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Old 11-07-2017, 08:11 PM
 
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Does anyone know where in the world engineers are treated best? Best pay, nice place to live, iron clad job secuirty, flexable working hours, etc. The USA is NOT it, at least not in my experience, engineers are just as subject to lay offs and forced moves as the rest of the population and are not treated very well considering the education, training and expereince required.


I am thinking it might be Germany but I am not certian. My wife does not want to move to a forign nation and we have alot of family support where we are now but if I outlive my wife I most certianly wont want to stay in the USA unless we have some sort of cultural revolution or something.


Learning a forign language is not a cake walk (and the pimsleur software is not cheap) so I am hoping others can fire up their soothsayer crystal balls and see what they can see.
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Old 11-07-2017, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
670 posts, read 179,609 times
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As an engineer, I’d like to know the answer to that as well.
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Old 11-07-2017, 09:43 PM
 
12,167 posts, read 10,907,796 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milky Way Resident View Post
As an engineer, Id like to know the answer to that as well.
You are not happy with the way things are ( in this respect) in AU ( or Canada)
?
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Old 11-07-2017, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Washington State
11,982 posts, read 6,047,797 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
Does anyone know where in the world engineers are treated best? Best pay, nice place to live, iron clad job secuirty, flexable working hours, etc. The USA is NOT it, at least not in my experience, engineers are just as subject to lay offs and forced moves as the rest of the population and are not treated very well considering the education, training and expereince required.


I am thinking it might be Germany but I am not certian. My wife does not want to move to a forign nation and we have alot of family support where we are now but if I outlive my wife I most certianly wont want to stay in the USA unless we have some sort of cultural revolution or something.


Learning a forign language is not a cake walk (and the pimsleur software is not cheap) so I am hoping others can fire up their soothsayer crystal balls and see what they can see.
Where I am now (Dubai) treats engineers pretty well. Having said that, western engineers are treated far better than engineers from Asia. Keep in mind that Americans are the only workers in Dubai that pay income taxes to their home country and UAE has no income tax so you are competing with Brits who pay no taxes and who have a lower pay scale than US engineers. China treats their engineers well except they pay them much less and work them longer than in the US.

Having worked all over the world, we have it pretty good in the USA so be careful about doing something rash.
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Old 11-07-2017, 11:31 PM
 
4,096 posts, read 1,548,061 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
Where I am now (Dubai) treats engineers pretty well. Having said that, western engineers are treated far better than engineers from Asia. Keep in mind that Americans are the only workers in Dubai that pay income taxes to their home country and UAE has no income tax so you are competing with Brits who pay no taxes and who have a lower pay scale than US engineers. China treats their engineers well except they pay them much less and work them longer than in the US.

Having worked all over the world, we have it pretty good in the USA so be careful about doing something rash.
Yea, I have no intention of moving to a hot arab nation, I was thinking more along the lines of Russia, Germany, etc. Also just as you have said I have heard there are issues with Briton's employment situation, maybe the brexit will help them but I have heard that its the same nightmare the issues the US faces (lay offs, job insecurity, so so pay, coupled with outragious residential real estate prices).


The USA is ok, but was also have an exorbant COL (namly, again, residential real estate prices, renting or buying) for most places in the USA that have engineering jobs.


I mean are we now down to living out of a 5th wheel trailer in order to build any sort of security so that you dont have to worry about the next reorganization or lay off? Is this now considered "pretty darn good"?


I am not trying to be contentious, I am simply hoping there is somewhere else where job security, family and home ownership is still valued by the middle class. That may not be the case anymore, anywhere, other than people willing to majorly roll the dice and deal with the fact that financial ruin is more probable than it used to be.


I just cant imagine everyone is happy with the increased probability for the prospects of potentially having to sell your home and uproot your entire family every time some company has a hicup. Has every single nation on earth accepted this.


I am also not talking about getting a US company job and doing some kind of temporary expat transfer but rather full blown moving else where and not paying the US taxes at all. Working in germany, russia, etc on a visa of course at first and then seeking citizenship if things are working out.
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Old 11-08-2017, 12:27 AM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
670 posts, read 179,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
You are not happy with the way things are ( in this respect) in AU ( or Canada)
?
No, its more a matter of curiosity since the OP asked the question.
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Old 11-08-2017, 12:34 AM
 
Location: Washington State
11,982 posts, read 6,047,797 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
Yea, I have no intention of moving to a hot arab nation, I was thinking more along the lines of Russia, Germany, etc. Also just as you have said I have heard there are issues with Briton's employment situation, maybe the brexit will help them but I have heard that its the same nightmare the issues the US faces (lay offs, job insecurity, so so pay, coupled with outragious residential real estate prices).


The USA is ok, but was also have an exorbant COL (namly, again, residential real estate prices, renting or buying) for most places in the USA that have engineering jobs.


I mean are we now down to living out of a 5th wheel trailer in order to build any sort of security so that you dont have to worry about the next reorganization or lay off? Is this now considered "pretty darn good"?


I am not trying to be contentious, I am simply hoping there is somewhere else where job security, family and home ownership is still valued by the middle class. That may not be the case anymore, anywhere, other than people willing to majorly roll the dice and deal with the fact that financial ruin is more probable than it used to be.


I just cant imagine everyone is happy with the increased probability for the prospects of potentially having to sell your home and uproot your entire family every time some company has a hicup. Has every single nation on earth accepted this.


I am also not talking about getting a US company job and doing some kind of temporary expat transfer but rather full blown moving else where and not paying the US taxes at all. Working in germany, russia, etc on a visa of course at first and then seeking citizenship if things are working out.
I accepted long ago that the only job security I have is being able to provide something someone wants/needs. I also saved heavily to protect against a layoff or downturn like we're now seeing in large scale industrial projects funded by oil and gas as well as mining.

By working internationally (iraq, Mongolia, China, Korea, Saudi, Peru, Kuwait, Russia) for a large engineering company, I've been able to put myself in position to stop working.
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Old 11-08-2017, 05:00 AM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
13,488 posts, read 16,170,944 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
Does anyone know where in the world engineers are treated best? Best pay, nice place to live, iron clad job secuirty, flexable working hours, etc. The USA is NOT it, at least not in my experience, engineers are just as subject to lay offs and forced moves as the rest of the population and are not treated very well considering the education, training and expereince required.
Try to get a job with the Federal Government. That is your best bet.

Then save/invest as much money as you can.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:08 AM
 
4,096 posts, read 1,548,061 times
Reputation: 2565
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
I accepted long ago that the only job security I have is being able to provide something someone wants/needs. I also saved heavily to protect against a layoff or downturn like we're now seeing in large scale industrial projects funded by oil and gas as well as mining.

By working internationally (iraq, Mongolia, China, Korea, Saudi, Peru, Kuwait, Russia) for a large engineering company, I've been able to put myself in position to stop working.
That is a good point, how did you go about identifying these opprotunities. I had a few of these offered to me but the pay was fairly paltry, certianly not stop working level of income. The contract shop I was at about 7 years ago wanted me to go to Lybia for 180k a year and I laughed and asked if they were serious, this was right before Lybia turned into a war zone. I know people that make 180k locally, I am certianly not going to a post war zone for 180k.


I mean how much money are we talking? Did you get to sort of pick and choose your over seas assignments? I would not mind Russia, Norway, Scottland, etc. I did not know that China had oil, or are you talking about their assets in indonesia area?


Also is it possible to get jobs in these places direct without relying on the blessing of the large engineering firm. How long did you have to do this to basicly retire early?
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:10 AM
 
4,096 posts, read 1,548,061 times
Reputation: 2565
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
Try to get a job with the Federal Government. That is your best bet.

Then save/invest as much money as you can.
I have been trying to do this since 2015 for my area, the pay is far to paltry in the fed govt to move for it, but if I could get say a GS9 roll in my town then combined with my wifes income and our family support it would be a good gig. But moving for it does not make sense and I know thats a detriment.


I suppose the pay in Germany probably is not all that either though .....
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