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Old 06-03-2014, 11:41 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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The Soviet Union is no more, but over 70 years of Soviet rule has left it's imprint on Russia and other SSR's. It seems from early on Soviet women played a pivotal role as 'comrades', whether filling roles such as engineers, policewoman, guards, mechanics, sometimes construction workers, and fighting as snipers, pilots.etc in the Second World War.

In China, many women joined the Communists and joined Mao on his Long March, fighting side by side. It was said that 'women hold up half the sky' and for all it's faults, it at least seemed to make women more equal, freeing them up with some of the stifling restrictions and institutions of traditional Chinese culture.

However, it seems in some ways things have also stalled or even moved back. A lot of Chinese and Russian women seem really materialistic, and focus on dolling themselves up to marry a rich husband. Many are considered 'leftover' if 27 and not married. Still, the fact you see more women working on construction, as engineers, and there's less chauvinism in China, sort of suggests in some ways it's actual LESS gendered than the West. Maybe Russia too to an extent.

Would you say Communism's attempt to make everyone equal (yet some 'more equal' than others, as Animal Farm puts it) has contributed to some gender equality in these countries?
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:21 AM
 
26,787 posts, read 22,549,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
The Soviet Union is no more, but over 70 years of Soviet rule has left it's imprint on Russia and other SSR's. It seems from early on Soviet women played a pivotal role as 'comrades', whether filling roles such as engineers, policewoman, guards, mechanics, sometimes construction workers, and fighting as snipers, pilots.etc in the Second World War.

In China, many women joined the Communists and joined Mao on his Long March, fighting side by side. It was said that 'women hold up half the sky' and for all it's faults, it at least seemed to make women more equal, freeing them up with some of the stifling restrictions and institutions of traditional Chinese culture.

However, it seems in some ways things have also stalled or even moved back. A lot of Chinese and Russian women seem really materialistic, and focus on dolling themselves up to marry a rich husband. Many are considered 'leftover' if 27 and not married. Still, the fact you see more women working on construction, as engineers, and there's less chauvinism in China, sort of suggests in some ways it's actual LESS gendered than the West. Maybe Russia too to an extent.

Would you say Communism's attempt to make everyone equal (yet some 'more equal' than others, as Animal Farm puts it) has contributed to some gender equality in these countries?
I don't know how/what it was in China, but I can express my opinion about women emancipation in the Soviet Union, comparably to what I've observed in the US. In the Soviet Union women emancipation was all - encompassing, whether women liked it or not ( because it was bringing a lot of responsibilities with it, keeping in mind that Russian culture ( that didn't go anywhere) is quite Orthodox, particularly when it comes to the lower layer of the society ( i.e. women were still expected to do the lion share in raising a family.) On another hand - since the state was stepping in in terms of children upbringing, guaranteeing everyone a job, a roof over their heads, public transportation, generous maternal leave and so on, women in the Soviet Union felt more independent from men, and in case of divorce children were going in mother's custody practically automatically and no one was arguing this case, because as I've said women were doing the lion share in children's upbringing anyway, and that was a cultural trait.
In the US women's emancipation ( as a lot of other things) is skin-deep, because it depends first of all on money situation. As long as woman has money, her independence from man is protected ( and so are her rights,) but the lower on the society's ladder you go, the more the emancipation becomes a questionable matter, therefore American society makes an impression that women of the upper class reaped the benefits the most, where the rest - not so much. Therefore my conclusion is such, that apparently deep down capitalism is not really compatible with women's emancipation (when it comes to the countries with Christian background in particular) where socialism is - be that Socialism European style, or Soviet style in particular.
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:28 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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I'm no expert but considering the amount of female fetus aborted annually in China,I'm not optimistic.
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:41 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
I'm no expert but considering the amount of female fetus aborted annually in China,I'm not optimistic.
Question; was it still a case during communist times?
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:51 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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Um I am not sure,but I think not,because there wasn't such thing as one child policy.
But by "not",I mean not as serious,because even in Taiwan,according to the official reports,there are about 4000 abortions performed annually because of the gender of the fetus.It's sick,but it's true,and it's in Taiwan,not China,quite shocking and sad tbh.A pathetic and rotten value of the Sinophone.
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Old 06-05-2014, 10:23 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,556 posts, read 20,801,597 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Um I am not sure,but I think not,because there wasn't such thing as one child policy.
But by "not",I mean not as serious,because even in Taiwan,according to the official reports,there are about 4000 abortions performed annually because of the gender of the fetus.It's sick,but it's true,and it's in Taiwan,not China,quite shocking and sad tbh.A pathetic and rotten value of the Sinophone.
4000 might sound like a lot but is that a lot when compared to total births?

I would think this sort of thing has largely declined in Taiwan, since it's more equal, including economically. Taiwan's birth-rate is already very low.
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Old 06-08-2014, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Taipei
8,864 posts, read 8,446,442 times
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Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
4000 might sound like a lot but is that a lot when compared to total births?

I would think this sort of thing has largely declined in Taiwan, since it's more equal, including economically. Taiwan's birth-rate is already very low.
Yeah Taiwan's birth rate is one of the lowest in the entire world,on par with Germany and Japan,which is like seriously the lowest.With such awful condition and environment,I think it's a smart move.

Anyway 4000 is approximately 4%.
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Old 06-08-2014, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,808,159 times
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From what I see in Finland, gender equality has taken a huge backlash in Russia. I think this is something of a reaction for the gender equality forced upon in the Soviet times. The Russian ladies here are really not even wanting to be equal, but let the husband control all finances and make the decisions, while the wife takes care of the home and her nails. And if it's bad here among Finnish-Russians, it's even worse in Russia. Heard stories about husbands beating up their wives and being quite OK with it etc.

From what I hear and see, the ladies in Russia are taking an ultra-feminine approach while the men keep their ultra-masculine approach. And correct me if I'm wrong, but a woman lawyer or something in Russia can still run into deep trouble just for being a woman.
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Old 06-08-2014, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,977,099 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
The Soviet Union is no more, but over 70 years of Soviet rule has left it's imprint on Russia and other SSR's. It seems from early on Soviet women played a pivotal role as 'comrades', whether filling roles such as engineers, policewoman, guards, mechanics, sometimes construction workers, and fighting as snipers, pilots.etc in the Second World War.

In China, many women joined the Communists and joined Mao on his Long March, fighting side by side. It was said that 'women hold up half the sky' and for all it's faults, it at least seemed to make women more equal, freeing them up with some of the stifling restrictions and institutions of traditional Chinese culture.

However, it seems in some ways things have also stalled or even moved back. A lot of Chinese and Russian women seem really materialistic, and focus on dolling themselves up to marry a rich husband. Many are considered 'leftover' if 27 and not married. Still, the fact you see more women working on construction, as engineers, and there's less chauvinism in China, sort of suggests in some ways it's actual LESS gendered than the West. Maybe Russia too to an extent.

Would you say Communism's attempt to make everyone equal (yet some 'more equal' than others, as Animal Farm puts it) has contributed to some gender equality in these countries?
In the USSR in the '60s, a majority of Soviet doctors were women, which seems great. But so were most heavy lifters, which is not so glamorous. Modern Russian women would like to be doctors, sure, but at the other end of the bottom-heavy spectrum, they'd still rather be pampered wives than loggers or coal miners. Women's lib and feminism cut both ways.

The other factor was, when Communism fell, Russia was taken over by an internal capitalist mafia, and you can be sure, the people who grabbed and ran Russia Inc. were men, because it required a predisposition to brutality, which men are good at, defying the myth of gender equality.

Last edited by jtur88; 06-08-2014 at 09:28 AM..
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Old 06-08-2014, 09:38 AM
 
3,423 posts, read 4,368,091 times
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You don't see women at the upper levels of Russian or Chinese business or government. Rarely, anyway. So women didn't see much social progress beyond access to the stereotypical "proletariat" type blue collar jobs.

Nowadays, more Chinese women are going to university and getting STEM-type jobs, yet, they are rarely in charge of anything.
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