
Well, we should not judge other societies.

But the fact is that in some societies, more people feel happy about their own personal lives, while in other societies, less people feel happy about their own personal lives.

And I think that is the only way we can measure which countries are "the happiest": by the percent of the population that feels happy about their own personal lives.

(of course we can't get an accurate picture of that in fierce dictatorships like North Korea)
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Old 08-06-2014, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Finland
23,062 posts, read 13,758,014 times
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Well, today the Janteloven hasn't got much space. There was a basis for it yesterday, due to the harsh climate people had to stick together, and the solid community only could defy the winter. In any case, Denmark, Sweden (with Finland) and Norway are the oldest countries in the world that have encouraged free will and thought. The literacy rate of Sweden and Finland was 80% when in Italy and Spain it was 20% and in Russia 10% in the beginning of the 19th century. And Sweden, Norway and Finland NEVER adopted serfdom, it was actually banned since the mid 14th century.

The Nordic countries have always cherished individualism, success, and the power of the people. A beggar can be a successful businessman, and we did adopt this mentality waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay before any other nation in Europe, except for maybe England and Scotland. The freeman was a self-thinking individual in Scandinavia before Cristoforo Colombo even had plans to sail across the world.

The Janteloven lives on only in the beginning of your life, which can be explained as a strive for equality. Equal schooling, equal opportunities. (BTW, how much do you pay for college if it's not a State one). Everyone has the right to succeed, and if you are "socially unpriviledged", like you like to say in the US, we are helping those on your feet. Success has never been frowned upon in Scandinavia, and if good you're good. The Janteloven lives on that you shouldn't boast on your success, that is considered bad behavior, but if you are successful and retain your sense of grace, fine! Like don't go asking for police escort as you are juuuuuuust so important, is nothing but despicable.

And we still are. After 5000 years cherishing freedom, we are proud to represent the countries with the most social mobility and freedom: Finland, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Iceland.

Why are we happy? Because we are. Never mind the climate. Good jobs, good social security, good prospects for the future, good education, working governments, uncorrupted police, working society, safety, stable lifestyle. What other countries can offer all this? NOT A SINGLE ONE! We are the best because we made our countries the best. We, the people did it!

OK, maybe Australia and New Zealand can, but the rest: no.

Last edited by Ariete; 08-06-2014 at 01:40 PM..
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